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Old 11-12-2023, 12:17 PM
 
Location: TEXAS
3,824 posts, read 1,380,351 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MissKate12 View Post
My friend, you are sorely confused. Read Jesus’ entire discourse in John 6. Pay special attention to verse 63. It seems you have the same physical mindset those disciples who left Jesus had. They thought He was actually referring to them eating His physical body and drinking His physical blood. Jesus, however corrected them.

60Therefore many of His disciples, when they heard this, said, “This is a hard saying; who can understand it?”

61When Jesus knew in Himself that His disciples complained about this, He said to them, “Does this offend you? 62What then if you should see the Son of Man ascend where He was before? 63It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.


The disciples missed the point of what Jesus was saying.

Did you catch what Jesus said? 63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

Like you, they didn’t understand that when Jesus referred to Himself as the bread of life, He was speaking of every word that would come out of His mouth. He wasn’t talking about physical bread.

“Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life. He who comes to Me shall never hunger, and he who believes in Me shall never thirst” (John 6:35).

Jesus didn’t say “my flesh” is of no avail but “the flesh.”
"The flesh” is a New Testament phrase that is often used to describe human nature apart from God’s grace (see Mark 14:38; Romans 8:1-14; 1 Corinthians 2:14-3:1).
What Jesus means is that without God’s grace, belief in the Eucharist is impossible - you're not going to get there by your 'senses' only, without this grace!
If his disciples are to believe his teaching, they must avail themselves to that grace, and the Faith that comes with it (Believing without seeing!).

We know he couldn’t have meant his flesh at Jn6:63, since he explained six times in verses 54-58 that his flesh would bring eternal life!!
Jesus wouldn’t contradict himself, as you would have us believe.
No thanks, I'll believe Jesus instead, as the apostles did, at the last supper, without question!

Last edited by CCCyou; 11-12-2023 at 01:24 PM..
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Old 11-12-2023, 05:07 PM
 
10,020 posts, read 4,960,550 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CCCyou View Post
Jesus didn’t say “my flesh” is of no avail but “the flesh.”
"The flesh” is a New Testament phrase that is often used to describe human nature apart from God’s grace (see Mark 14:38; Romans 8:1-14; 1 Corinthians 2:14-3:1).
What Jesus means is that without God’s grace, belief in the Eucharist is impossible - you're not going to get there by your 'senses' only, without this grace!
If his disciples are to believe his teaching, they must avail themselves to that grace, and the Faith that comes with it (Believing without seeing!).
We know he couldn’t have meant his flesh at Jn6:63, since he explained six times in verses 54-58 that his flesh would bring eternal life!!
Jesus wouldn’t contradict himself, as you would have us believe.
No thanks, I'll believe Jesus instead, as the apostles did, at the last supper, without question!
.... also I find the setting time frame for John chapter 6 takes place one year before the Last Supper.
Jesus as the Bread of Life would be superior to Manna because it would bring everlasting life even on Earth.
Thus, the people knew nothing about the Last Supper or for that matter knew nothing about the New Covenant contract.
A New Covenant made only for ones like those found at Luke 22:28-30; Daniel 7:18, 27.
They would have that first or earlier resurrection to Heaven as found at Rev. 20:6; 5:9-10; 2:10
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Old 11-20-2023, 01:34 PM
 
Location: TEXAS
3,824 posts, read 1,380,351 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
.... also I find the setting time frame for John chapter 6 takes place one year before the Last Supper.
Jesus as the Bread of Life would be superior to Manna because it would bring everlasting life even on Earth.
Thus, the people knew nothing about the Last Supper or for that matter knew nothing about the New Covenant contract.
A New Covenant made only for ones like those found at Luke 22:28-30; Daniel 7:18, 27.
They would have that first or earlier resurrection to Heaven as found at Rev. 20:6; 5:9-10; 2:10
In John 6, Jesus doesn’t give us any indication that he intends his audience to eat his flesh and drink his blood right then and there.
Rather, he speaks as if it’s something to be done at some later time, which fits with our interpretation that the Last Supper is that moment.

For example, he speaks in the future tense in John 6:51: “the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh” (v.51b).
The other times when he gives instructions about eating his flesh and drinking his blood, it’s hypothetical and general in nature:

“if anyone eats this bread, he will live forever” (v.51a)
“unless you eat the flesh of the Son of man and drink his blood” (v.53)
“he who eats my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me” (v.56)
“he who eats me will live because of me” (v.57)
“he who eats this bread [his flesh] will live forever” (v.58)


Contrast this with the Last Supper, where Jesus says, “Take, eat; this is my body” (Matt. 26:26).
Jesus promised to give the disciples his flesh and blood to eat and drink in John 6,
but at the Last Supper, he commands it to be done.

Since John 6 and The Last Supper are the only two instances where Jesus speaks of drinking his blood, we’re justified in saying the promise in John 6 is fulfilled at the Last Supper.
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