Need to get out of Arizona... but where to? Need suggestions (warning: long-winded). (live, best)
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I'm a 39 year old, single, college educated, childless, late bloomer (no help there from the great recession) male who just spent the last four years cultivating a great career opportunity that came up here in Scottsdale, Arizona. That's run its course: I gained a lot of experience & elevated my job title... but the company has hit some serious rough waters of late due to rampant mismanagement, so I've decided to move on to other opportunities... and honestly, outside of my career, I'm not having a great time living here.
Don't get me wrong, the cost of living is really low, the weather is sunny (I don't mind the summer heat at all), it's easy to get around especially if you live near your work, there's good food if you go looking for it, and Arizona is a great state to day trip around... but as a single guy looking for the right lady to move into that stage of life with, AND as a passionate musician who really misses being active creating within the artform & scene that I'm into, this place has been an abysmal experience. I've tried to keep a positive outlook and put myself out there in a variety of respects but the experiences have been substantially lacking. I mean I haven't had a date in well over two-and-a-half years, and haven't met one person really enthusiastic/interested in doing anything novel on the music front the entire time I've been here. I feel like I just need to take myself somewhere else. But where to?
A little background on me: I'm an industrial designer for a living (contracting at the moment) with a focus/experience in consumer products, and have done everything from R&D, graphic design, bidding/estimation, sales engineering, technical illustration/drafting, manufacturing management, music production, etc. in the past. My resume is a bit of a Swiss army knife. Outside of work, my hobbies center around the aforementioned musician/muso oriented stuff (writing/playing, producing), an interest in automobiles & motorsport (F1, WEC, MotoGP, high performance cars, green technology, and the like), an appreciator of cuisine and cooking, a fan of comedy, particularly stand up (edgier stuff), and design, art, new tech, modern architecture, & science in general. I have the mean$ and like to travel (and would like to do more with a partner), like hip, urban environs, like staying reasonably fit (mainly hitting the gym, I'm not super outdoorsy so far as exercise goes anyway), like coffee shops, art walks, and live music of course. I'm a secular guy, fairly progressive socially (though apolitical in general), a polymath, an ambivert, and don't really have much of a sense of nostalgia. That's the nutshell. Feel free to inquire about other details if it helps.
To avoid complication, I'm aiming to stay in the U.S. What cities am I a shoe-in for? I've got some ideas, but I'd love to hear some outside voices! My biggest constraint is staying in the sunbelt. I grew up in Upstate New York, and I spent a little over five years in Portland, Oregon. Brutal winters are not my thing, and while the cold was never unbearable, the gray, drizzly nonsense of the Pacific Northwest was the worst. The. Worst. Somewhere like Denver, on the other hand, is fine. My brother and his wife live up there and I've visited for weeks on end seven or eight times now, during the winter to boot. The snow/cold is completely tolerable, IMO, as it's sunshine like 300+ days there. So, my inclinations include:
1. Denver. Like I said, I've visited a number of times. Gentrification all over the place, i.e. cool, walkable neighborhoods. Great restaurants, gastropubs, coffee houses, music venues, etc. Lots of youthful energy. Music scene isn't crazy, but way better then Phoenix (it doesn't take much). Fairly progressive socially, but a good balance of commerce too. Endless fun destinations for day trips. But, I've heard the singles scene (for guys in particular) is total garbage there, and that scares the crap out of me, frankly. At this point I need any advantage I can get. Cost of living is climbing steadily as well from what I've heard. I really don't care about biking, skiing/snowboarding, etc. Pikes Peak hillclimb, tho.
2. Austin. Muso central. Doesn't matter what genre, you name it. SXSW. A bit like Portland in that respect. Pretty left leaning. Equally as gentrified (perhaps more so) than Denver. Heard it's foodie heaven (BBQ!). Heard the job market is pretty good as well. No idea on the dating scene. As a motorsport fan, COTA is the place in the U.S. for non-redneck racing. Can't beat that. Negatives? Technically it's in Texas... LOL. Humidity.
3. Big Florida cities. I don't know what to say here. It's the butt of endless jokes, but I've been down there a number of times over the years and I have a great time every time I go. I love Caribbean/Cuban/Latin food, I love traveling in the islands, I love sunny weather, I love the architecture, I love the ocean, my dad has a summer place in Daytona Beach, and I want to learn to sail. Florida cities always come up pretty high when lists of places for "singles" are the topic. Tampa Bay and Orlando are good cities so far as the rock/metal scenes go. Tampa seemed the more livable of the two when I visited last, and more affordable than Miami. Orlando seemed like a bit of a hole, TBH... and landlocked. Miami obviously has the most diversity to offer... but, I just can't get into the music scene there. It's big, granted, but all the wrong stuff with respect to my world. I really wish it wasn't. I'm quite into to hip hop actually, but Minneapolis is where it's at.
