Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
No suburb of Raleigh resembles a Pittsburgh suburb, have you even been to Pgh? Can you give more clarity on a Pgh resemblance besides people from Pgh?
I’m sorry you were confused, but I was strictly talking about the people. There are only so many conversations I can feign interest about Sid at work. And I could navigate Mount Lebanon I’ve heard it discussed so much. Pittsburghers are everywhere down here.
It is Rawlee/Derm and not even close primarily due to scale. All 3 are proper candidates but here's the rub. Atlanta is an international city that serves as the defacto capital of the south. A regional/national hub and centerpiece of the cultural south with a large volume of transplants from all over the US and world. On a smaller scale, Charlotte has similar characteristics and mimics Atlanta in many ways, though it doesn't have the educational institution proliferation and historical prominence of Atlanta. It's a wannabee, not in the negative sense but rather aspires to have that notoriety, and able to make it's mark not being the state's capital, historically or nationally well-known.
Then there's Mayberry RFD Rawlee (stick with me here, Raleigh the city, not RDU).. the essence of Tobacco Road. I mean to be real about it, Raleigh not long ago had about the same population as Greensboro (circa 1970). And actually I think the Triads metro population was larger than the Triangle at that time (The CSA splitting of both the Triad and Triangle MSA's didn't come about till later on). Raleigh wasn't even served by an interstate until the extension of I-40 in the 1980s. Durham had I-85 and I-95 bypasses Raleigh 25 miles east of the city.
RTP lead by IBM totally transformed the area given the 10s of thousands of transplants that date back to the 60s/70s/80s. Someone mentioned Eastern NC migration which is absolutely true. However, this novel trend came about after the RTP got vouched by IBM as a legitimate workforce player. IBM spearheaded a massive invasion from the Kingston, Poughkeepsie, etc area. Folks who didn't need the big city to satisfy their QOL, ready to get the hell of there and head to hickville for the lower cost of living, slower-paced lifestyle and warmer weather to boot.
The RTP/IBM relationship paved the way many other industries which led to career opportunities for Eastern NCers in the 80s, 90s to date. Prior to that, most Eastern North Carolinians migrated to Northeastern metros (primarily DC) for career moves, even after attending school in the Triad or Triangle. Keep in perspective that the action was I-95 North...DC, etc. Atlanta? All I knew about it was a big city in the south and they had the Braves. First visit to Atlanta was in 1990s...post collegiate years and I grew up in eastern NC. And Charlotte had Carowinds, that's it.
So, in terms of overall northern influence on a southern metro with respect to scale, culture and concentration, it is hands-down Raleigh/Durham. Neither Charlotte nor Atlanta has a city comparable to Cary, NC with respect to a city being completely engulfed and dominated by a specific culture. To the dismay and chagrin of many natives. Not to say it hasn't happened to an extent, for example, Alpharetta, GA or Concord, NC and other parts of those great metros. It just isn't readily apparent like what happened in RDU due to the scale of the transformation.
BTW, since then, I have lived in Charlotte and made numerous trips to Atlanta to hangout, work etc. I am very familiar with both metros now....still my vote on this one if interpreting the poll correctly is RDU.
This is a good post and you make a great point about concerning Raleigh's economic evolution. Seeing as though it never became a manufacturing center, a transportation hub, or a hub of one of NC's legacy industries (it only had a handful of textile mills), it never had an industrial phase of development which would have made it more of a regional blue-collar employment center like Charlotte and Atlanta were before transitioning to more professional, white-collar economies with large corporate headquarters and operations. Also Charlotte and Atlanta benefited from their more central locations--Atlanta being central to the Southeast and Charlotte being central to the Carolinas--which made them magnets for transplants throughout the region well before they became magnets for transplants from the North. Raleigh seems to have been more of a retail hub and go-to city for general "stuff to do" for Eastern NC before the IBM/RTP boom. So basically this means that there's a greater chance that the average transplant in the Triangle is going to be from somewhere up North compared to Atlanta and Charlotte where there's an equal chance that the average transplant will be from elsewhere in the South or the Carolinas, respectively. On top of that, Atlanta and Charlotte have more buzz as cities for things other than jobs which helps to draw more visitors and transplants from their surrounding areas.
The West Coast influence is probably just as strong as the NY influence in Atlanta for that matter.
Uh, no. Although in recent years there's been more interchange between Atlanta and LA specifically due to the burgeoning TV/film industry in Atlanta, Atlanta's status as a major "Reverse Migration"/North-to-South destination goes back much farther. You also have to consider Atlanta's status as a popular relocation destination for Black Northerners in particular.
Uh, no. Although in recent years there's been more interchange between Atlanta and LA specifically due to the burgeoning TV/film industry in Atlanta, Atlanta's status as a major "Reverse Migration"/North-to-South destination goes back much farther. You also have to consider Atlanta's status as a popular relocation destination for Black Northerners in particular.
