Visitor's perception of Cleveland and its burbs (Congress: house, theatre)

[october2007]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Why are ghettos on the east coast also more expensive than lots of good areas in the midwest?

I think I've gone over this before and nobody gives it a thought.

And no, people on the east coast are not any more anything than people in the Midwest. You might have more dramatic outliers, but I seriously doubt that your assertions have much behind them other than stereotypes.

The east coast is very desirable so most property is more expensive, even ghettos I guess.

I'm talking mostly about people in and around big cities on the coasts...but there are definitely cultural differences between the coasts (east and west) and the rest of the country. I speak in general terms and realize there are exceptions but I think values and interests are often different. There are things that you can attain or be exposed to in these major cities that you can't elsewhere or you would probably still be in Cleveland rather than in Boston.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by october2007

The east coast is very desirable so most property is more expensive, even ghettos I guess.

I'm talking mostly about people in and around big cities on the coasts...but there are definitely cultural differences between the coasts (east and west) and the rest of the country. I speak in general terms and realize there are exceptions but I think values and interests are often different. There are things that you can attain or be exposed to in these major cities that you can't elsewhere or you would probably still be in Cleveland rather than in Boston.

I assure you, the reason that mattapan is more expensive that Gordon square or shaker heights is not because even though mattapan (you might.know it as murderpan from your Boston days) is a violent ghetto, its still more desirable than Cleveland's top areas. Another question: why are some areas in North Dakota the most expensive in the country? These are actually rhetorical, please actually research housing markets and prices is my point.

Honestly there is nothing in Boston that you can't get in Cleveland. I have no idea what you're talking about to be honest. Maybe racism at baseball games? I personally can't wait to leave New England.

[october2007]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I assure you, the reason that mattapan is more expensive that Gordon square or shaker heights is not because even though mattapan (you might.know it as murderpan from your Boston days) is a violent ghetto, its still more desirable than Cleveland's top areas. Another question: why are some areas in North Dakota the most expensive in the country? These are actually rhetorical, please actually research housing markets and prices is my point.

Honestly there is nothing in Boston that you can't get in Cleveland. I have no idea what you're talking about to be honest. Maybe racism at baseball games? I personally can't wait to leave New England.

I don't understand the first part of your first paragraph. I have no idea why properties in North Dakota are so expensive but in general properties along coastlines are more expensive than in the rest of the country.

Boston (Cambridge) has Harvard if that's a plus. It also has more going on whether you like being there or not. And it has cache which matters to some. Hopefully you'll get out soon.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by october2007

I don't understand the first part of your first paragraph. I have no idea why properties in North Dakota are so expensive but in general properties along coastlines are more expensive than in the rest of the country.

Boston (Cambridge) has Harvard if that's a plus. It also has more going on whether you like being there or not. And it has cache which matters to some. Hopefully you'll get out soon.

My point was that housing prices are not a pure function of "desirability." Boston has a housing shortage that isn't necessarily related to simply sheer desirability. Same in North Dakota. Lots of regulatory and legal issues prevent supply from catching up with demand. The reason I mentioned North Dakota is because their rents are higher than Boston, so it cannot be explained by just "so many people want to live in a sophisticated big city like boston." Boston has a higher population than all of nd. Therefore that should tell you something about what goes on behind the scenes. It's not the case that the coastal cities cost more just because they're so awesome and everyone of course wants to live there.

Also there really isn't exceptionally much going on in Boston. There is a reason people go to NYC on weekends. Not sure what you're referencing. Boston is notoriously a boring city. Most here would agree (and that's one of the reasons it's preferable to NYC for example).

Honestly, Cleveland has arts that are just as good. Indie art is better in cle. Ask the local Bostonians about the music scene for example, it's terrible. Cleveland has more breweries which is crazy to me. Cleveland has more happy hours too (mass has 0). Cleveland cheaper entertainment and frequently it's a higher quality product too.

Getting off topic so I'm not gonna comment on this again. But suffice to say I think you overrate considerably Boston vs Cleveland.

[andrew61]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Honestly there is nothing in Boston that you can't get in Cleveland.

Want to know what I can't get in Cleveland? I can't stop and sit on a park bench and relax with a snack for a few minutes without someone coming along and blowing cigarette smoke in my face.

Backward, backward, backward.

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I personally can't wait to leave New England.

Then what's stopping you? For the moment, at least, this is still a freeish country.

[andrew61]

Originally Posted by october2007

I have no idea why properties in North Dakota are so expensive

There's an economic boom going on there due to oil. It means great-paying jobs -- and that even spreads to fast-food jobs that pay well above the norm in the rest of the country -- but it's also resulted in sky-high rents as well as more and more people move there to take advantage of the opportunities. People are moving there so fast that supply and demand has gotten a little out of whack.

[andrew61]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

Also there really isn't exceptionally much going on in Boston.

You should've moved to Chicago instead.

[october2007]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

My point was that housing prices are not a pure function of "desirability." Boston has a housing shortage that isn't necessarily related to simply sheer desirability. Same in North Dakota. Lots of regulatory and legal issues prevent supply from catching up with demand. The reason I mentioned North Dakota is because their rents are higher than Boston, so it cannot be explained by just "so many people want to live in a sophisticated big city like boston." Boston has a higher population than all of nd. Therefore that should tell you something about what goes on behind the scenes. It's not the case that the coastal cities cost more just because they're so awesome and everyone of course wants to live there.

Also there really isn't exceptionally much going on in Boston. There is a reason people go to NYC on weekends. Not sure what you're referencing. Boston is notoriously a boring city. Most here would agree (and that's one of the reasons it's preferable to NYC for example).

Honestly, Cleveland has arts that are just as good. Indie art is better in cle. Ask the local Bostonians about the music scene for example, it's terrible. Cleveland has more breweries which is crazy to me. Cleveland has more happy hours too (mass has 0). Cleveland cheaper entertainment and frequently it's a higher quality product too.

Getting off topic so I'm not gonna comment on this again. But suffice to say I think you overrate considerably Boston vs Cleveland.

I'll give you the happy hour criticism...that is too bad Boston doesn't really have them. But have you ever gone to the bar at the Taj (formerly the Ritz) and sat at a window table overlooking the Public Garden (if not, you should take your gf there)? I find that hard to beat. I didn't find Boston boring when I lived there in the 80s. There were so many foreign and independent films and theaters catering to them, coffee places (is the Algiers still in Cambridge??) - just loved walking Beacon Hill and Back Bay, coffee in the North End, Chinatown, MFA...but guess it doesn't suit you and your interests. Fair enough.

[october2007]

Originally Posted by andrew61

There's an economic boom going on there due to oil. It means great-paying jobs -- and that even spreads to fast-food jobs that pay well above the norm in the rest of the country -- but it's also resulted in sky-high rents as well as more and more people move there to take advantage of the opportunities. People are moving there so fast that supply and demand has gotten a little out of whack.

Oh...right...I did hear something about that but thought the boom was over.

[october2007]

Late Saturday morning bustle of downtown Cleveland - subtitle: Why do I feel like I'm the last person on earth??