Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Reformed, why do ypu think you have to have a "label" to define your beliefs? I have found that thinking you have to have a religious label to define who you are to the world is the quickest way to confining yourself to a particular box that man made..
calvin doctrine grace only, called by god before the world was made, on mans side of life is SIN, then a wide river, then god, like christ says in john , i draw all my sheep unto me and keep them save, rom 8:32-nothing will remove us from christ, so from{ uk believer } of 25 years, relax, lets you nice believers in usa, start studying your bible, some things said on here is very child like, makes the cults strong, in thinking we dont trust our lord, if the lord, says he wiil never leave us our forsake us , thats it get out and get strong, how by sharing the truth , and the more you have to share the more you have to learn, of him, stop worrying about if saved or not are you reading the word, going to a good church, and not letting SIN slip in to our lifes to give satin , a hold, and bring doubt, and make you unsure of christ, come on christians join me , time is short, pray for my son in a mental hosiptal at present,due to taking hash, only for 9 months, but brothers and sisters in christ i pray for you all in usa, i have grown in my walk, in my 25 years, with teachers like, j macauther , and many more great men, in usa, get on to[ grace to you ],web site, and see what wonderful teaching from, him is at hand.love from me scottishfighter for our lord.
Last edited by george 57; 06-10-2008 at 09:32 AM..
Thank you all so much for your comments. Though this thread is only 2 pages long, it is amongst the simpler ones, where the ones who reply are kind in heart, gentle in spirit. I never adjusted my settings correctly on this forum and wasn't receiving emails that there were answers to this post so I thought no one had answered. I apologize, or I would have responded sooner. I am going to sit down later and study a bit deeper what you all wrote, and ponder the subject in general. Thanks again, for all who cared enough to lend an opinion or thought. God bless.
I am not sure about the Lutheran comment. I have been Lutheran all of my life (ELCA) and the Lutheran church holds very strongly to the concept of free will and the fact that though God does not make mistakes (as you said) we are human and humans do make mistakes. I am not sure of the website address, but you can take a test to see in which denomination your beliefs would best fit. Just do a google search for religious denomination test or something like that.
Calvin and Arminius et al were theologians, not apostles. I believe that a person should totally ignore what men have said about what the Bible "means" and read it through for themselves. The Bible is the written Word of God. Let it teach you. Men have their personal biases and agendas. Ignore them. Believe and trust only in God's Word.
I actually feel a bit sorry for those who in their journey to faith first went to Bible Colleges and Seminaries where they were indoctrinated with whatever denominations teachings, almost always at variance with the scriptures in some aspect. Only God's Word is trustworthy.
I think you need to read Mother Thersa 's book about times she even struggled with her faith. Remeber that christ was denied by his closest followers after the Roman arrested him.Christianity is a life long journey and is not easy because we are all sinners and none of us are perfect.Once you start to believe you are chosen and are specail you are conning yourself. You are and will be a struggling sinner as long as you are on this earth.In very church I have ever gone to the priest/pastor ask you to pray for the sins of the church itself because the church is made up of man.
Calvin and Arminius et al were theologians, not apostles. I believe that a person should totally ignore what men have said about what the Bible "means" and read it through for themselves. The Bible is the written Word of God. Let it teach you. Men have their personal biases and agendas. Ignore them. Believe and trust only in God's Word.
I actually feel a bit sorry for those who in their journey to faith first went to Bible Colleges and Seminaries where they were indoctrinated with whatever denominations teachings, almost always at variance with the scriptures in some aspect. Only God's Word is trustworthy.
Not that I don't agree with some of this post but isn't this how cults get started? People read their Bible and come up with crazy doctrine and then disregard Church history and wise men who have devoted there life to study. Not that these men are without error. I believe we should look at what men of faith taught and believe and compare it to the Word of God for sure. But, this is almost like saying we have nothing we can learn from men like Spurgeon, Edwards, Calvin, Bonhoffer, Brainerd, etc. and some of the modern great theologians like MacArthur, Piper, Sproul, and many others. A great deal can be learned from Church history and men who have spent 40+ years in ministry studying the Bible. I think to often we throw the baby out with the bath water here and say only read the Bible. Didn't Paul on his death bed in prison ask Timothy to bring the books(2 Timothy 4:9-13). Our final authority should be the Bible but don't say commentaries and great men of God can't provide help in being a persuer of Truth.
Hi all, I have a question that you may be able to help me with. I'm Protestant myself, and very avid "supporter" and believer in Reformed theology. Here's my question, but here are some facts:
1) I believe that one can think they are chosen for years and years and then turn away from God. I believe that if one turns their back on God (apostate), that they were most likely never really chosen to begin with, because otherwise, the scriptures on perserverence of saints wouldn't make sense.
