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I am not bashing it, I am stating the truth. VA does not have anything to offer. DC is a real city not NOVA. I live here because I have no other choice. However I will move back up north in the future ASAP.
Actually, in terms of employment that's reversed. NOVA has more jobs than Downtown DC does, and is a much more business-friendly environment, hence the growth of the edge city that is Tysons Corner. And NOVA does not equal VA, as the area is distinct from the rest of the Commonwealth. Anyone who has lived/worked in the region for even a short amount of time should be familiar with the NOVA vs. ROVA rivalries that exist.
DC is not like New York, where the major employment centers are still downtown, with edge cities (White Plains, Stamford, Jersey City) supporting the core that is Manhattan. Most of DC is relatively small scale development, too, and parts of the city are very suburban in terms of character of development. Edge cities like Tysons Corner (though it's not actually an incorporated city) and Bethesda, MD are regional employment centers, though Tysons is turning into more of a corporate destination than Bethesda, complete with plans for increased density with the arrival of better mass transit options in the next few years.
DC is not without its problems, but there are some great neighborhoods where you can live if you're single, or a legal resident of another state so you actually have a vote that counts. In contrast, I know people who have left Georgetown for Arlington and actually prefer Arlington for the ease of normal things like parking one's car, especially since they're only 5-10 minutes away from the old neighborhood in Georgetown, and are closer to grocery stores, restaurants, and shops than they were in DC. I know many people who live in DC and their neighborhoods and houses look as though they live in Arlington, VA, McLean, VA, or even Bethesda, MD. Some houses in DC are even set on parcels of land that are well over an acre, so it's not an urban environment, despite being part of the city.
I don't know where you are in the region, but even the most die-hard suburban basher I know admits that NOVA has the right policies to attract jobs that pay well. DC does not because the political situation is a mess, and some good ideas never get off the ground. But the area has evolved to function as a region, as opposed to having all roads lead to DC as it was decades ago, when the area was much smaller.
It's a toss-up as to which is better, because it's completely subjective, and based upon an individual lifestyle. The areas border each other, and for most people, it's not uncommon to go to Virginia from DC or DC from Virginia for groceries, shopping, movies, entertainment, etc. Some areas are just separated by the river, in Arlington and Alexandria. Even suburbs closer to DC such as Fairfax and Mount Vernon are not so removed from the city where it's an event to go Downtown.
__________________
All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players: they have their exits and their entrances; and one man in his time plays many parts, his acts being seven ages.
~William Shakespeare (As You Like It Act II, Scene VII)
If you care about your right to vote (18+) - NoVa, MD, or WV.
If you are apolitical and are here for a stable FEDERAL government bureaucrat job - DC.
Don't forget the law firms. DC has far more lawyers per capita than any other city in the nation. :-)
Actually, I agree with the above poster that NoVa has a vibrant job market and greater suburban amenities compared to DC. But I prefer DC for its urbanity, world-renowned architecture and cultural vibrancy.
Last edited by BigCityDreamer; 05-21-2010 at 06:54 AM..
I don't think you are totally accurate about the employment thing. DT DC is right behind NYC & Chicago for daytime employment (400,000) population swells in it's DT core. Plus DT DC has more than 100 million square feet of office space and comparable office rents to Manhattan. DC is also adding millions of feet of office space with places like NOMA coming online. Tysons does have a lot of office space for a suburb but it does not compare to DT DC. Regardless of the transformation with metro coming in, it will still be a suburb. NOVA has always been a great business environment with places like Rossyln, Crystal City, Pentagon City and the Wilson Blvd corridor continuously expanding. On the Maryland side, Bethesda, Silver Spring and Rockville are also growing clusters. Also, you stated that DC does not attract jobs that pay well? I don't understand that comment. And that there are houses in DC that are not in an urban environment??? Don't understand that one either. Just because you have a little bit more space does not make it less urban.
Bigcity,
I don't know about more amenities unless you are considering Home Depot & Chain restaurants as a plus. Be that as it may, parts of NOVA are close enough to DC but you know you are not in the city by any shape of the imagination. DC is way more vibrant and pulsating than NOVA. You have to live in the city to understand it and appreciate it. Walk from Chinatown to Dupont Circle on a nice summer day. You can't get that type of vibe in NOVA.
Last edited by DC's Finest; 05-21-2010 at 09:04 AM..
