Trading one for another? (Gospel, churches, scripture, prayers)

[HotinAZ]

This may be a harsh topic for some, but it is something I must get off my mind.

This has to do with the dependent nature of mankind.

It starts off as children. We are dependent on our families, for food and clothing and shelter. We rely on them, because without them, we would surely die. Our parents are supposed to guide us on our journey of life, by giving us the needed tools on which to someday, grow up and live on our own, perhaps raising a family of our own. For Christians, this also includes a scriptural upbringing, teaching us the ways of the Lord. With me so far?

As adults we take what we have learned, and go with it. As we mature, we are less and less reliant upon our parents, and although we honor them, we become more and more independant. We then get our jobs, and move out beginning our lives. We marry, perhaps have children, and then proceed to raise them in a Godly way, teaching them what we have been taught.

But what happens if the person is NOT mature enough to ever grow up? What happens when the person is relying, instead of on the parents, on the government? Our government rewards bad behavior and bad upbringing ,by actually becoming the "new" parents of the immature. This may include welfare, housing, training, schooling, work, and etc. It causes them to be dependant on the government.

How does one maintain the role of provider, when they always suck on the nipple of a master? How does one do this as a Christian. What happens when instead of the government, they rely on other Christians, or the church? Remember, we are talking immature people. And there are a lot of these people who desire to use whatever they can, because of excuses and decisions they have made in their lives which bring them to this point.

Now I am not discounting charity. But I am questioning the motives of those to whom take, take, take, instead of offering to give even of their time, talents, or treasures. These leeches of society. They can and do do harm, because they take charity and use it as a gain. And if they do not get their charity, they then question the hearts and motives of the very people they are leeching off of? Questioning why they are "getting theirs" and even quoting scripture for their purpose.

I am astonished of this. We give out of the heart. We give cheerfully. But when the immature leech on this heartful charity, does it turn what was once a cheerful giver into a suspicious giver?

At what point in time do we cut them off of the nipple by which they feed? Paul reminds us that if we don't work, then we don't eat. I take this literally, as well as spiritually.

If we do not take in the Bread of Life daily, then will we ever be satisfied?
If we do not work to make it on our own, and rely soley on charity, will they ever also, ever be satisfied?

The gimmee generation of immature people will one day bankrupt everything from Christians, churches and our governments. It will cause the people's hearts which gives cheerfully into dark hearts wondering if their acts of charity even serve a purpose?

It is time to get to work, and quit making excuses of why we cannot work. Everyone can do something, anything, unless they are bedridden.

[Miss Blue]

I think the Lord was very wise to give us the scripture about not letting your right hand know what the left is doing when we give of our time, money and talents to all, not just other Christians..If we follow what He said we will not be judging whether or not one or another is worthy of our charity..That is Gods decision.

As far as how mature a person becomes? Each matures at a different pace..Some never..They remain children in the faith and Jesus said suffer the little children to come unto me and he also said we should have the faith of a child.
Because one never learns Greek or the ancient Hebrew language or is not given the gift of teaching, etc. does not distinguish maturity in Christ..

I have found that the ones that never mature according to some peoples standards are the most loving and plant the most good seeds..God did not give all of us the same abilities, the same gifts or the same level of intelligence, or the same physical or mental abilities..

Yes there are people who will take advantage of our system and of the goodness of other people but we cannot take away from the truly needy or the physically or mentally challenged because of the "bad apples"..Whether they are in society in general or the people who sit beside us on Sunday morning as we meet to worship Him..

In my opinion the so called "gimmee generation" will never bankrupt a follower of Christ...governments? Maybe, who knows? I always say choose your candidates very wisely and with a few prayers

[gabfest]

Originally Posted by Miss Blue

I think the Lord was very wise to give us the scripture about not letting your right hand know what the left is doing when we give of our time, money and talents to all, not just other Christians..If we follow what He said we will not be judging whether or not one or another is worthy of our charity..That is Gods decision.

As far as how mature a person becomes? Each matures at a different pace..Some never..They remain children in the faith and Jesus said suffer the little children to come unto me and he also said we should have the faith of a child.
Because one never learns Greek or the ancient Hebrew language or is not given the gift of teaching, etc. does not distinguish maturity in Christ..

