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Did Madison County pull out of the Bi-State Development district?
I had an uncle, an artist of some note, who taught at SIUE from 1969 on and whom I visited often; on one visit, I decided I wanted to spend some time in the city and took a Bi-State bus into downtown St. Louis from Edwardsville. Is that no longer possible?
(Edited to add: This sounds an awful lot like Johnson County, Kan., which did eventually bring its bus system back into the KCATA fold.)
It's a bit strange. Madison County is a Bi-State member, but they don't rely on Metro Transit for public transportation services. Metro Transit runs both MetroLink and MetroBus, for clarification. Madison County runs their own buses via Madison County Transit. Their buses do connect with MetroBus and MetroLink stops, and they run to downtown St. Louis and back as well. Like I said, strange.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mjtinmemphis
Make sense. I hope they design with better bike infrastructure. Grand is atrocious.
It's definitely my least favorite station in the city. I'd also like it if they put a stop on Chouteau before the transfer station. I get that it would be close to the transfer station, but it's just not inviting to be walking on an overpass. The next stop north would be on Market, which should be fine.
They've been talking about this since at least 2020. How much planning and talking needs to happen before a track can be laid on the ground? Four years? Ten? Twenty?
Your question has already been answered, but I think I also need to point out to everyone that the question asked "Which cities will see the largest growth/improvement of their rail systems?"
Since the question is forward-looking, the absence of any actual construction as of now is moot. And in the case of Austin, the voters approved raising property taxes in order to build rail transit. Even though that money will go into the general fund until it gets spent on what is promised, all parties involved still have an incentive to deliver on the promise.
Your question has already been answered, but I think I also need to point out to everyone that the question asked "Which cities will see the largest growth/improvement of their rail systems?"
Since the question is forward-looking, the absence of any actual construction as of now is moot. And in the case of Austin, the voters approved raising property taxes in order to build rail transit. Even though that money will go into the general fund until it gets spent on what is promised, all parties involved still have an incentive to deliver on the promise.
Anything that is still in the planning stages is going to take decades to complete, just look at how long it’s been taking Seattle to build their light rail system.
In 1981 (after heavy rail ballot was rejected in 1968/1970) Puget Sound Regional Council commissioned a study that stated light rail as the preferred mode of rapid transit.
In 1988 a non-binding advisory ballot approved light rail
In 1990 the downtown bus tunnel was completed with rail tracks in anticipation that it would be converted into a light rail tunnel.
In 1993 sound transit was created to oversee light rail development
In 1995 the ballot to build the 70 mile light rail system was rejected
In 1996 a revised ballot to build 25 mile long light rail system was approved (15 years after the initial study!)
In 2003 central link began construction
In 2006 university link 3 mile extension was approved
In 2008 university link extension began construction and a ballot was passed to build another 36 miles
In 2009 central link started operation between downtown and Tukwila (13 years after voters approved, 28 years after the initial study)
In 2010 the airport extension completed and started operation
In 2016 university link extension started operation and another ballot passed to build another 62 miles and broke ground on east link extension
In 2025 it’s projected that east link will be completed as well as extensions south to federal way and north to Lynwood. The rest of the system that voters have already approved of won’t be completed until the 2040s.
So considering the OP was looking at a time frame of 10-15 years, any city that hasn’t already broke ground on construction or at least has funding in place for the project I just don’t see them being in the running, maybe 20-25 years, but otherwise it’s just not enough time, and it’s already been 3 years since the OP, meaning we have 7-12 years left.
Anything that is still in the planning stages is going to take decades to complete, just look at how long it’s been taking Seattle to build their light rail system.
In 1981 (after heavy rail ballot was rejected in 1968/1970) Puget Sound Regional Council commissioned a study that stated light rail as the preferred mode of rapid transit.
In 1988 a non-binding advisory ballot approved light rail
In 1990 the downtown bus tunnel was completed with rail tracks in anticipation that it would be converted into a light rail tunnel.
In 1993 sound transit was created to oversee light rail development
In 1995 the ballot to build the 70 mile light rail system was rejected
In 1996 a revised ballot to build 25 mile long light rail system was approved (15 years after the initial study!)
In 2003 central link began construction
In 2006 university link 3 mile extension was approved
In 2008 university link extension began construction and a ballot was passed to build another 36 miles
In 2009 central link started operation between downtown and Tukwila (13 years after voters approved, 28 years after the initial study)
In 2010 the airport extension completed and started operation
In 2016 university link extension started operation and another ballot passed to build another 62 miles and broke ground on east link extension
In 2025 it’s projected that east link will be completed as well as extensions south to federal way and north to Lynwood. The rest of the system that voters have already approved of won’t be completed until the 2040s.
So considering the OP was looking at a time frame of 10-15 years, any city that hasn’t already broke ground on construction or at least has funding in place for the project I just don’t see them being in the running, maybe 20-25 years, but otherwise it’s just not enough time, and it’s already been 3 years since the OP, meaning we have 7-12 years left.
Seattle's population stood at 1.8 million in 1981 when they were in the planning stages for their transit system. Comparatively, as I observe cities like Austin and Nashville, the prospect of initiating rapid transit seems challenging and distant. It is imperative to consider undertaking such initiatives before the metropolitan population reaches the 2 million mark. Seattle's experience highlights the importance of early planning and execution in developing an efficient and effective transit system for a growing city. Learning from their evolution can serve as a valuable guide for other metropolitan areas aspiring to enhance their transit infrastructure.
