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Does it really require 826 posts to admit that Hoboken is more Urban than Buckhead? Hoboken is more urban than 99.99% of the American cities, aside from maybe New York City. What on Earth are some of you thinking trying to refute that?
I will tell you...
Using the logic some people were using to defend Hoboken it would be more urban that NYC.
for example...
NYC: 27,000 sq mile
Hoboken: 32,000 sq mile
And I pointed that out that's why I said for an area that small pop. density is a craps shoot.
I think I restarted the arguement by saying that "there are some areas of Buckhead that are more urban than Hoboken, and much of the rest isn't". The reason I say that... is there are areas of Buckhead that are back to back high-rise skyscrappers which Hoboken does not have. From my experience the appox. 2 mile peachtree corridor is more urban than Hoboken. However the numbers get skewed for Buckhead when there are mansion real estates that are 5 acres and have 5 people living in them. Since there are no numbers, to my knowledge, that could deferenitate between the urban areas of Buckhead from the manions some posters and I put up pictures... pictures are worth a thousand words. But there were quickly dismissed by the density hawks who feels there is no other metric to compare cities.
Hoboken:
Buckhead:
I don't think that Atlanta posters have a problem saying that older northen cities are more urban like Chi, NY, San Fran (cities I have been to) but when people say that 99% of ATL is not urban because there are parking lots... that triggers a response.
Does it really require 826 posts to admit that Hoboken is more Urban than Buckhead? Hoboken is more urban than 99.99% of the American cities, aside from maybe New York City. What on Earth are some of you thinking trying to refute that?
This was never intended to be a is Hoboken more urban thread.
The OP didn't ask which city is more urban. He asked which city offers better urban living. Mombai India is more urban than Monaco France but I believe Monaco offers better urban living (if you can afford it) Just because people like yourself highjacked this thread and tried to make it into a statistical which city is more densely populated discussion doesn't mean we all have to accept that.
Tell me something. In real life when discussing with someone which city you like the best do you throw density stats at them are do you like a normal human being discuss things like housing, schools, stores, restaurants, bars, transportation, taxes etc etc ?
They just twist their definition of 'urban' to make it fit Atlanta. It doesn't fool any of us, but if it makes them feel better about their city--more power to 'em!
I would like to know if they truly believe all of the nonsense they spew, or if they are just extreme homers who will defend their city by any means necessary.
This was never intended to be a is Hoboken more urban thread.
Quote:
Which of these two offers better city life?
Access - To amenties (both excel)
Transportation - Both with multiple rail options etc.
Living
Walkability
Job Access
Where does it ask which city is more dense? The only way density may figure in is in walkability.
The OP didn't ask which city is more urban. He asked which city offers better urban living. Mombai India is more urban than Monaco France but I believe Monaco offers better urban living (if you can afford it) Just because people like yourself highjacked this thread and tried to make it into a statistical which city is more densely populated discussion doesn't mean we all have to accept that.
Tell me something. In real life when discussing with someone which city you like the best do you throw density stats at them are do you like a normal human being discuss things like housing, schools, stores, restaurants, bars, transportation, crime, taxes etc etc ?
-Hoboken has more bars per square mile than anywhere else in the nation.
-Hoboken is the "youngest" city in the nation (excluding college towns)
-It's Frank Sinatra's town they have a park and festivals in honor of him.
-Hoboken is the birthplace of American baseball
-Hoboken Terminal has lines that go into NYC, Jersey City, Newark Airport, Philly, The Shore, and everywhere else in between.
-Hobooken arguably the best views of the Manhattan Skyline
-Hoboken has it's own Taxi system
-The show "Cake Boss" (Carlo's Bakery) is in Hoboken.
-Hoboken has a park that acts like a beach (You can lay out in the sun under the NYC skyline)- This park is also rated amongst the top 10 Urban Parks in the US.
-You can stroll Wshington St- Rated amongst the top 10 "Great Streets in America 2010" (Great Places in America: Streets)
-Hoboken has a Museum that's all about the history Hoboken-- How about you go and check it out if you're really that clueless.
But yea, the reason why density is brought up so much is because all this is so accessible. Does Buckhead have one square mile that can stack up to all of this?
Just admit that density is key when determining what place is more urban- Especially if the difference is drastic.
Thank you thank you thank you. That was so much more interesting to known than x people per block x blocks per square mile so and so square feet of this that etc. etc.
I wish we could take the conversation in that direction. I'll hit you back with some more of what Buckhead has as well as how far you have to go to get to it all soon as I get the time.
Wow, what are you doing? I'm talking about your persistent out the blue comparison to Silver Spring. And since when are we talking about jersey city?
Since you feel hoboken is better than Buckhead what makes you think Buckhead is better comparison to Silver Spring and Silver Spring can't be compared to Hoboken?
Stop using New york and surrounding areas as a crutch, let Hoboken stand on its own two feet. If I plucked Silver Spring out of the D.C. area and placed it in the middle of nowhere it would be self sustaining, can you say the same thing about Hoboken even though its the epitome of city living?
