Austin, TX vs. Phoenix, AZ (living, best, state, better)
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I am looking for similarities and differences between these two cities. I am a Phoenix native and thus know a lot about desert living, and what Arizona has to offer, but I know nothing about Texas. I drove through Texas on the I-10 once, all the way through, and that's the closest to what I got of sightseeing over there.
What I can gather on a surface level investigation of Austin is that it is a liberal, capital city of the big state of Texas, has expensive rents, and some pretty hardcore traffic. Phoenix is a moderate (suburbs are conservative, not Phoenix proper), capital city of the big state of Arizona, has moderate rent (not cheap, rents are rising significantly), and traffic is pretty easy for most metropolitan areas.
As far as outdoor recreation, city amenities, affordability, and things like this, how do the two compare? If I were to hypothetically move to Austin, I would be a single young adult in their 20s, looking to create a new social life and have an affordable place to live, ideally close to Austin's "walkable areas" if that even exists in Texas to begin with. So things like schools don't matter. More about a good nightlife, decent transit, etc.
First of all, my personal preference is Austin, just due to the fact that I prefer the climate and am closer to family. Although, Austin is not far from Phoenix as far as heat during the summer months. Aside from that, I wouldn't mind living in either city.
Outdoor recreation: Either - Both metros offer a lot during of outdoor activities. Both are popular for hiking and mountain biking. I give Austin the edge in this due to the plethora of water recreation, making you able to enjoy the outdoor activities during the summer months. Those who prefer desert climate, landscapes, and mountains, may prefer Phoenix's outdoor activities more than Austin.
Amenities: Phoenix - Both offer the typical shopping amenities, museums, and such. Phoenix offers much more in the way of sports with just about all of the professional sports being located in the Phoenix area. Austin will get its first professional sports franchise with Austin FC in the MLS, in 2021. Both cities have a large college campus in its metro area. Although, Austin has two, with Texas State in San Marcos.
What is nice about Austin is it is within 3 hours of America's top ten largest cities, San Antonio, Houston, and Dallas. Austin is also only a 3 hour drive from the beach in Galveston or Corpus Christi. Phoenix is much more isolated. So there are many more Amenities within a short drive of Austin, than there are in or around Phoenix.
Affordability: Phoenix - Austin is a very expensive city both to own and to rent. I know you mentioned wanting to live in a walkable area. There are a couple in the Austin area, (downtown, inner East Side, West Campus, The Domain, Highland, and to a lesser extent Mueller and E. Riverside Dr.). However, these areas are expensive, with the exception of E. Riverside Dr, which is fairly reasonable overall. The housing market here is very expensive, especially for TX, with the average home price quickly approaching 400k. Sure the wages overall may be higher in Austin than in other areas, but it doesn't make up for the over-inflated COL. Phoenix seems to be much more affordable overall.
Traffic: Phoenix, (probably) - Honestly, I have only driven through Phoenix a few times on I-10. But every time I have driven through, I have been stuck in traffic. I am sure this isn't a fair representation to traffic overall in Phoenix, but I haven't experienced typical traffic patterns there. I will say, Austin traffic sucks. Typical rush hour times are from 6:30am-9:30am, 11:45am-1:15pm, and 3:30pm-7:00pm. There is traffic in most places almost all day, every day, and if you have to drive more than five miles on a regular basis, you will experience heavy traffic more times than not. Even on weekends, traffic downtown is terrible up until 2:30am. There are no convenient ways to get around traffic either, like there are in Phoenix. Austin doesn't have a traditional grid, and aside from a very few arterial roadways, most roads come to an end, or turn in a different direction after a few miles.
Entertainment/ Nightlife: Austin - Austin by far is one of the most fun cities in the US. Many people call it overrated, but that is because they have only experienced Dirty 6th. Dirty 6th is fun, but it only represents a portion of nightlife in the city. There are many more concentrated areas across the metro that offer nightlife. Also, not only is there consistent nightlife across the area, but there is always live music somewhere, a festival going on, or an event to attend. Every weekend in Austin has something exciting to offer. Not to mention, there are a plethora of very good breweries across Austin, which has made the city be recognized as the top beer destination in the WORLD.