I don't know about more amenities unless you are considering Home Depot & Chain restaurants as a plus. Be that as it may, parts of NOVA are close enough to DC but you know you are not in the city by any shape of the imagination. DC is way more vibrant and pulsating than NOVA. You have to live in the city to understand it and appreciate it. Walk from Chinatown to Dupont Circle on a nice summer day. You can't get that type of vibe in NOVA.
Yeah, I agree with most of what you're saying. It's just that some people want suburban things - shopping malls (like Tysons), chain restaurants, spacious/affordable living, less traffic (sometimes), good public schools, proximity to work, etc. I'm not saying those things are necessarily preferable to the culture and vibrancy of a real urban center though. Given a choice and if life were easier, I'd choose the latter.
Last edited by BigCityDreamer; 05-21-2010 at 09:50 AM..
DC for sure. I lived in both and the vibe is totally different. DC is fun, but a small city in the big picture. NOVA is a car suburb (terrible traffic outside the beltway, too).
I don't think you are totally accurate about the employment thing. DT DC is right behind NYC & Chicago for daytime employment (400,000) population swells in it's DT core. Plus DT DC has more than 100 million square feet of office space and comparable office rents to Manhattan. DC is also adding millions of feet of office space with places like NOMA coming online. Tysons does have a lot of office space for a suburb but it does not compare to DT DC.
I think his point was that VA has done a better job attracting companies who want to be headquartered in the region. There aren't many major companies whose headquarters are specifically in the District--DC is a hotbed for associations, law firms, nonprofits and smaller business, as well as the federal government, of course. But yes, in terms of employment centers and office space, there isn't a single NoVa jurisdiction that competes with DC.
Not sure if it has been mentioned, but I know a lot of the companies that moved out to the Dulles corridor used to be in DC until like early 90s or something when the tax situation encouraged the move.
I don't think you are totally accurate about the employment thing. DT DC is right behind NYC & Chicago for daytime employment (400,000) population swells in it's DT core. Plus DT DC has more than 100 million square feet of office space and comparable office rents to Manhattan. DC is also adding millions of feet of office space with places like NOMA coming online. Tysons does have a lot of office space for a suburb but it does not compare to DT DC. Regardless of the transformation with metro coming in, it will still be a suburb. NOVA has always been a great business environment with places like Rossyln, Crystal City, Pentagon City and the Wilson Blvd corridor continuously expanding. On the Maryland side, Bethesda, Silver Spring and Rockville are also growing clusters. Also, you stated that DC does not attract jobs that pay well? I don't understand that comment. And that there are houses in DC that are not in an urban environment??? Don't understand that one either. Just because you have a little bit more space does not make it less urban.
If you look at BLS statistics, using April 2010, Total Non-Farm Employment. DC is 771.6 and NOVA is 1296.3. Tysons is turning into a full-fledged edge city, not unlike White Plains in the NYC region, as it's a destination in its own right within the region, not just within NOVA. Bethesda is doing the same to a certain degree, on the Maryland side, but since the thread is DC vs. NOVA...
Regarding development in DC, there are neighborhoods where residential development has little difference, save for zip code as to the development pattern, where the neighborhoods are much less urbanized than what would be traditionally associated with a city. Arlington and Bethesda are typecast as suburbs, but only for the fact of a boundary, adjacent areas of Upper NW and the MacArthur/Palisades area are classified as urban? Yes, more space, having to drive to the grocery store, dry cleaner, etc. does make the area less urban, at least from my perspective, which is admittedly skewed by native New Yorker eyes, so please forgive that point as I find nearly all of DC to be less urban.
__________________
All the world's a stage, and all the men and women merely players: they have their exits and their entrances; and one man in his time plays many parts, his acts being seven ages.
~William Shakespeare (As You Like It Act II, Scene VII)
NoVa to Maryland: hello hood
Maryland to NoVa: hello pretentious snobville
Maryland to DC: i'm too lazy to get my ass down there.
DC to Maryland: what are you people even doing over there?
DC to NoVa: when did all you California transplants come here?
Nova to DC: we're the "real" reason all those tourists wanna come to the region.
Southeast DC to everyone: hello fresh meat. >;- )
Yeah Ballston is pretty nice. I also like Pentagon City area. But Ballston is probably the best TOD area in Arlington. However, when the economy comes back, Old Town Alexandria will be the best urban place in NOVA.
Right next to the Beautiful Upscale National Harbor, Maryland............
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