Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The development of the Orange/Silver Metro corridor in Arlington VA is built similar to the Gold/Red MARTA corridor in Atlanta. Both have a unique set of zoning that allows high-rise development surrounding subway stations with adjacent single family home neighborhoods flanking both sides creating a linear urban high-rise area between single family homes which is a very rare combination in America. I can't think of any other areas in the country built similar to these two linear corridors.
They both have experienced a significant development boom over the last 10-years, and they are both really coming into their own from an urban living perspective. Which area is better for urban living and housing options (ability to live in high-rises and detached single family homes within walking distance)?
Boundaries
(Atlanta) Runs about 3 Miles
Art Center Station, Midtown Station, North Avenue Station, Civic Center Station, Peachtree Center Station, Five Points Station
(Arlington VA) Runs about 3 Miles
Ballston Station, Virginia Square Station, Clarendon Station, Court House Station, Rosslyn Station
Rate these areas based on these criteria:
-Highest Population
-Highest Population Density
-Most Office Space
-Most Residential Units
-Neighborhood Supporting Retail
-Walkability
-Grocery Stores
-Transit
-Vibrancy
-Fortune 500 Companies
-Surrounding Single Family Home Neighborhoods
Not sure this would be a fair comparison as the the Marta Red and Gold line corridor is running through the most urban part of the a major city, whereas Arlington is more or less just a DC suburb.
While I don't know anything about Arlington, my guess would be Atlanta would win in all of the categories except for the last one: Single family home neighborhoods
Arlington likely has higher transit shares and you can probably find a higher density census tracts in Arlington. But, on the whole midtown-downtown Atlanta is the core of major (albeit sprawling low density) MSA, while Arlington's Orange line is just an urban spur into to an inner ring suburb. There are some obviously similarities, high density modern urban-ism that quickly tranitions into not all that urban single family home areas.
But, Atl's core has major nightlife, civic theaters, museums, universities, major hotels, historic urban downtown core, a major urban park, the main gayborhood and urban yuppie neighborhood for the MSA. Arl's urbanism is 3 miles line and 1/2 mile wide. Atl's may also only be 3 miles line, but it it's far wider.
Not sure this would be a fair comparison as the the Marta Red and Gold line corridor is running through the most urban part of the a major city, whereas Arlington is more or less just a DC suburb.
While I don't know anything about Arlington, my guess would be Atlanta would win in all of the categories except for the last one: Single family home neighborhoods
Arlington is a heavy hitter and I’d say it possibly wins every category except maybe office space & Fortune 500’s (assuming we’re excluding the pentagon, Amazon, Boeing, etc in Crystal City which is like 2 miles away)
The population density of Arlington county is 9,418 people per sq. Mile. The Ballston-Rosslyn corridor well above that… Just along the Ballston-Rosslyn corridor there are over 50,000 residents. 18% of households along the corridor have no cars (and it’s high-income so it’s by choice…)
Ballston-Rosslyn corridor has a lot larger population density way more shopping, etc than really downtown or midtown. :/ IMO.
You don’t even have to pop out of metro to get to the AMC movies. Two targets, plenty of groceries and eating, pretty good selection of national retail chains like Pottery Barn, Barnes & Noble, etc etc
Atlanta definitely wins on having taller buildings though.
Arlington likely has higher transit shares and you can probably find a higher density census tracts in Arlington. But, on the whole midtown-downtown Atlanta is the core of major (albeit sprawling low density) MSA, while Arlington's Orange line is just an urban spur into to an inner ring suburb. There are some obviously similarities, high density modern urban-ism that quickly tranitions into not all that urban single family home areas.
But, Atl's core has major nightlife, civic theaters, museums, universities, major hotels, historic urban downtown core, a major urban park, the main gayborhood and urban yuppie neighborhood for the MSA. Arl's urbanism is 3 miles line and 1/2 mile wide. Atl's may also only be 3 miles line, but it it's far wider.
The point of this comparison is really about the unique living experience only these two areas provide with high-rises right next to detached single family homes anchored by subway stations. Do you know another area with those same characteristics? These two corridors provide very unique housing options right next to each other.
Arlington likely has higher transit shares and you can probably find a higher density census tracts in Arlington. But, on the whole midtown-downtown Atlanta is the core of major (albeit sprawling low density) MSA, while Arlington's Orange line is just an urban spur into to an inner ring suburb. There are some obviously similarities, high density modern urban-ism that quickly tranitions into not all that urban single family home areas.
But, Atl's core has major nightlife, civic theaters, museums, universities, major hotels, historic urban downtown core, a major urban park, the main gayborhood and urban yuppie neighborhood for the MSA. Arl's urbanism is 3 miles line and 1/2 mile wide. Atl's may also only be 3 miles line, but it it's far wider.
Pentagon City, Crystal City are part of Arlington. It’s only separated by Arlington Cemetery… this thread is talking specifically about Ballston-Rosslyn.
