Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: Watching half my country turn into Gilead
3,530 posts, read 4,172,934 times
Reputation: 2925
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_General
I would say once you get past Tier 5 its a mixed bag. What do Syracuse and Bridgeport have that Worcester and Springfield don't?
Syracuse always has relevant national recognition, primarily due to its university's academics and athletics. Springfield and Worcester (especially Worcester) don't have anywhere close to the same national cache. Springfield is known for the birth of basketball and sharing its name with a bunch of other Springfields, including fictional ones, while Worcester, despite being New England's third largest city, is not well known by anyone outside of New England, let alone the entire Northeast. Most people can't even pronounce its name properly on first go.
I agree that my ranking got a little haphazard for Tier 6 and 7, but I wasn't trying to solely look at GDP, but all factors. I erroneously elevated Bridgeport, despite not having national name recognition like Hartford or New Haven do, because it's the largest city/metro in Connecticut's wealthiest and most populous county. Bridgeport should be in Tier 7 behind Worcester and ahead of Springfield. Harrisburg gets higher billing than Worcester and Springfield because it's the capital region of a larger and more powerful state, and has its own CSA (1.3 million too), something neither Worcester or Springfield can claim. I also see that I have Portland in two tiers--I mean for its placement as first in Tier 8 to be the accurate one.
Syracuse always has relevant national recognition, primarily due to its university's academics and athletics. Springfield and Worcester (especially Worcester) don't have anywhere close to the same national cache. Springfield is known for the birth of basketball and sharing its name with a bunch of other Springfields, including fictional ones, while Worcester, despite being New England's third largest city, is not well known by anyone outside of New England, let alone the entire Northeast. Most people can't even pronounce its name properly on first go.
I agree that my ranking got a little haphazard for Tier 6 and 7, but I wasn't trying to solely look at GDP, but all factors. I erroneously elevated Bridgeport, despite not having national name recognition like Hartford or New Haven do, because it's the largest city/metro in Connecticut's wealthiest and most populous county. Bridgeport should be in Tier 7 behind Worcester and ahead of Springfield. Harrisburg gets higher billing than Worcester and Springfield because it's the capital region of a larger and more powerful state, and has its own CSA (1.3 million too), something neither Worcester or Springfield can claim. I also see that I have Portland in two tiers--I mean for its placement as first in Tier 8 to be the accurate one.
Athletics is one thing but US News rankings say WPI, Clark and Holy Cross are in the same league as Syracuse. Worcester has a bigger GMP than Syracuse, so the 2nd arguement doesn't mesh with the 1st.
Athletics is one thing but US News rankings say WPI, Clark and Holy Cross are in the same league as Syracuse. Worcester has a bigger GMP than Syracuse, so the 2nd arguement doesn't mesh with the 1st.
I think notoriety is what he is referring to, as those Worcester colleges/universities are good, but likely do not have the same notoriety as Syracuse University due to athletics.
I think notoriety is what he is referring to, as those Worcester colleges/universities are good, but likely do not have the same notoriety as Syracuse University due to athletics.
People are probably more familiar with Auburn, Alabama than Rochester, NY but Rochester is in every way the more significant city.
Syracuse always has relevant national recognition, primarily due to its university's academics and athletics. Springfield and Worcester (especially Worcester) don't have anywhere close to the same national cache. Springfield is known for the birth of basketball and sharing its name with a bunch of other Springfields, including fictional ones, while Worcester, despite being New England's third largest city, is not well known by anyone outside of New England, let alone the entire Northeast. Most people can't even pronounce its name properly on first go.
I agree that my ranking got a little haphazard for Tier 6 and 7, but I wasn't trying to solely look at GDP, but all factors. I erroneously elevated Bridgeport, despite not having national name recognition like Hartford or New Haven do, because it's the largest city/metro in Connecticut's wealthiest and most populous county. Bridgeport should be in Tier 7 behind Worcester and ahead of Springfield. Harrisburg gets higher billing than Worcester and Springfield because it's the capital region of a larger and more powerful state, and has its own CSA (1.3 million too), something neither Worcester or Springfield can claim. I also see that I have Portland in two tiers--I mean for its placement as first in Tier 8 to be the accurate one.
worcester is the 2nd largest in n.e.
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_General
Athletics is one thing but US News rankings say WPI, Clark and Holy Cross are in the same league as Syracuse. Worcester has a bigger GMP than Syracuse, so the 2nd arguement doesn't mesh with the 1st.
clark and w.p.i. arent division-1; and i think holy-cross is in the patriot league while syracuse is in the big-east.
Location: Watching half my country turn into Gilead
3,530 posts, read 4,172,934 times
Reputation: 2925
Quote:
Originally Posted by The_General
Athletics is one thing but US News rankings say WPI, Clark and Holy Cross are in the same league as Syracuse. Worcester has a bigger GMP than Syracuse, so the 2nd arguement doesn't mesh with the 1st.
