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A poll on whether Atlanta or DC were the more urban city would undoubtedly be lopsided towards DC.
That DC and Atlanta developed significantly at different times is valid, but there are suburbs that are (smaller) but just as urban as downtown and midtown Atlanta.
Look at Ballston for example. Ballston Quarter opened right before Covid. There’s a Macy’s, there are movie theaters, Target and feels like a natural functioning downtown. Ballston started developing in the 90’s. Then you look at Bethesda, Silver Spring, Rosslyn, Clarendon, Courthouse, Pentagon City, Crystal City, and to lesser extents Rockville, and Eisenhower metro stations. The developments vs. any Marta stations outside of downtown and midtown. It’s a very stark contrast. And I feel like that’s a fair comparison of urban developments as they are grew and are growing around the same time.
I'd have to disagree for the most part as the urban core of Atlanta, constituted by downtown and Midtown, is the more classically urban area overall compared to any of those suburbs but I will say downtown Bethesda specifically gets the nod when compared to the commercial heart of downtown and Midtown. Ballston feels like the modern, transit-oriented edge city that it was built to be and not at all like a naturally functioning downtown with a diverse mix of people, architectural variety, historic sites, institutional landmarks, civic spaces, tourist attractions, etc. It's much more like a smaller, more compact, more walkable Buckhead than a truly functional, well-rounded downtown with something to offer everyone.
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Personally, downtown Atlanta for the most part seems like parking decks, parking lots, blank walls and lobby’s. And please don’t send me links of 1 or 2 streets showing the contrary. I’m talking overall.
You won't get an argument from me that downtown Atlanta has too much of these things, but didn't you just mention the Macy's in Ballston? LOL I don't think you're giving downtown enough credit but I can understand why since it lacks cohesiveness, feeling more like five or six individual districts plus GSU but largely lacking synergy among them.
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Midtown feels more human. Even though downtown DC & Penn Quarter has a lot of government buildings, there is still fairly robust amount of shopping. Luxury stores at City Center DC with Hermès, etc and the other retailers such as Zara’s, 2 H&M’s, GAP, TJ Maxx, around downtown & Penn.
I understand the importance of retail to any urban area, but you seem to be giving enormous weight to chain retailers in newer developments in your assessment of what's urban. They certainly have their place, but in, say, Silver Spring, I'm more apt to mention Georgia Ave or Fenton St as examples of urbanity than the development known as Downtown Silver Spring.
What I meant was not over other cities that have greater urbanity or uniqueness
None of my friends/associates/peers are really into urbanity for its own sake but for those who have expressed a desire to move to DC or spoken highly of it in general, past or present, do mention its vibrant urban neighborhoods in their assessment even if they don't explicitly say the terms "urban" or "walkable."
A poll on whether Atlanta or DC were the more urban city would undoubtedly be lopsided towards DC.
That DC and Atlanta developed significantly at different times is valid, but there are suburbs that are (smaller) but just as urban as downtown and midtown Atlanta.
Look at Ballston for example. Ballston Quarter opened right before Covid. There’s a Macy’s, there are movie theaters, Target and feels like a natural functioning downtown. Ballston started developing in the 90’s. Then you look at Bethesda, Silver Spring, Rosslyn, Clarendon, Courthouse, Pentagon City, Crystal City, and to lesser extents Rockville, and Eisenhower metro stations. The developments vs. any Marta stations outside of downtown and midtown. It’s a very stark contrast. And I feel like that’s a fair comparison of urban developments as they are grew and are growing around the same time.
Personally, downtown Atlanta for the most part seems like parking decks, parking lots, blank walls and lobby’s. And please don’t send me links of 1 or 2 streets showing the contrary. I’m talking overall. Midtown feels more human. Even though downtown DC & Penn Quarter has a lot of government buildings, there is still fairly robust amount of shopping. Luxury stores at City Center DC with Hermès, etc and the other retailers such as Zara’s, 2 H&M’s, GAP, TJ Maxx, around downtown & Penn.
