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Raleigh is very much a southern city to this day. Yes the city/region is growing rapidly, but I don't think the culture of the people moving in will supplant the people who have already been there. The elements that make the place southern are still there, so northerners are more so embracing southern culture than making the city more northern.
Raleigh is very much a southern city to this day. Yes the city/region is growing rapidly, but I don't think the culture of the people moving in will supplant the people who have already been there. The elements that make the place southern are still there, so northerners are more so embracing southern culture than making the city more northern.
It’s not just growth, but quality of growth. Ppl in Raleigh aren’t as *southern* as people in Charlotte.
Raleigh is small, but its like Boulder, Colorado small. The universities account for this imo
I'm a bit taken aback to hear such a question coming from you. Your use of quotations leads me to believe you may be unaware of the postbellum New South philosophy that was championed by Atlanta's own Henry W. Grady: Henry Grady and the New South
Surely you're not implying that Atlanta doesn't qualify as a New South city due to the presence and legacy of racism in the South in particular and American society at large, both historically and contemporarily?
I’m simply implying that Atlanta has been one of the most important cities in the south for most of the nations history. When I think of new south I think newly emergent.
Yes, I’m probably using the term to mean something else, when I think of new south I think progressive values, intellectualism and non-religiosity (Which isn’t to say atheistic).
Quote:
Originally Posted by gladhands
I’m simply implying that Atlanta has been one of the most important cities in the south for most of the nations history. When I think of new south I think newly emergent.
Interesting perspectives here. There's truth to both of them although they don't fully encapsulate the meaning of "New South."
It's easy to see how the term has evolved since it was first coined, although the original meaning still lies at the heart of the more contemporary meaning of the term. Originally the term had to do with shifting away from a more agrarian-based economy to a more industrialized one in the South after the Civil War had ravaged the region and its dependence on slave labor. Then the term seemed to take on more sociocultural and political connotations in the aftermath of the Civil Rights movement and the New South was seen as rejecting the values upon which the Old South tested and visibly embracing racial progress along with greater economic prosperity. Today, the term seems to have become synonymous with increasingly liberal/progressive cities (and at least some of their suburbs) with booming economies. Atlanta and Charlotte (to a lesser degree) encapsulate all three versions. Raleigh encapsulates the second version probably less than it is given credit for (Raleigh actually elected its first Black mayor before Atlanta, but Atlanta's took office earlier) and certain makes a strong showing in the third category.
Although I don't think we should so tightly correlate New South ideology and Northern influence, it's pretty much a given that if a Southern locale is affluent and left of center/heavily liberal, it has experienced a large influx of Northerners over the years.
Interesting perspectives here. There's truth to both of them although they don't fully encapsulate the meaning of "New South."
It's easy to see how the term has evolved since it was first coined, although the original meaning still lies at the heart of the more contemporary meaning of the term. Originally the term had to do with shifting away from a more agrarian-based economy to a more industrialized one in the South after the Civil War had ravaged the region and its dependence on slave labor. Then the term seemed to take on more sociocultural and political connotations in the aftermath of the Civil Rights movement and the New South was seen as rejecting the values upon which the Old South tested and visibly embracing racial progress along with greater economic prosperity. Today, the term seems to have become synonymous with increasingly liberal/progressive cities (and at least some of their suburbs) with booming economies. Atlanta and Charlotte (to a lesser degree) encapsulate all three versions. Raleigh encapsulates the second version probably less than it is given credit for (Raleigh actually elected its first Black mayor before Atlanta, but Atlanta's took office earlier) and certain makes a strong showing in the third category.
Although I don't think we should so tightly correlate New South ideology and Northern influence, it's pretty much a given that if a Southern locale is affluent and left of center/heavily liberal, it has experienced a large influx of Northerners over the years.
Is it specifically northerners or is it people from other regions in general?
It’s not just growth, but quality of growth. Ppl in Raleigh aren’t as *southern* as people in Charlotte.
Raleigh is small, but its like Boulder, Colorado small. The universities account for this imo
That’s dumb and not accurate if you’re talking about the cities. Charlotte is arguably less conservative than Raleigh. Raleigh is a little more southern charm.
If you mean overall metro areas, then yes. Raleigh-Durham CSA is beyond less honky Tonk than the Charlotte CSA
That’s dumb and not accurate if you’re talking about the cities. Charlotte is arguably less conservative than Raleigh. Raleigh is a little more southern charm.