Economy: Austin - Austin, no doubt, since the turn of the century, been one of the hottest, if not the hottest city in the country for growth, job opportunities, and overall economic development. When you hear the word boomtown, the first city many people would think of is probably Austin. There are countless job opportunities in this city that pay well, from government, to IT, to corporate jobs, and even in construction. With that said, the job market is very competitive.
With all of that said, I know Phoenix has been growing quickly as well with many new job opportunities. Phoenix has gained 300,000 people in just 20 years, with the metro area gaining many more.
Overall: Either - The Phoenix metro area is over twice the size of Austin and will have more amenities overall. That is just the reality. But for a metro area of just over two million, Austin packs a hell of a punch and can hold its own against Phoenix. I think it will come down to personal preference. Both cities are mild in the winter months and just downright hot in the summer months. Even though Phoenix is hotter, Austin is more humid, making some days feel like you are living in a Sauna. The climates are also different overall. Austin is a green, lush city, with rolling hills, and with many creeks, rivers, and lakes nearby. Phoenix is a desert metropolis with mountains, canyons, and a beautiful desert landscape. Austin is more entertaining for those who enjoy nightlife, beer, and festivals. Phoenix is better overall for a family, or if you are laid back and don't like to get out much, as long as you can stand the summer heat. For the outdoor explorers, both are great options and it comes down to personal preference.
Location: Live:Downtown Phoenix, AZ/Work:Greater Los Angeles, CA
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I would stay in Phoenix just for the weather alone, winter in Austin is a roller coaster temp wise, going from 70s&80s down to 30s&40s and back up again in a couple week stretch and is quite cloudy in the winter. Spring and fall are very rainy and summer is humid, especially at night and in the mornings, they typically get an afternoon drop in humidity, but still feels muggy compared to here.
A lot of toll highways around Austin too, another turnoff
This is another comparison where both places come down to COL, and both equal out.
Austin- Higher COL but more high paying jobs make up for it.
Phoenix- Lower COL (though that's changing) but not as many high paying jobs
Austin has a much livelier and significantly more "urban" feel than Phoenix. Phoenix is much more of a suburban city like Orlando, but Austin also has its fair share of suburban sprawl on the outer edges.
People always want the best of both worlds, but that's just not the case. You can either have a high COL with much more to do, higher wages, and a more lively city, or a low COL with less going on and lower wages. The utopia of paying less and having an extremely high income is just unrealistic in most places and for most people.
My pick would be Phoenix, but if Dallas was included here I'd go with Dallas over both of these cities.
First of all, my personal preference is Austin, just due to the fact that I prefer the climate and am closer to family. Although, Austin is not far from Phoenix as far as heat during the summer months. Aside from that, I wouldn't mind living in either city.
Outdoor recreation: Either - Both metros offer a lot during of outdoor activities. Both are popular for hiking and mountain biking. I give Austin the edge in this due to the plethora of water recreation, making you able to enjoy the outdoor activities during the summer months. Those who prefer desert climate, landscapes, and mountains, may prefer Phoenix's outdoor activities more than Austin.
Amenities: Phoenix - Both offer the typical shopping amenities, museums, and such. Phoenix offers much more in the way of sports with just about all of the professional sports being located in the Phoenix area. Austin will get its first professional sports franchise with Austin FC in the MLS, in 2021. Both cities have a large college campus in its metro area. Although, Austin has two, with Texas State in San Marcos.
What is nice about Austin is it is within 3 hours of America's top ten largest cities, San Antonio, Houston, and Dallas. Austin is also only a 3 hour drive from the beach in Galveston or Corpus Christi. Phoenix is much more isolated. So there are many more Amenities within a short drive of Austin, than there are in or around Phoenix.