4. San Fransisco(?). Another place I love every time I visit. Another great music scene, particularly alternative/rock/metal. Known for it's design market (a lot of it is agency work, however). But cost of living is simply berserk. I'd have to be pulling down serious money to do it... and it's not worth being outside of S.F. proper. San Jose is a dorky sausage fest from what I've heard, and our engineering team lived/worked at an office on the peninsula there in-between. Way too domestic and banal for my tastes. I've heard the Berkley area might be an okay option from a good friend who came from the area. I don't know much about it. I've heard less than great things about the dating scene there as well.
5. Hotlanta(?). I really don't know anything about it other than a somewhat decent music/arts scene exists there. Love me some soul food. Heard traffic is a nightmare. ¯\(°_o)/¯
Well, that's all I've been able to come up with thus far. I'm hoping one might work for me... Might start looking into some other mid-sized areas: Savannah. San Antonio. Jacksonville. I'm really leaning towards bigger metros to have a wider swath of opportunities (career, romance, music, friends), though. I'm at a loss. It's a start I guess. Chime in if you got something. Thanks in advance.
I hear you about the lack of culture in Phoenix/Scottsdale.
-SF is astronomically expensive, terrible traffic, but will have good career opps, good music scene, creative scene
-Seattle has a tremendous job market, creative scene, walkable areas, gorgeous nature... but you don't like the winter gray. Although I've been in Seattle going on 4 yrs now and April-Oct is better weather than I thought (though Oct to mid March really does suck).
-Austin is good but it has really gone up in price and traffic is much worse. Has lost some of what made people love it in the 70s, 80s, 90s. Terribly hot summers. Winters are a mixed bag, with some really cold days.
-Atlanta is not too bad. If you can live in some of the areas with character like Little 5 Points, Decatur, VA Highlands. Very hot summers. Great airport. I don't think I could live there though.
-You won't like anywhere in FL. Has good weather 7-8 mos of year, but terrible hot & humid summers. Has little culture, the only even semi hip place would be Key West and that is too small and touristy. Flat as a pancake there too.
-Denver might be your best choice. Music scene is great especially there if you like jam bands, progressive bluegrass, alt-country. Red Rocks is probably the best outdoor music venue in the nation. EVERYONE plays there. Nice amount of sunshine. Denver in itself is not overly pretty IMO, feels more arid, not a lot of trees, brown in winter, no nice bodies of water, feels flat. But it has some cool neighborhoods and some distant views of the Rockies. Also greener in springs and summers.
You might also look at Raleigh/Durham NC too. I found it a little flat (it lacks the expansive vistas of the west...you just see trees, trees, trees in all directions wherever you go). You can access the beach in a few hours. Has 3 big universities giving it a little bit of progressive and creative vibe. My guess has a decent music scene. More winter sunshine than Seattle/Portland.
Also San Diego is also a place you might look at. It doesn't have quite as much of the cool walkable vibe of Portland, Seattle, Austin...but it's not nearly as empty and culture-less as wastelands like Phoenix/Scottsdale. It would be a huge upgrade from Phoenix/Scottsdale.
Dating scene may be better numbers wise on the Southeast cities (ATL, Raleigh). They call San Diego "Man Diego" because more guys than girls (and SoCal women are not my favorite...can be shallow types). SF Bay area is not a great dating scene for guys IMO, again more guys than gals. I have heard Denver ("Menver) is not great for guys either, balance tips in the ladies favor. Tech dominated cities are always guy heavy. And I personally fancy southern girls
I've always thought Austin was overrated. Hip Hop - Atlanta. Atlanta is a great hub. Almost in the middle of all the other Southern cities so a weekend roadtrip is easy. Great night life, music, and singles scene (I had fun).
Lots of good suggestions on this thread. OP, I think you are on the right track with your choices. I feel Denver would be a nice location for the reasons you mentioned, but there may be reason for concern. I understand its nickname is "menver." In any event, I think it's a great city. Nashville and Austin also are good options. The sleeper, in my opinion, would be the Raleigh/Durham area. Good economy, educated populace, decent music and arts scene and reasonable cost of living. By the way, I too am in the Phoenix/Scottsdale area. I agree with your assessment of the area and have enjoyed my time here, but am also looking to make a move.
The area isn't bad, it's just that I'm looking for something different, like you. Good luck.
You're arguably in the worst city in the state for culture except maybe Yuma is worse... Even Tucson, Sedona, Flagstaff have significantly more culture and in some ways better dating scenes. Tucson has more women than men, the reverse is true in Phoenix.
I get you still want a big city though.
San Francisco is like the antonym of the SUNbelt... Isn't there a saying that says something like, "The coldest I've ever been was a summer in San Francisco." ? Anyway, there are other sunnier areas in the Bay but if sun is what's important that's not where I would look.
I don't know why people are recommending Boise when it gets even colder than Denver, OP doesn't want that. I can't imagine Boise being better than Denver in the women department, in fact considering Denver is booming and Boise isn't, Boise should be worse. I feel like men overall in this nation are well-divided between small and big cities, women seem to be more concentrated to big cities.