Downtown Atlanta is more than a couple of blocks of Peachtree which is literally what you are referring to. Just ignoring Centennial Olympic Park, Marietta Artery,Fairlie-Poplar,Auburn Ave etc.
You obviously havent been to Atlanta suburbs.
There are some similarities even if DC still has more,they are developing similarly.
Alpharetta. Avalon and the Downtown areas are exploding and buidking along the same lines as Ballston
Avalon
Smryna/Marietta
Truist
Dunwoody is currently implanting a muti million dollar master plan to develop a more coheesive pedestrian friendly district
So while it doesnt have as much as the DC metro,its continuing to improve quickly
Downtown Atlanta is more than a couple of blocks of Peachtree which is literally what you are referring to. Just ignoring Centennial Olympic Park, Marietta Artery,Fairlie-Poplar,Auburn Ave etc.
You obviously havent been to Atlanta suburbs.
There are some similarities even if DC still has more,they are developing similarly.
Alpharetta. Avalon and the Downtown areas are exploding and buidking along the same lines as Ballston
Avalon
Smryna/Marietta
Truist
Dunwoody is currently implanting a muti million dollar master plan to develop a more coheesive pedestrian friendly district
So while it doesnt have as much as the DC metro,its continuing to improve quickly
That area by the Baseball stadium is nice. My sister in law lives around the corner from it.
That's because the answer to your question was in that very same post. Keep reading the sentence you partially emboldened and you'll have your answer.
Now have you made the decision to remain in Atlanta or move elsewhere? Don't get stuck in the paralysis of (over)analysis. You probably could've gotten a good deal on rent if you made a move last year, and there are probably still some to be had out there but not for much longer as we emerge from the pandemic.
I'm not even out of college yet, though I said earlier that I didn't expect to move until 2022. I don't care about high rent prices and haven't even mentioned the cost of living in this thread, I know life will be expensive for my generation. (But don't see why you bring this up as we're talking about urbanity and you yourself said the topic has gone beyond my original post).
NYC? Don't cheat yourself; it's not called the Bos-Wash corridor for nothing. So from now on, go ahead and include the MSAs of DC, Baltimore, Philadelphia, NYC, and Boston collectively when comparing any of them to another place. See how that goes over.
My point is land size matters when comparing growth. The size of Atlanta’s metro area in land makes the growth of that land area underwhelming. It’s the same for city propers. A land mass of 61 sq. miles adding 10,000 people is not the same as a city that is 300 sq. miles adding 10,000 people.
One thing I feel needs to be said that Atlanta Beltline is like walking the streets of DC. Its packed with people.Dining and shopping are accessible by foot and plentiful with more and more added constantly.
So while the sidewalks along Atlants's streets may not invoke DC.The Beltline cant be discounted. Its unique to Atlanta but so often its overlooked as an afterthought. It does the exact same job as Atlanta' streets ,it just happens to weave through less traditionally urban neighborhoods. With its construction,those neighborhoods have and are becoming something different than what is normally seen in denser more populated cities. A city that grew up around the automobile but is now growing up with peoples need to be connected to their surroundings without a car.
OMG....
Just so I’m clear, which streets in DC does the beltline remind you of? It’s a trail, it’s not in the center of Midtown Atlanta. Does it remind you of Fairlie-Poplar too?
This is so true. My favorite thing about the BeltLine is that all of the areas being knitted together are old streetcar neighborhoods, including the industrial ones.
DC has a very popular trail under construction too. It’s called the Anacostia River Trail and it runs for 20 miles on the western banks of the Anacostia River and the eastern banks of the Anacostia River. The relevance to this thread is that it goes by East of the River neighborhoods too like Downtown Ward 7 and Historic Anacostia. The crowd using it on the eastern bank side is probably about 95% black which also presents something unique compared to trails around the nation.
Maybe those numbers are wrong or I’m looking at it wrong.
I look forward to Clever’s response. Apparently a lot more people are moving to DC than Atlanta if you consider Atlanta has double the space.