The West Coast influence is probably just as strong as the NY influence in Atlanta for that matter.
Nope, not outside of the entertainment industry...I used to live in Atlanta and Los Angeles, and most transplants in ATL who didn't migrate there from the South tend to be either from NY, NJ, Michigan, Ohio, or Pennsylvania. West coasters were way more down the scale in comparison. Californians in particular really don't go further East than Texas when they relocate to the south (there are historical ties between both states). Also, West Coast chains don't really seem to last very long in Atlanta compared to other metros where they expand, particularly in Texas. Don't get me wrong, there are ex-West Coasters who call ATL home, but they're pretty small in comparison to the amount of Northeasterners and Midwesterners who have migrated to the ATL area over the last 40-50 years, not to mention the southern transplants from other states. But when I lived in Los Angeles, Atlanta was not on the radar for many people. Too far East, and too "southern" for the average Southern Californian. While I know SoCal is not representative of the entire West Coast, but the most significant population center on that end of the country, and the amount of Californians I met in ATL were nowhere near the level of the other regions.
As for this, Raleigh. It fascinates me how the city was essentially off the beaten path in many ways and Greensboro was the #2 city in NC for many years as recently as 1980, and then Raleigh exploded in growth, so the number of northern transplants definitely have more of an impact than CLT or ATL, which tended to be more balanced in terms of northerners and southerners who've relocated to those cities. Big Aristotle definitely broke it down in his excellent post as to why.
Raleigh seems to have been more of a retail hub and go-to city for general "stuff to do" for Eastern NC before the IBM/RTP boom.
While it was true back then as it is today that Raleigh was/is the go-to city for many in Eastern NC, it was more purposefully a state government and university town before the IBM/RTP boom.
Speaking of IBM, the story/"legend" goes that an intern at the IBM site in Raleigh proper wrote to IBM and started the conversation about IBM opening its new plant in the fledgling RTP instead of NOVA in the 60s. In many, many ways, Raleigh is the town that IBM built. Even after opening their facility in RTP, Raleigh received the lion's share of transplants from Poughkeepsie, Binghamton, Armonk, etc. This was partially due to the fact that the legacy IBMers were already living in Raleigh, and new arrivals followed in their footsteps. Given how many IBMers came and how small Raleigh was back then, these transplants and others that followed in their footsteps (Nortel/Burroughs Wellcome, etc.) had an oversized impact on the culture and direction of the city as they came in huge numbers from the 60s through the 80s. Today, many Raleigh "native" adults are first generation Raleighites born of these transferees, and they grew up culturally somewhere in between generational locals and those who transferred primarily from the Northeast. In turn, the same dynamic changed the locals in Raleigh as well, as subsequent generations lost their drawls. There have even been academic papers written and videos recorded about how Raleigh has lost its native accent over a relatively short time period.
And before replies try to pile on me and dispute this, I am not talking about ALL locals, and ALL Northeasterners, rather the strong general cultural shift.
Nope, not outside of the entertainment industry...I used to live in Atlanta and Los Angeles, and most transplants in ATL who didn't migrate there from the South tend to be either from NY, NJ, Michigan, Ohio, or Pennsylvania. West coasters were way more down the scale in comparison. Californians in particular really don't go further East than Texas when they relocate to the south (there are historical ties between both states). Also, West Coast chains don't really seem to last very long in Atlanta compared to other metros where they expand, particularly in Texas. Don't get me wrong, there are ex-West Coasters who call ATL home, but they're pretty small in comparison to the amount of Northeasterners and Midwesterners who have migrated to the ATL area over the last 40-50 years, not to mention the southern transplants from other states. But when I lived in Los Angeles, Atlanta was not on the radar for many people. Too far East, and too "southern" for the average Southern Californian. While I know SoCal is not representative of the entire West Coast, but the most significant population center on that end of the country, and the amount of Californians I met in ATL were nowhere near the level of the other regions.
As for this, Raleigh. It fascinates me how the city was essentially off the beaten path in many ways and Greensboro was the #2 city in NC for many years as recently as 1980, and then Raleigh exploded in growth, so the number of northern transplants definitely have more of an impact than CLT or ATL, which tended to be more balanced in terms of northerners and southerners who've relocated to those cities. Big Aristotle definitely broke it down in his excellent post as to why.
Very good points. I don't get strong west coast vibes at all in Atlanta. It is interesting how Raleigh has a similar super regional reach. It picks up Southern/Central Virginia, Eastern North Carolina, and some areas of South Carolina. It fills the gap for those who are too far away from Richmond, Charlotte, and Norfolk areas. While the city is not as culturally well known outside of government, education, and tech industries etc., it does have a great reputation to offer better opportunities for those looking to grow their careers and have a slower less expensive pace of life than the northeast overall.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