Arlington has campuses of universities. But I mean. If you expand out like. Less than a mile away is Georgetown. The county is 26 sq. Miles with over 238,000 people. And that includes Arlington Cemetery, National Airport and the Pentagon eating into some real estate. Atlanta is around only double the population of Arlington in 135 Sq. Miles
If you expand the core of Ballston-Rosslyn to the physical size of downtown-midtown… you’re starting to include some pretty large things… but these threads always start expanding and expanding boundaries and including this and that.
It’s a dense, large urban core. It just so happens to have be beside an even larger one (though it was part of DC… and it’s no less separated from central DC than Anacostia. And often times it’s more convenient to metro to Rosslyn and take a bus to Georgetown than taking a bus to Georgetown from Foggy Bottom DC.
If we were talking like. Cambridge, MA I’d be more likely to concur. I personally refer to Arlington as a suburb in everyday talk.. But Vs. “Greater Midtown” and downtown and in terms of urbanity, density etc. I mean. Bethesda is urban, etc It has great urbanity but I’d give the edge to Atlanta based on size. Even though I prefer Bethesda’s urbanity, it’s just too small to really say it’s more urban than Atlanta’s downtown/midtown. But Arlington is pretty large.
Last edited by Charlotte485; 11-26-2022 at 10:06 PM..
These two corridors couldn't be more different, they have almost zero in common.
Their built environment is very similar. Why do you say that? They’re anchored by a single subway line in their high density areas surrounded by low density detached single family homes. They have more in common with each other from a built environment standpoint than anywhere else.
I think one of their most unique and strongest attributes is the ability to live in the same neighborhood regardless of what your family requires as they age overtime. You can live in a high-rise as a young adult and move into a detached single family home as a married couple with children without ever leaving the neighborhood. What other neighborhood corridor with a heavy rail system allows that? I can’t think of any other city with that option.
Last edited by MDAllstar; 11-27-2022 at 09:06 AM..
Location: northern Vermont - previously NM, WA, & MA
10,749 posts, read 23,819,647 times
Reputation: 14665
Quote:
Originally Posted by MDAllstar
The point of this comparison is really about the unique living experience only these two areas provide with high-rises right next to detached single family homes anchored by subway stations. Do you know another area with those same characteristics? These two corridors provide very unique housing options right next to each other.
Their built environment is very similar. Why do you say that? They’re anchored by a single subway line in their high density areas surrounded by low density detached single family homes. They have more in common with each other from a built environment standpoint than anywhere else.
I think one of their most unique and strongest attributes is the ability to live in the same neighborhood regardless of what your family requires as they age overtime. You can live in a high-rise as a young adult and move into a detached single family home as a married couple with children without ever leaving the neighborhood. What other neighborhood corridor with a heavy rail system allows that? I can’t think of any other city with that option.
I know the goal is to look at this 3 mile corridors in isolation but the truth is is that it's impossible to do that. DC has and frankly as much as I hate to say this (because I also want ATL to be this way), historically and probably in the future been a strong advocate of growing and supporting WMATA. This is not how Atlanta treats MARTA, in the slightest. And it shows. So we can argue to and fro about how Atlanta's urban core competes with a DC suburb but at the end of the day with a more well-supported transit agency, it will be more articulated for that transportation mode, and see more growth for it which this post is asking for. Growth on say, the WMATA Yellow line (not even the line itself but say more employers more transit-oriented development), would support more growth on the WMATA's Orange/Silver in this corridor because it opens up the pool of potential riders, more people who can use the system and make transfers etc. and as a result more businesses and people will look at living/working/shopping etc. on or near the WMATA lines (any of them) as a positive since it will provide more access to the rest of the network.
MARTA has four lines, one barely justifies its existence (the green line), has not grown and barely been supported since basically it's inception. MARTA has a + shape, and for a good amount of all it's four lines, serve really only two corridors a N/S and a E/W with very little splitting or diversifying the areas it serves. This is not like the Metro which spreads a fair amount of directions across DC with multiple transfer points. MARTA will likely never expand it's heavy rail, unlike the Metro which just expanded it's silver line to Dulles not too long ago. MARTA is failing at even building light rail at this point which is a point of contention given that Atlantans voted for light rail and we may be getting BRT instead. All this points out to prospective residents, businesses etc. that being near the MARTA lines is not the big benefit as it would be to be near the WMATA. As a result while Atlanta's Midtown which is the main focus of this thread is growing significantly in positive ways, it's not outright displacing or changing the even more outrageous growth Atlanta is getting in the suburbs of say Alpharetta. While in DC I'd argue that a lot of it's growth is probably targeted more towards areas on or near the WMATA lines or in places where making a transfer to get on that system is easier (bus, regional rail, etc.) is plausible.
TL;DR These two cities are not the same in this aspect and really cannot be compared in good faith. Atlanta as a whole is a stronger and more powerful contender than Arlington and can pack a good punch against greater DC but within these two very specific corridors Arlington likely wins out, because this is all of what Arlington offers while Atlanta has a bunch of other competing nodes elsewhere not supported by MARTA and therefore, not contributing to even more heightened growth along the Midtown MARTA corridor (since residents/employers here do not value MARTA corridors in the way they do Metro corridors in DC since MARTA is very poorly connected with most of the city). Hope that makes sense.
Last edited by JMT; 12-02-2022 at 11:27 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