I'm not relying solely on GMP, though. I'm talking all factors. I erred earlier with Bridgeport's placement (as even Greenwich in the same county is probably more famous nationwide, due to the obscene wealth/blue blood stereotype), but Syracuse is easily far more well-known than Worcester or Springfield, fair or not. College athletics is big business, and the Orange, especially men's basketball, have put Syracuse on the map. It also doesn't help that Syracuse is located in the more populous state, and is the geographic center of that state. All of New York's major metros are within four hours of Syracuse, with most being within two (and Springfield and Worcester also lie within 4 hours). That's a huge advantage, in terms of prominence, which is a factor that cannot be dismissed when talking about tiers.
My metro of Wilmington, Delaware has a higher GMP than Allentown (larger city and metro), Harrisburg (larger metro with York), Trenton (larger city), Worcester (larger city and metro), Springfield (larger city), Portland, and Syracuse (larger city), but we don't have much national recognition outside of Joe Biden, crime and incorporation laws. That's because, except for Trenton, all of those other metros have some breathing room and are more stand-alone--even Springfield, which really should be united with Hartford already, but politics. Wilmington, on the other hand, lies 25 miles from the 2nd largest city proper on the East Coast, and is part of the 7 largest MSA and 8th largest CSA in the country. But we're still very under the radar for our output. GMP isn't everything.
I think notoriety is what he is referring to, as those Worcester colleges/universities are good, but likely do not have the same notoriety as Syracuse University due to athletics.
Yup.
Last edited by qworldorder; 10-02-2017 at 02:26 PM..
My metro of Wilmington, Delaware has a higher GMP than Allentown (larger city and metro), Harrisburg (larger metro with York), Trenton (larger city), Worcester (larger city and metro), Springfield (larger city), Portland, and Syracuse (larger city), but we don't have much national recognition outside of Joe Biden, crime and incorporation laws. That's because, except for Trenton, all of those other metros have some breathing room and are more stand-alone--even Springfield, which really should be united with Hartford already, but politics. Wilmington, on the other hand, lies 25 miles from the 2nd largest city proper on the East Coast, and is part of the 7 largest MSA and 8th largest CSA in the country. But we;re still very under the radar for our output. GMP isn't everything.
Inspired by the Southern City Tiers thread. I've personally been to half of what I consider to be the Top 20 Northeast cities...
Like some others, I don't consider DC or Baltimore to be totally Northeastern cities; however, I recognize the consensus opinion is that they both are and I'd agree that they are both more Northern-leaning than Southern-leaning, so they both are included here...
Also, while I of course recognize similarities that Pittsburgh, Buffalo, and Rochester have with the Great Lakes Midwest, I do not consider those cities Midwestern and I think the consensus follows that they are Northeastern cities...
Newark's inclusion is based upon the fact that it is more of a standalone city than Jersey City, which functions as an elite Manhattan suburb or "Manhattan west". Newark is the most prominent city in its own state, always has been, and has the influence, amenities, and infrastructure of being judged singularly...
Lastly, I believe we'd all agree New York is in a tier to itself, and the next three cities are all bunched, so I think the fun part if this thread is seeing how we all regard the other cities besides the Big 4...
Tier 1
New York
Tier 2
Washington, Philadelphia, Boston
Tier 3
Baltimore, Newark
Tier 4
Pittsburgh
Tier 5
Bridgeport, Hartford, Providence
Tier 6
Buffalo, Rochester, Albany
Tier 7
New Haven, Allentown, Worcester
Tier 8
Harrisburg, Syracuse, Trenton, Portland
I don't consider Baltimore or D.C. Northeastern, but outside of that, I mostly agree with your list. Although, I think I would move Pittsburgh to Tier 3 and would move Buffalo to Tier 4. Also, if you're including Baltimore/DC, then Wilmington definitely needs to be somewhere on the list.
I don't consider Baltimore or D.C. Northeastern, but outside of that, I mostly agree with your list. Although, I think I would move Pittsburgh to Tier 3 and would move Buffalo to Tier 4. Also, if you're including Baltimore/DC, then Wilmington definitely needs to be somewhere on the list.
I do agree Wilmington deserves to be on here, that was an erroneous omission from me! I'm almost positive that Baltimore and Pittsburgh belong in seperate tiers. Not sure where Newark belongs...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Parhe
The South isn't the same as the former CSA, unless your point is that Kentucky and Oklahoma aren't part of the South. Polls on CD show that most consider West Virginia a Southern state foremost.
I don't know what it is with people on this damn board lol. West Virginia is a southern state but that doesn't mean it doesn't have other characteristics. People on here have a SERIOUS "either/or" complex, as if life is confined to nearly drawn black lines...
Quote:
Originally Posted by qworldorder
Virginia, an unambiguously Southern state.
Only on City-Data is Virginia considered an "unambiguously southern state". In real life away from these message boards, especially amongst many denizens and citizens of the South, but even amongst many people who aren't from the South, Virginia is not considered a southern state. Most people don't consider it "the north", and neither do I, so I'll grant you that. Is it mostly southern? Sure. "Unambiguously" so? Lol, absolutely not...
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