Hmmm...how so? I can see an argument for Charlotte being a bit more Southern and conservative (although not a conservative city overall). Religion, particularly Protestant evangelicalism and certain Black denominations, has historically played a bigger role in Charlotte throughout its history than Raleigh and higher education has historically played a bigger role in Raleigh's history than Charlotte's. Also Charlotte has always been more of a regional hub than Raleigh, attracting folks from throughout the Carolinas for a better life and it still continues even though Charlotte now seems to get just as many or even a bit more transplants from other regions. And some of the industries that help drive the Charlotte area's economy are known to be somewhat conservative such as banking and NASCAR. Charlotte is the home of Bojangles, an undoubtedly Southern brand. But for what it's worth, Raleigh seems to embrace BBQ more than Charlotte.
But yes, the Durham-Chapel Hill part of the region is recognized as being more liberal than the Raleigh side.
Hmmm...how so? I can see an argument for Charlotte being a bit more Southern and conservative (although not a conservative city overall). Religion, particularly Protestant evangelicalism and certain Black denominations, has historically played a bigger role in Charlotte throughout its history than Raleigh and higher education has historically played a bigger role in Raleigh's history than Charlotte's. Also Charlotte has always been more of a regional hub than Raleigh, attracting folks from throughout the Carolinas for a better life and it still continues even though Charlotte now seems to get just as many or even a bit more transplants from other regions. And some of the industries that help drive the Charlotte area's economy are known to be somewhat conservative such as banking and NASCAR. Charlotte is the home of Bojangles, an undoubtedly Southern brand. But for what it's worth, Raleigh seems to embrace BBQ more than Charlotte.
But yes, the Durham-Chapel Hill part of the region is recognized as being more liberal than the Raleigh side.
The city of Raleigh has pretty much ALWAYS been a magnet for all of eastern NC, an area I've seen many of you call "Deep South" on here. I noted Raleigh's connection to DC and NY as it was relevant to the thread, but Raleigh's connection to eastern North Carolina is deeper and more strongly woven into its culture. And I'm talking the entire eastern NC, from the Lumberton-to-Wilmington areas, to the Wilson-to-Kinston, to Rocky Mount-to-Greenville, to New Bern, to the Fayetteville metro--mention Raleigh to the locals, listen to how they speak of Raleigh, it will seem as if everyone has a family member in Raleigh. Better yet, hang out around the locals in Raleigh (not the transplanted crowd who could be from anywhere, or in the university areas, but in the established city neighborhoods), you start meeting people who are from some wayward town in ENC...
Raleigh is THE city to ENC; there is a smattering of small towns and counties in ENC connected to Raleigh. We're literally talking ~1.5-2 million people in a classically southern region. This is not an opinion statement...
I've always disagreed with the assertion of ENC as Deep South, only because my application of that term is different, but there is no doubt that area is 100% southern, and if one acknowledges the southern nature of ENC, coupled with the knowledge that its connectivity to Raleigh supersedes DC and NY by a very long time...everybody doesn't know this, but most people familiar with Raleigh would...
This is to say nothing of the draw into Raleigh from Southside VA and The Triad, both areas where Raleigh has a considerable influence and has significant interchange with. I can't count how many ENCers or people from The Triad, two completely southern regions, I've known who have lived in Raleigh at some point or other. I can't begin to describe in depth how tightly wound Raleigh is to the whole of ENC. I don't know how much 'more' that connection stands over DC and NY today, but it certainly isn't a lesser interchange. Greenville, Rocky Mount, and Fayetteville in particular, plenty of flow with Raleigh...
People get so caught up in this northern image of Raleigh lol. It has been influenced by northerners surely, particularly from DC and NY. But as I've said for, I don't know, seven years now, Raleigh's southern characteristics can't escape you unless you are intentionally denying its presence. It's not as if Raleigh's southern qualities are an underbelly or undertone--it's highly visible...
Now, I don't know that I'd call either Charlotte or Raleigh more southern than the other. They're the same city in many regards, another unpopular opinion I've held for many years here. Charlotte has its share of New Yorkers for sure, but less than Raleigh, but definitely has a larger pool of eastern Midwesterners than Raleigh, particularly Ohioans and Michiganders. So the northern influence does seem stronger in Raleigh, but at least for me, that doesn't necessarily mean the southern vibe is lesser...
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