It's definitely my least favorite station in the city. I'd also like it if they put a stop on Chouteau before the transfer station. I get that it would be close to the transfer station, but it's just not inviting to be walking on an overpass. The next stop north would be on Market, which should be fine.
Given the recent bike friendly progressive developments, it seems fitting to consider the possibility of introducing a Metrolink stop at Jefferson and Chouteau. A well-integrated public transportation system, including both bike-friendly features and convenient Metrolink stops, can significantly contribute to the overall accessibility and sustainability of the city. It would be a strategic move aligning with the evolving urban landscape and the increasing focus on alternative modes of transportation.
Seattle's population stood at 1.8 million in 1981 when they were in the planning stages for their transit system. Comparatively, as I observe cities like Austin and Nashville, the prospect of initiating rapid transit seems challenging and distant. It is imperative to consider undertaking such initiatives before the metropolitan population reaches the 2 million mark. Seattle's experience highlights the importance of early planning and execution in developing an efficient and effective transit system for a growing city. Learning from their evolution can serve as a valuable guide for other metropolitan areas aspiring to enhance their transit infrastructure.
Austin has at least taken the first steps in that thousand-mile journey.
Nashville voters turned down that city's first step in 2018.
The MBTA's South Coast Rail route (some additional 110 miles) is slated to open in 2024. It will add 10 new commuter rail stations and connect the SE Mass cities of Taunton, Fall River, and New Bedford to Boston.
This follows the recent Light Rail Subway Green Line Extension (GLX) that went fully operational back in December 2022 and the Jan-2023 opening of a new commuter rail station in Pawtucket-RI.
The poll results are weird. How does Tampa have any votes, when the only rail system it has is Amtrak and some useless trolley thing that runs around at a snail's pace? And why does it have as many votes as Orlando, which has a 61 mile long commuter rail with a new line underway connecting it to the airport, AND Brightline trains?
In general I think people mostly vote for their city or smaller cities where it’s a bigger deal.
How many people even know DC will be adding 20 or so miles of its first light rail line connecting several metro lines?
The tens of Billions going in to Long Bridge that will separate freight from passenger rail, reducing a bottle neck allowing way more service that’ll allow for more all day all week frequency on VRE (including new VRE stations to better connect to National Airport directly, metro, and will allow capacity for MARC to run through VA also)
How many people know there was a new extension of the heavy rail silver line in DC connecting to another airport in the region that opened last year?
How many people know a new $370MM infill station opened last year?
How many people know of the new way finding or possibly making the streetcar a transit only lane?
Probably way less than people knew about Austin’s plan or bright line.i just don’t think much people are aware. Not about Philly’s streetcar modernizations, not about the potential Roosevelt Blvd subway, etc. I also think people don’t realize the difference in quality either. There’s a big difference between light rail aligns like DART vs say the Central Subway that just opened up in San Francisco.
The bigger urban cities are likely building more all around but it doesn’t get attention. People are awed over Austin’s new towers but act like NY doesn’t exist and IMO the skyline change has been more drastic despite the fact it’s already huge. Myself included! I’m more familiar with Austin’s new towers whereas NY… you just sort of expect new 1000 ft towers.
All that to say - mid-sized growing cities and people’s current cities are probably going to be over represented in most of these polls. What’s just normal construction in Philadelphia would probably be plastered all over the internet with daily pictures if it were in a sunbelt. In general, the places building more urban stuff are probably mostly glossed over from transit, to urban infill, to bike lanes. Despite all the growth in certain sunbelts, they’re still somehow falling behind more urban cities (including places like Minneapolis, Seattle, Denver and a few others) including ones that have lost population (yes. Somehow, places losing population or with meager growth has been building more, taller and transit)
Some cities get more coverage because a devoted local person or two post their city's updates in the national boards and in national threads.
How they post is also important. We all read differently but here's my take: I don't read most encyclopedic posts. A few paragraphs, a map, and a link or two probably get more readers than three pages and 20 links. On the flip side, a vague short statement and a link might not get many takers either.
New York also suffers from a unique problem. People will often specifically state that their analysis or list is "except New York." It's so far above everywhere else that they consider it not worth getting into. Understandably perhaps, but not great for NY's projects getting credit.
Location: That star on your map in the middle of the East Coast, DMV
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mhays25
Some cities get more coverage because a devoted local person or two post their city's updates in the national boards and in national threads.
How they post is also important. We all read differently but here's my take: I don't read most encyclopedic posts. A few paragraphs, a map, and a link or two probably get more readers than three pages and 20 links. On the flip side, a vague short statement and a link might not get many takers either.
New York also suffers from a unique problem. People will often specifically state that their analysis or list is "except New York." It's so far above everywhere else that they consider it not worth getting into. Understandably perhaps, but not great for NY's projects getting credit.
Yeah it's quite feasible to believe that the answer to the OP's options in the poll are really the usual suspects and current leaders in transit infrastructure already.
NYC
DC
LA
Seattle
Philly
etc.
The scale of one or two projects in many of these cities often equates to something much grander going up in a mid-sized or smaller metro.
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