Affordability: Phoenix - Austin is a very expensive city both to own and to rent. I know you mentioned wanting to live in a walkable area. There are a couple in the Austin area, (downtown, inner East Side, West Campus, The Domain, Highland, and to a lesser extent Mueller and E. Riverside Dr.). However, these areas are expensive, with the exception of E. Riverside Dr, which is fairly reasonable overall. The housing market here is very expensive, especially for TX, with the average home price quickly approaching 400k. Sure the wages overall may be higher in Austin than in other areas, but it doesn't make up for the over-inflated COL. Phoenix seems to be much more affordable overall.
Traffic: Phoenix, (probably) - Honestly, I have only driven through Phoenix a few times on I-10. But every time I have driven through, I have been stuck in traffic. I am sure this isn't a fair representation to traffic overall in Phoenix, but I haven't experienced typical traffic patterns there. I will say, Austin traffic sucks. Typical rush hour times are from 6:30am-9:30am, 11:45am-1:15pm, and 3:30pm-7:00pm. There is traffic in most places almost all day, every day, and if you have to drive more than five miles on a regular basis, you will experience heavy traffic more times than not. Even on weekends, traffic downtown is terrible up until 2:30am. There are no convenient ways to get around traffic either, like there are in Phoenix. Austin doesn't have a traditional grid, and aside from a very few arterial roadways, most roads come to an end, or turn in a different direction after a few miles.
Entertainment/ Nightlife: Austin - Austin by far is one of the most fun cities in the US. Many people call it overrated, but that is because they have only experienced Dirty 6th. Dirty 6th is fun, but it only represents a portion of nightlife in the city. There are many more concentrated areas across the metro that offer nightlife. Also, not only is there consistent nightlife across the area, but there is always live music somewhere, a festival going on, or an event to attend. Every weekend in Austin has something exciting to offer. Not to mention, there are a plethora of very good breweries across Austin, which has made the city be recognized as the top beer destination in the WORLD.
Economy: Austin - Austin, no doubt, since the turn of the century, been one of the hottest, if not the hottest city in the country for growth, job opportunities, and overall economic development. When you hear the word boomtown, the first city many people would think of is probably Austin. There are countless job opportunities in this city that pay well, from government, to IT, to corporate jobs, and even in construction. With that said, the job market is very competitive.
With all of that said, I know Phoenix has been growing quickly as well with many new job opportunities. Phoenix has gained 300,000 people in just 20 years, with the metro area gaining many more.
Overall: Either - The Phoenix metro area is over twice the size of Austin and will have more amenities overall. That is just the reality. But for a metro area of just over two million, Austin packs a hell of a punch and can hold its own against Phoenix. I think it will come down to personal preference. Both cities are mild in the winter months and just downright hot in the summer months. Even though Phoenix is hotter, Austin is more humid, making some days feel like you are living in a Sauna. The climates are also different overall. Austin is a green, lush city, with rolling hills, and with many creeks, rivers, and lakes nearby. Phoenix is a desert metropolis with mountains, canyons, and a beautiful desert landscape. Austin is more entertaining for those who enjoy nightlife, beer, and festivals. Phoenix is better overall for a family, or if you are laid back and don't like to get out much, as long as you can stand the summer heat. For the outdoor explorers, both are great options and it comes down to personal preference.
Outdoor recreation: That's a good point. I find the desert to be beautiful, but me personally I have always been more into water recreation. Being in the desert, water recreation is tough to do, for obvious reasons. We have a couple options, like some lakes on the outskirts (Lake Pleasant and Lake Roosevelt), and we also have Tempe Town Lake which you can kayak and take small boats on. I'm not so much of a hiker, especially in the Arizona heat. And Austin probably compares there, just more humid. Austin being fairly greener with more shade trees probably makes it more tolerable however, I guess that depends on who you ask. Phoenix is better for the big mountains, Flag for skiing and one of the most beautiful forests I have ever seen, and a large variety around the city. I imagine Texas has a lot less variety in it's nearby nature. I mean you have swamps on the east and desert in the west, but they're also almost two days apart. Arizona's diversity is significantly closer, albeit of less diversity.