I think Texas or Florida would fit OP well. Another Southern location with lots of warm weather, some of the most unique culture in the entire country especially in music, is NEW ORLEANS. Surprised that wasn't on your list. That's the first place I thought of before I saw your list.
You're arguably in the worst city in the state for culture except maybe Yuma is worse... Even Tucson, Sedona, Flagstaff have significantly more culture and in some ways better dating scenes. Tucson has more women than men, the reverse is true in Phoenix. I get you still want a big city though.
Yeah, I love going up to Prescott, Jerome, Sedona, etc. There's a lot of cool, artsy stuff to experience, sights to see. I heard Bisbee is cool too (my favorite comedian Doug Stanhope lives there)... but that said, they aren't exactly active, modern music scenes (Maynard James Keenan doesn't count). More like where aging artists and hippies go once they've got some money and just want to relax and ruminate.
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I don't know why people are recommending Boise when it gets even colder than Denver, OP doesn't want that. I can't imagine Boise being better than Denver in the women department, in fact considering Denver is booming and Boise isn't, Boise should be worse. I feel like men overall in this nation are well-divided between small and big cities, women seem to be more concentrated to big cities.
Boise is definitely not on the table. Too small. Too conservative. Too cold. There's a bit of a music scene there, but seems very "indie" from the digging that I've done.
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I think Texas or Florida would fit OP well. Another Southern location with lots of warm weather, some of the most unique culture in the entire country especially in music, is NEW ORLEANS. Surprised that wasn't on your list. That's the first place I thought of before I saw your list.
Yeah, New Orleans is an odd one that's crossed my mind, but I don't know what to think about it. I kinda picture it as the Detroit of the south, especially post Katrina. Seems like a lot of poverty, and not a very attractive job market to the corporate world. I could be completely wrong. The heavy music scene there is pretty prevalent, but it's a very blue collar, one-dimensional, garage-style vibe and I'm not so sure my contemporary sensibilities will snick in with the "Knock back some brews and jam." scene there. Don't get me wrong, I like me some sludge bands, but I'm cut more from more slick, modern, urban cloth, i.e.
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I've always thought Austin was overrated. Hip Hop - Atlanta. Atlanta is a great hub. Almost in the middle of all the other Southern cities so a weekend roadtrip is easy. Great night life, music, and singles scene (I had fun).
Interesting to hear. I'll have to dig a little deeper. Were you involved in music in ATL?
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Lots of good suggestions on this thread. OP, I think you are on the right track with your choices. I feel Denver would be a nice location for the reasons you mentioned, but there may be reason for concern. I understand its nickname is "menver." In any event, I think it's a great city. Nashville and Austin also are good options. The sleeper, in my opinion, would be the Raleigh/Durham area. Good economy, educated populace, decent music and arts scene and reasonable cost of living. By the way, I too am in the Phoenix/Scottsdale area. I agree with your assessment of the area and have enjoyed my time here, but am also looking to make a move.
Yeah, I do enjoy the contemporary, metropolitan vibe of Denver every time I visit. It's weird that no 20- or 30-something women want to move there with all there is to do so far as urban, suburban, and rural settings go. It seems like it has everything. Seasons (all relatively mild), food, entertainment, hip neighborhoods, shopping, sports, day trip destinations. Apparently, only guys like a balanced lifestyle... LOL! I'll have to read up a bit on Raleigh/Durham. Nashville's heavy/rock/metal scene there is notoriously weak from what I've read on forums. I think the country music hub reputation keeps those of us with our distortion knobs clocked up out.
Last edited by Mr_Polymath; 05-20-2016 at 02:46 PM..
New Orleans has some very nice areas and I love going there. You sound like you'd make enough money to afford the nicer parts of town, like the Garden District. Just like almost all the high-crime cities in this country they can be avoided. For an example you don't live in Southside Chicago, or East St. Louis. New Orleans is also just as concentrated with their crime to its Eastern edges I believe, can't remember what ward for the life of me.
NOLA is a thriving town, lots of people moving there and is beautiful. I think you need to check it out.
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Somewhere like Denver, on the other hand, is fine. My brother and his wife live up there and I've visited for weeks on end seven or eight times now, during the winter to boot. The snow/cold is completely tolerable, IMO, as it's sunshine like 300+ days there. So, my inclinations include:
At this point I need any advantage I can get. Cost of living is climbing steadily as well from what I've heard. I really don't care about biking, skiing/snowboarding, etc. Pikes Peak hillclimb, tho. 
I could be completely wrong. The heavy music scene there is pretty prevalent, but it's a very blue collar, one-dimensional, garage-style vibe and I'm not so sure my contemporary sensibilities will snick in with the "Knock back some brews and jam." scene there. Don't get me wrong, I like me some sludge bands, but I'm cut more from more slick, modern, urban cloth, i.e. 