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Originally Posted by CleverOne
Downtown Atlanta is more than a couple of blocks of Peachtree which is literally what you are referring to. Just ignoring Centennial Olympic Park, Marietta Artery,Fairlie-Poplar,Auburn Ave etc.
You obviously havent been to Atlanta suburbs.
There are some similarities even if DC still has more,they are developing similarly.
Alpharetta. Avalon and the Downtown areas are exploding and buidking along the same lines as Ballston
Avalon
Smryna/Marietta
Truist
Dunwoody is currently implanting a muti million dollar master plan to develop a more coheesive pedestrian friendly district
So while it doesnt have as much as the DC metro,its continuing to improve quickly
You have a response to every single thing except DC is adding more people than Atlanta is despite Atlanta having double the land size???
I assume you will not address it.
I’ve never mentioned Reston, however. Those areas you mentioned are not exploding anywhere near the level of Reston. I’d compare Reston to Atlantic Station. After the latest developments finish, Reston will be quite bigger than Atlantic Station and more urban with higher quality developments. The skyscrapers in Atlantic Station are beautiful from afar but pretty much just blank walls and lobby’s. Office towers in Reston will be vibrant.
The fact of the matter, even DC exurbs have large, higher quality and more urban developments than most of Atlanta. TOD is what the region does best.
So let’s go back to Atlanta. A city I’ve been too a plenty of time as recently as last month. (You really think someone born in Charlotte isn’t familiar with Atlanta?)
- I don’t know why anytime someone wants to prove an area is lively and walkable, they show pictures of special events (New Years in this case)
- I am aware of those areas in downtown (centennial park.... Who has been to Atlanta and hasn’t been to Centennial Park?). Overall, downtown Atlanta to me comes across as blanks walls, parking lots, lobby’s and parking decks. As a whole. Now. When you characterize downtown/Penn Quarter as cold government buildings. Compared to downtown Atlanta....as great as Georgia Aquarium is and World of Coke... they completely ignore the streets. They have massive blank walls and parking deck entrances.... Farlie Poplar.... Do you realize how silly it is to rave about Farlie Poplar in contrast to DC (if you’re making snide remarks about DC being cold government vibes)
Farlie poplar. Do we compare it to Shaw? U Street? Adams Morgan? H Street? Barracks Row? Petworth? Columbia Heights? Logan Circle? 14th St? Farlie Poplar is yet another collection of parking decks, blank walls & parking lots. I don’t need a few pictures of a street btw. You have to realize how underwhelming Farlie is compared to the most average DC neighborhood....
- I love, love Ponce City market. It’s one of my favorite places ever.
- The baseball stadium area. Funny you mention that. They have this place called “Punch Bowl Social” which I knew because Arlington, VA has one. I was going to go but decided against it because it was just too far away from where I was and where I wanted to go next. And honestly. I didn’t want to waste my time there when I could be somewhere like Little Five Points. I was actually trying to impress my friend with Atlanta so I didn’t think that would be a highlight.
I like Atlanta, believe it or not. But when you’re claiming no one moves to DC (despite more people moving to DC than Atlanta despite Atlanta having 2x the land area) and how it’s cold government buildings, etc. and you harp and harp and harp on it.... focus on what Atlanta does excel at...
There’s plenty to love about Atlanta, so why not just inform people what to love and crap about Atlanta rather than going around saying no one moves to DC, this that & the third..... the DC metro has just as many Fortune 500’s as ATL (and Amazon’s HQ2). We don’t all work in government. And even those of us who do work for government. You think we stomp around because someone is an analyst at HUD? It’s just a job.... We’re not interns at the Capitol campaigning for free....
As far as African Americans. I’m not black, but most of my black friends actually prefer the suburbs. They prefer large single family homes yet also prefer driving to urban areas that Have great local bars and restaurants.
In that case, Atlanta would probably be better the better urban area for some of my black friends to live.
Last edited by Charlotte485; 05-22-2021 at 12:33 PM..
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I look forward to Clever’s response. Apparently a lot more people are moving to DC than Atlanta if you consider Atlanta has double the space.