I've never been a sports fan, heck I don't even have cable anymore. Sometimes I'd watch the NFL on TV (NBA games are fun to see in person) but those are just once in a very, very rare blue moon things. Western cities are naturally isolated, by sheer lack of water resources, and the federal public lands management (which is fantastic for obvious reasons, but it does prevent city growth like what is out east).
What is the average rent like in Austin for apartments? And is it easy to find roommates? Let's say your salary was roughly 60k, would Austin be affordable on your own or is roommates still a necessity?
Traffic on the I-10 is the worst Phoenix has to offer. Especially on the west side headed to California or into Downtown, depending if you are with rush hour or not. Phoenix's grid is phenomenal for car traffic, Phoenix is probably one of the best in the nation for that. Knowing your experience on the I-10 here, if it's normal or even better than a normal Austin experience, then Phoenix is better by a long shot.
Never having been to Austin, I'd imagine nightlife is better there too. Outside of the Entertainment District in Old Town Scottsdale and Mill Avenue in Tempe, there really isn't any bars are clubs to go to. If there are bars they are just neighborhood dive bars, which personally isn't my scene unless I have friends to go with all the time. Being in a new city (if hypothetically I move to Austin) I'd want to be in a bar or club that is not cliquish.
Sounds like based on your overall commentary, I'd prefer Austin. I'm not a laidback, family-oriented individual. Is Austin's heat comparable to New Orleans? If so, I have quite the experience of New Orleanian summers, and I'd prefer to deal with something less humid than that, lol.
Austin's summer humidity, like its vegetation, is very much in an intermediate position between Phoenix and New Orleans. I've lived in the area previously and those summer days when it gets over 100 typically feature lower humidity and blazing sunshine, so the dewpoint can actually be higher on the officially milder days. The precipitation patterns are often feast or famine, with periodic deluges interspersed with weeks on end when it doesn't rain at all. Totally agreed on the assessment of roller coaster conditions in the winter - it can transition from warm, humid and foggy to cold and dry with gusty winds in a matter of hours when a front sweeps in from the north.
Location: Live:Downtown Phoenix, AZ/Work:Greater Los Angeles, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jas75
Austin's summer humidity, like its vegetation, is very much in an intermediate position between Phoenix and New Orleans. I've lived in the area previously and those summer days when it gets over 100 typically feature lower humidity and blazing sunshine, so the dewpoint can actually be higher on the officially milder days. The precipitation patterns are often feast or famine, with periodic deluges interspersed with weeks on end when it doesn't rain at all. Totally agreed on the assessment of roller coaster conditions in the winter - it can transition from warm, humid and foggy to cold and dry with gusty winds in a matter of hours when a front sweeps in from the north.
I tracked Austin's weather last summer, which was very hot by their standards, every day started with dewpoints in the 70s in the AM, most days the dew finally dropped to the high 50s to low 60s by 5 pm, but that's still humid. Other days dews never fell below 70, which is oppressive
Location: Live:Downtown Phoenix, AZ/Work:Greater Los Angeles, CA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Prickly Pear
Outdoor recreation: That's a good point. I find the desert to be beautiful, but me personally I have always been more into water recreation. Being in the desert, water recreation is tough to do, for obvious reasons. We have a couple options, like some lakes on the outskirts (Lake Pleasant and Lake Roosevelt), and we also have Tempe Town Lake which you can kayak and take small boats on. I'm not so much of a hiker, especially in the Arizona heat. And Austin probably compares there, just more humid. Austin being fairly greener with more shade trees probably makes it more tolerable however, I guess that depends on who you ask. Phoenix is better for the big mountains, Flag for skiing and one of the most beautiful forests I have ever seen, and a large variety around the city. I imagine Texas has a lot less variety in it's nearby nature. I mean you have swamps on the east and desert in the west, but they're also almost two days apart. Arizona's diversity is significantly closer, albeit of less diversity.
I've never been a sports fan, heck I don't even have cable anymore. Sometimes I'd watch the NFL on TV (NBA games are fun to see in person) but those are just once in a very, very rare blue moon things. Western cities are naturally isolated, by sheer lack of water resources, and the federal public lands management (which is fantastic for obvious reasons, but it does prevent city growth like what is out east).