In a way I agree with you but the whole concept of Calvinism is only part truth. The opposite is Arminianism and Arminius was Calvin's student - go figure.
I believe God chooses the lot of us as we are His creation. The concept that Calvinism espouses that some are destined (predetermined) to be vessels of dishonor and honor is taken out of context and forms an elitist concept. It is an easy theology to embrace as once one is already "saved", it really does not matter.
I do not think folk turn their backs on God but rather the system aka church. My HO is that folk dismiss stuff w/o really getting into the word for themselves and as a result are seen as apostate.
In spite of this even if we "turn our backs on God", He never turns His back on us.
Quote:
2) I believe that the statement "Can one lose their salvation?" is way too broad, because it depends on who the person is and whether they have turned their back on God or not. But if they have turned their back on God, I believe that they they can lose out on the promise of salvation.
The promise is NOT dependent on what we do or do not do. Salvation and even the faith in it are HS given gifts.
Quote:
3) I believe that true saints will never turn their back on God, so I do not believe in "free will", and this is strictly based on what I read in the Bible. I believe that once one's name is written in the book of life, they cannot be erased, because God does not make mistakes. Rev 20:15, "And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire."
I agree in part but that which goes into the LoF is not the man but his sins.
1Co 3:13 each one's work shall be revealed. For the Day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try each one's work as to what kind it is.
1Co 3:14 If anyone's work which he built remains, he shall receive a reward.
1Co 3:15 If anyone's work shall be burned up, he shall suffer loss. But he shall be saved, yet so as by fire.
Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and the unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, will have their part in the Lake burning with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.
IF the LoF awaits us all it will be for purging out. I am on the fence on this and for now I do not believe that there is a hell of any sorts as I do not believe we are resurrected sin and all. The wages of sin is death NOT eternal torment. Our works are judged, not our sins. If sin is judged then the the death of Jesus was in vain.
Quote:
4) I believe that an alternative lifestyle is a violation of scriptural commandment. I do not have anything at all against gay people, but I would not say that their salvation is up to me to determine. After all, the Bible speaks of sins I should not commit, and I cannot say I have adhered perfectly, so I am a great sinner myself. I do know, however, that some churches accept such lifestyles and do not judge. I would have to say I would accept them as well, and not judge them, because I, too, sin, and I go to God for forgiveness every day.
Joh 8:10 And bending back up, and seeing no one but the woman, Jesus said to her, Woman, where are the ones who accused you? Did not one give judgment against you?
Joh 8:11 And she said, No one, Lord. And Jesus said to her, Neither do I give judgment. Go, and sin no more.
Mat 7:1 Judge not, that you may not be judged.
Mat 7:2 For with whatever judgment you judge, you shall be judged; and with whatever measure you measure out, it shall be measured to you again.
Jesus was only judgemental of the religious/pious of the day and no one else - why should we be judgemental?
Quote:
5) I believe in the trinity.
I don't but that is not a show stopper.
Quote:
6) I do not believe in Universalism. I believe hell is eternal, as it says in the Bible. (ex, Jude 1:7 "..... set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire)
I do believe in the salvation of all but I can understand that folk cannot embrace this as it is a hard concept to grasp. Just like Unconditional Love.
Rom 5:8 But God commends His love toward us in that while we were yet sinners Christ died for us.
We do nothing worthy of salvation - salvation is a gift.
Quote:
What religion would I most likely be known as? Please note, though I believe in most aspects of Calvinism, I do not believe a lot of what Calvin did, so I would venture to say I am probably and most likely not a Calvinist. (?) I've researched many religions, but find a lot of things that don't match what I believe. For instance, I also do not believe it is my calling, or that I have been given a gift of speaking in tongues or delivering demons, or hands on healing. So the religions that do believe that they are called by God to perform such things would not be my chosen ones. I also do not believe there are modern day "apostles".
Any thoughts? What "religious denomination" do you think I would classify as? Did I provide enough info?
You will fail everytime you try and measure up to a system. Stay focused on Christ - He should be your foundation and NOT creeds of men.
This is my best attempt at a short answer but you raised many aspects which would require long discussions on their own.
As the old saying goes, you will never find a perfect church. The Ecclesia is not a denomination but the collective of all believers in spite of their varying beliefs. We all see through a glass darkly so it probably depends where you are at in your journey. Salvation is NOT an event IMO - it is a journey of discovery and revelation that is only possible through relationship with the Father and not merely belonging to a sect of Christendom. The full council of Christ (His teachings) is more than enough for all of us.
Blessings
Last edited by SeekerSA; 07-14-2008 at 03:34 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