I have found that the ones that never mature according to some peoples standards are the most loving and plant the most good seeds..God did not give all of us the same abilities, the same gifts or the same level of intelligence, or the same physical or mental abilities..

Yes there are people who will take advantage of our system and of the goodness of other people but we cannot take away from the truly needy or the physically or mentally challenged because of the "bad apples"..Whether they are in society in general or the people who sit beside us on Sunday morning as we meet to worship Him..

In my opinion the so called "gimmee generation" will never bankrupt a follower of Christ...governments? Maybe, who knows? I always say choose your candidates very wisely and with a few prayers

I'm with you Miss Blue.

[HotinAZ]

Originally Posted by Miss Blue

I think the Lord was very wise to give us the scripture about not letting your right hand know what the left is doing when we give of our time, money and talents to all, not just other Christians..If we follow what He said we will not be judging whether or not one or another is worthy of our charity..That is Gods decision.

As far as how mature a person becomes? Each matures at a different pace..Some never..They remain children in the faith and Jesus said suffer the little children to come unto me and he also said we should have the faith of a child.
Because one never learns Greek or the ancient Hebrew language or is not given the gift of teaching, etc. does not distinguish maturity in Christ..

I have found that the ones that never mature according to some peoples standards are the most loving and plant the most good seeds..God did not give all of us the same abilities, the same gifts or the same level of intelligence, or the same physical or mental abilities..

Yes there are people who will take advantage of our system and of the goodness of other people but we cannot take away from the truly needy or the physically or mentally challenged because of the "bad apples"..Whether they are in society in general or the people who sit beside us on Sunday morning as we meet to worship Him..

In my opinion the so called "gimmee generation" will never bankrupt a follower of Christ...governments? Maybe, who knows? I always say choose your candidates very wisely and with a few prayers

I kinda think maybe you have misunderstood me a bit.

I am talking about those who take charity and the kindness of others out of not a neccesity, but a "right". And then when they do not get this, they are anguished at those who did not give.

Yes, I did rant at those who take from the government, but only those who are capable of working and choose not to instead. The same people who take for granted the charity of the church, as well, who call themselves Christian.

Paul is extremely adament about charity, and how it is to be used, and what for. The people you referred to are who we are to help, as well as those who are downtrodden. But these, I am not talking about, nor am I talking about what the left hand is doing, or the right. I am talking about taking advantage of what the hands are doing, if you know what I mean.

[noland123]

As Chritians we are to give with a joyful heart as we don't worry about where the monies and donations go it is where can I keep giving should be the question,we know God will take care of the rest.

I feel for the immature types as in all probability they were given everthing they wanted as a child and if they are this way they tend to live on with their parents as long as they can,maybe getting part-time jobs here and there to have a little spending money. These are selfish people but they are this way because of their upbringing and are caught up in the gimme gimme world because they justify in their own mind they are entitled to it. When a parent gives a child everything they want and coddles them it says to this child I can't do anything on my own as I am useless and therefore the dependency.

We all need God as he will take care of our needs,we grow and mature in God as we learn more about Him,that is why it is important for us to spread the gospel especially the immature that may never heard of the Lord in their upbringing,so that they may not have to live off the dependency of parents or government.

[HotinAZ]

Originally Posted by noland123

As Chritians we are to give with a joyful heart as we don't worry about where the monies and donations go it is where can I keep giving should be the question,we know God will take care of the rest.

I feel for the immature types as in all probability they were given everthing they wanted as a child and if they are this way they tend to live on with their parents as long as they can,maybe getting part-time jobs here and there to have a little spending money. These are selfish people but they are this way because of their upbringing and are caught up in the gimme gimme world because they justify in their own mind they are entitled to it. When a parent gives a child everything they want and coddles them it says to this child I can't do anything on my own as I am useless and therefore the dependency.

We all need God as he will take care of our needs,we grow and mature in God as we learn more about Him,that is why it is important for us to spread the gospel especially the immature that may never heard of the Lord in their upbringing,so that they may not have to live off the dependency of parents or government.

Question though.

Would you still give, knowing the money you give is actually hurting another's ability to become mature? IOW, at what time does a person say no?

[gabfest]

Originally Posted by hotinaz

Question though.

Would you still give, knowing the money you give is actually hurting another's ability to become mature? Iow, at what time does a person say no?

wwjd?