What is the average rent like in Austin for apartments? And is it easy to find roommates? Let's say your salary was roughly 60k, would Austin be affordable on your own or is roommates still a necessity?
Traffic on the I-10 is the worst Phoenix has to offer. Especially on the west side headed to California or into Downtown, depending if you are with rush hour or not. Phoenix's grid is phenomenal for car traffic, Phoenix is probably one of the best in the nation for that. Knowing your experience on the I-10 here, if it's normal or even better than a normal Austin experience, then Phoenix is better by a long shot.
Never having been to Austin, I'd imagine nightlife is better there too. Outside of the Entertainment District in Old Town Scottsdale and Mill Avenue in Tempe, there really isn't any bars are clubs to go to. If there are bars they are just neighborhood dive bars, which personally isn't my scene unless I have friends to go with all the time. Being in a new city (if hypothetically I move to Austin) I'd want to be in a bar or club that is not cliquish.
Sounds like based on your overall commentary, I'd prefer Austin. I'm not a laidback, family-oriented individual. Is Austin's heat comparable to New Orleans? If so, I have quite the experience of New Orleanian summers, and I'd prefer to deal with something less humid than that, lol.
Read post #7 to get an idea of what southerners consider "dry heat", it's still muggy by our western standards
Outdoor recreation: That's a good point. I find the desert to be beautiful, but me personally I have always been more into water recreation. Being in the desert, water recreation is tough to do, for obvious reasons. We have a couple options, like some lakes on the outskirts (Lake Pleasant and Lake Roosevelt), and we also have Tempe Town Lake which you can kayak and take small boats on. I'm not so much of a hiker, especially in the Arizona heat. And Austin probably compares there, just more humid. Austin being fairly greener with more shade trees probably makes it more tolerable however, I guess that depends on who you ask. Phoenix is better for the big mountains, Flag for skiing and one of the most beautiful forests I have ever seen, and a large variety around the city. I imagine Texas has a lot less variety in it's nearby nature. I mean you have swamps on the east and desert in the west, but they're also almost two days apart. Arizona's diversity is significantly closer, albeit of less diversity.
Hiking is great in and around Austin, due to the tree canopies and the abundance of water holes to jump into. There is almost always somewhere to jump into the water in any hiking areas. Austin doesn't have any forest, but has a lot of gorgeous wooded areas. However, Bastrop, which is in the area, has Bastrop State Park, which is in the Lost Pines Forest area of Texas. The hill country to the west and the plains to the east also offer a bit of variety to the topography within the metro area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prickly Pear
What is the average rent like in Austin for apartments? And is it easy to find roommates? Let's say your salary was roughly 60k, would Austin be affordable on your own or is roommates still a necessity?
You would be able to live comfortably on 60k a year and could find a 1 br in a safer area for about $800 a month without any bells and whistles. If you want something fancy, you would be looking more into the $1200-$1500 range. There are also plenty of apartments that offer 2-4br that lease individual rooms and you share the living room and kitchen with roommates. Those usually go for $400-$700 a month. But, you don't get to pick and choose your roommates.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Prickly Pear
Sounds like based on your overall commentary, I'd prefer Austin. I'm not a laidback, family-oriented individual. Is Austin's heat comparable to New Orleans? If so, I have quite the experience of New Orleanian summers, and I'd prefer to deal with something less humid than that, lol.
I'd say Austin's heat is in between Phoenix and New Orleans. It gets hotter and drier than NO, but is cooler and more humid than Phoenix. The average August high, (hottest month), is 97 degrees, and I would say that is at around 60-70% humidity. It is common for lows to be around 75 degrees with the humidity going up to 70-80% at night. July and August have a lot less rain than the rest of the year and would probably remind you a bit more of Phoenix during the day. Austin is a great city, and if the opportunity presented itself for you to move here, I would say go for it and check it out for at least a year. You are young and can always go back home or somewhere else if you don't like it.
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