Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Location: Appalachian New York, Formerly Louisiana
4,409 posts, read 6,538,032 times
Reputation: 6253
Quote:
Originally Posted by btownboss4
If you've ever been along the Erie Canal is obvious why it's thrrr, it's pretty flat around it compared to the Ridge and Valley or Berkshires so it was just easier to travel with or without the Canal.
Not entirely true. The canal had to cut through hills at the Mohawk valley.
Nobody really robbed Detroit though; its downfall was due to a set of circumstances and choices mostly having to do with local leadership and choices made at the local level. It was primarily self-inflicted.
Yep .
And IMO, I'm not sure what you mean by "local," but leadership at the state and suburban levels also deserve some blame.
Sadly to say, Cincinnati cheated itself out of greatness during the first two years of the 20th century, then again some two decades later.
Unbeknownst to most people, both Henry Ford and J.W. Packard came to Cincinnati in 1901-1902 to secure capital with which to make their new inventions, while also needing to secure patents owned by the city's carriage manufacturers for the construction of auto bodies. Since Cincinnati was the center of this trade, Ford and Packard hoped to persuade executives of the larger plants to finance the manufacture of engines while other carriage makers build the bodies. Although repeated efforts were made to obtain this capital, they failed. Needless to say, both men moved on to Detroit.
Had Cincinnati embraced such emerging production of automobiles and Ford's revolutionary introduction of the assembly line into American manufacturing, the city's Mill Creek Valley would have become exponentially more industrialized than it is today. Added to this, had Cincinnati completed its subway system begun in 1916, the core city plus inner suburbs would have been transformed into something very different and far more dynamic than they are now.
In short, we're talking about nothing less than a world class city along the Ohio River.
Interesting history. I had no idea Ford and Packard attempted to start up in Cincy. Obviously it would have been a game changer for Cincinnati had the established there... Certainly, too, was the failure to finish the partially built subway. Cincinnati could have been Boston-like if they had -- after all, the constructed portions of Cincy's subway were contemporary with, and similar architecture to Boston's T Red Line.
Interesting history. I had no idea Ford and Packard attempted to start up in Cincy. Obviously it would have been a game changer for Cincinnati had the established there... Certainly, too, was the failure to finish the partially built subway. Cincinnati could have been Boston-like if they had -- after all, the constructed portions of Cincy's subway were contemporary with, and similar architecture to Boston's T Red Line.
Ford also scouted Buffalo prior to building in Detroit in the early 1900s, but city fathers wouldn't provide any incentives so he built elsewhere. Buffalo, at the time, was home to several auto manufacturers, the largest being Pierce-Arrow (eventually bought by Studebaker) that built luxury cars thru the 1930s, which was the last Buffalo based car company to fizzle out. It missed its opportunity to be the "Detroit" of autos.
It did (and does), however, still have a significant role in manufacturing with major Ford, GM, and suppliers located in area. Ford also did have assembly plants located in several locations thru most of the 20th century. VW in the 1970s was to build their first North American plant in the US to build its Beetle replacement (the Rabbit and the "Thing") but sales never met that of the Beetle so the plan was scrapped.
Other "lost" opportunities but not necessarily "cheated" include:
- loss of aerospace to the Sun Belt - X-1 was designed and built in Buffalo (first supersonic vehicle) by Bell Aerospace - but company eventually moved manufacturing to Texas due to a deal in Congress that awarded a V-22 contract on the condition that manufacturing be moved to Ft. Worth (at the expense of WNY - OK, maybe this was was cheated) - other major manufacturers had been moving HQ and production out of Buffalo since WW2, the largest being Curtis-Wright.
- opening of St. Lawrence Seaway - this was supposed to make Buffalo Harbor, among the busiest ports in the world thru much of the 19th and easy 20th centuries, into a "world" port but instead it was now able to be bypassed by the Welland Canal as goods no longer had to be offloaded in Buffalo for transfer to rail/roads
- loss of United Nations - an early proposal for the UN to be located on Navy Island, adjacent to Grand Island, was not taken and NY was selected
- loss of Disney World - Niagara Falls was heavily considered as a location for Disney prior to Florida being selected, due to its proximity to an already major international tourist location, and to the tens of millions of customers in the Northeast, Midwest and Canada - it was eventually not selected as Disney decided a year-round outdoor location was preferable
- de-industrialization, consolidation, legacy properties - once home to the 2nd largest steel plant in the world, along with several others, left a legacy of pollution and lost jobs. Although Buffalo is the terminus of major natural gas and oil pipelines, local refineries were closed in the 70s and 80s. Major companies headquartered in Buffalo eventually moved, such as Trico which moved its 6 plants and 5000 jobs to Mexico in the 90s, or Motorola in the 00s.
One poster, in another forum, said it a nutshell: Toronto, the city Cleveland should have been.
Cleveland was cheated by corruption and stiff competition by Detroit, Chicago, and Toronto. Now, Cleveland has slid down so much that it has been eclipsed by Columbus, Cincinnati, and soon to be Indianapolis and Nashville. Cleveland will continue to slide down if nothing is done.
Cleveland was cheated by corruption and stiff competition by Detroit, Chicago, and Toronto. Now, Cleveland has slid down so much that it has been eclipsed by Columbus, Cincinnati, and soon to be Indianapolis and Nashville. Cleveland will continue to slide down if nothing is done.
You haven't actually been cheated out of anything if you have corrupt leadership and you're not keeping up with your peers. Those are self-inflicted problems.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