While there is a thread of truth - for one i am the OP - and this is on access, meaning how close stuff is - Hoboken on this aspect is one of the best areas in the country bar none. And two Silver Spring in isolation does not exist without the broader DC area so no Silver Spring would not exist in it's current format without it's sorroundings, the exact same can be said for Hoboken and Buckhead, or any area of the country for that mater.
On Jobs - remember that hoboken has access to more jobs and good ones within 20 minutes than do the entire DC or Atlanta metro.
This was urbanity and access - both are areas where Hoboken excels. As do parts of Buckhead (is vast offering differnt living environments from urban to suburban) and does Silver Spring, though t me Silver Spring is more like newer sunbelt enclaves, not good or bad just to me don't seem as urban. That is is neither good nor bad, we all can choose where to live, work, and play...
I am the OP - and access means how close stuff is regardless of whether it exists in the confines or not
If that is the case the name of the thread should have been Northern New Jersey and New York City vs. the City of Atlanta and close in burbs. Not a catchy title but it's more true to the comparison you are trying to make which ofcourse would be no comparison worth even debating.
If that is the case the name of the thread should have been Northern New Jersey and New York City vs. the City of Atlanta and close in burbs. Not a catchy title but it's more true to the comparison you are trying to make which ofcourse would be no comparison worth even debating.
The thread was constructing because of comments in a location stating that Austin is better urban living than Hoboken which i found to be uniformed - that led to another comment on Buckhead in a Hoboken vs Austin thread which leads here.
The point was that Hoboken affords some of the most urban/city living avaible and a lifestyle there is about as urban/city like in the traditional sense as it gets in the US. Not that Buckhead soes not afford good urban living but I believe many people do not realize that hoboken (or jersey city for that matter) offer many of the best aspects of NYC without even being in the city itself and are closer to manhattan than most of NYC's boroughs from an access standpoint.
The thread was not made in ways to bash Buckhead - which is one of the most prominent city neighborhoods in the country but more to evidense that aspects of hoboken are at times misunderstood. Buckhead with the differnt living options, jobs, transportation and location is admirable in many senses and offers things that hoboken does not, in terms of city/urban living though to me it is more of the hybrid so while Buckhead truly excels relative to most other US locations on that particular living style hoboken is a pwerhouse and statement that Hoboken does not offer city living I found absurd... I actually also find a statement that there are no urban/city aspects to parts of Buckhead to be equally absurd even if it may not be in the traditional older city sense....
Using the logic some people were using to defend Hoboken it would be more urban that NYC.
for example...
NYC: 27,000 sq mile
Hoboken: 32,000 sq mile
Nobody is using that logic though. They state that it is over 1.2 square miles. NYC, particularly Manhattan has many areas of 1.2 square miles in 100k density.
So, again, no.
The logic often applied by some Atlanta posters is as followed however, and breaking it down will show why it doesn't work.
New York City is a mostly urban city.
New York City has lots of high rise development.
Atlanta has lots of high rise development.
Therefore, Atlanta is a mostly urban city.
^ This logic does not follow.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Galounger
This was never intended to be a is Hoboken more urban thread.
Where does it ask which city is more dense? The only way density may figure in is in walkability.
The OP didn't ask which city is more urban. He asked which city offers better urban living. Mombai India is more urban than Monaco France but I believe Monaco offers better urban living (if you can afford it) Just because people like yourself highjacked this thread and tried to make it into a statistical which city is more densely populated discussion doesn't mean we all have to accept that.
Tell me something. In real life when discussing with someone which city you like the best do you throw density stats at them are do you like a normal human being discuss things like housing, schools, stores, restaurants, bars, transportation, crime, taxes etc etc ?
The density also figures in with the access and living. There is no highjacking going on, its called objective statistics, instead of subjective opinions. I would absolutely discuss how dense something is because it is two different lifestyles one has, if you can't understand that, I am not sure what to tell you.
First of all, no one is saying Hoboken is more urban than NYC- Manhattan has square miles that are 150K+ PPSM. Some people just refuse to comprehend anything and make up lies such as that. It's the fact that if you were to limit Buckhead to any square, you'd have the majority neighborhood "cut off"- This is the IDEA of city living and access, when the majority of the other 79 square miles of Buckhead is cut off from the core (once you limit Buckhead to one square mile) Hoboken trumps the hell out of Buckhead- The Fact that people continue to limit Hoboken to its city proper and ignore the "Access" part of the thread says it all- In no way is Buckhead more urban and accessible than Hoboken.
No offense to Buckhead, I like it for what it is, and it beats Hoboken in other things, but not when it comes to city life and access. Hell if you wanted to be fair, and you know, not limit a place to one square mile- why not Buckhead Vs Brooklyn? BK has a similar population density and infrastructure as Hoboken, it's just a lot larger. (and still smaller in land size than Buckhead).. but oh nooo, that's not fair.
/ The thread.
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they have a park and festivals in honor of him.
