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Old 07-14-2017, 09:29 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,420,786 times
Reputation: 7217

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This forum always has been plagued by those, sometimes newcomers, but more often former Clevelanders who have moved elsewhere, who get great psychological satisfaction focusing often everything negative in Cleveland. Their rants typically are devoid of facts, and characterized by a failure to respond when factual support is requested to validate their opinions posited as facts.

Post 106 in this thread challenged one of the chief Cleveland downers to provide support for his "Fatherless America" rants. Surprise -- no response.

I doubt if there is a single major city in the U.S. where you couldn't engage in the same game, sometimes even more shockingly so than in Cleveland.

San Francisco:

BART takeover robbery: 40 to 60 teens swarm train, hold up riders - SFGate

Mob-style robbery on BART wasn't the first time: 2 Investigates - Story | KTVU

What's truly disturbing is that these posters are shockingly indifferent to the causative issues of violent crime, and instead attribute the violence and economic hardships to only to conditions to perceived moral ills such as fatherless families, but, as in this thread, offer absolutely no evidence to back up their claims. Rather than deal with a substantive discussion, they attack "liberals."

Heck, I'm no liberal, and from what I've seen, these posters aren't conservatives. E.g., one of the active downers in this thread vehemently supported a massive increase in Cleveland's minimum wage in another thread.

Is the cheap availability of guns, even for those who are mentally ill, deemed to be a bedrock of conservative thought? Was this assailant schizophrenic and not receiving treatment?

Beachwood man killed in shooting by man harassing people on Cleveland bus | cleveland.com

There is are IMO certain disturbing mentalities at work that focus on crimes such as this one, and never ask why. For an elderly woman, who feels threatened by every crime in a large metropolitan area, Cleveland, and most major U.S. cities, likely is not a good living option. Surprise!!! I understand those not choosing to live in Cleveland proper, because I've repeatedly made that same choice, but greatly because I enjoy living near natural areas.

Yet, proactive members of a community of any age, focus on eliminating problems, not just complaining about them ad nauseam.

Post 26 was a balanced post and linked this article showing that Cleveland is not at the bottom of the pit of American cities, an impression left by many of the downers in this thread.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/money...rica/91227778/

In this forum, I've seen Baltimore and Milwaukee touted as preferable alternatives to Cleveland, yet they, and not Cleveland, are listed among the 10 most dangerous cities in the U.S. And , I've known scores of persons who lived in Cleveland and nearby suburbs. Only one suffered from a violent crime, and that was in a tough neighborhood and I wouldn't say that urban smarts were be employed.

Last edited by WRnative; 07-14-2017 at 10:14 AM..

 
Old 07-14-2017, 10:07 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,420,786 times
Reputation: 7217
Default Cities more violent than Cleveland

In this list based on an analysis utilizing the most recent FBI statistics, St. Louis is ranked the most violent city.

<<
In many cases, the reason for the heightened violence is the lack of law-abiding activities, including — La Vigne noted — employment opportunities. The unemployment rate exceeds the national rate of 5.3% in 19 of the 25 cities with the highest violent crime rates.


Several other social and economic factors have been tied to high violent crime. The vast majority of the cities with the highest violent crime rates tend to also report very low incomes, high poverty, and low educational attainment.


The cause and effect relationship between violent crime and measures of social well-being such as poverty, educational attainment, and employment can go in both directions. For example, people living in high-crime neighborhoods can suffer from stress and other negative social and health outcomes that can limit their chances to obtain an education and gainful employment. Or, businesses may be less likely to locate in high-crime neighborhoods, effectively limiting employment opportunities for local residents.>>

http://247wallst.com/special-report/...es-in-america/

Detroit is number 2, Milwaukee is number 5, Baltimore is number 7 and Kansas City is number 10.

Indianapolis is number 13, Washington, DC, is number 15, Atlanta is 19, and Buffalo is 20.

Tallahassee is 24 and Minneapolis is 25.

Cleveland didn't rank as one of the 25 most violent cities on this list.

Last edited by WRnative; 07-14-2017 at 10:19 AM..
 
Old 07-14-2017, 10:26 AM
 
Location: Cleveland and Columbus OH
11,052 posts, read 12,432,741 times
Reputation: 10385
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
In this list based on an analysis utilizing the most recent FBI statistics, St. Louis is ranked the most violent city.

<<
In many cases, the reason for the heightened violence is the lack of law-abiding activities, including — La Vigne noted — employment opportunities. The unemployment rate exceeds the national rate of 5.3% in 19 of the 25 cities with the highest violent crime rates.


Several other social and economic factors have been tied to high violent crime. The vast majority of the cities with the highest violent crime rates tend to also report very low incomes, high poverty, and low educational attainment.


The cause and effect relationship between violent crime and measures of social well-being such as poverty, educational attainment, and employment can go in both directions. For example, people living in high-crime neighborhoods can suffer from stress and other negative social and health outcomes that can limit their chances to obtain an education and gainful employment. Or, businesses may be less likely to locate in high-crime neighborhoods, effectively limiting employment opportunities for local residents.>>

The Most Dangerous Cities in America - 24/7 Wall St.

Detroit is number 2, Milwaukee is number 5, Baltimore is number 7 and Kansas City is number 10.

Indianapolis is number 13, Washington, DC, is number 15, Atlanta is 19, and Buffalo is 20.

Tallahassee is 24 and Minneapolis is 25.

Cleveland didn't rank as one of the 25 most violent cities on this list.
Minneapolis over Cleveland? Wow.
 
Old 07-14-2017, 10:42 AM
 
Location: Ipswich, MA
840 posts, read 759,173 times
Reputation: 974
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
In this list based on an analysis utilizing the most recent FBI statistics, St. Louis is ranked the most violent city.

<<
In many cases, the reason for the heightened violence is the lack of law-abiding activities, including — La Vigne noted — employment opportunities. The unemployment rate exceeds the national rate of 5.3% in 19 of the 25 cities with the highest violent crime rates.


Several other social and economic factors have been tied to high violent crime. The vast majority of the cities with the highest violent crime rates tend to also report very low incomes, high poverty, and low educational attainment.


The cause and effect relationship between violent crime and measures of social well-being such as poverty, educational attainment, and employment can go in both directions. For example, people living in high-crime neighborhoods can suffer from stress and other negative social and health outcomes that can limit their chances to obtain an education and gainful employment. Or, businesses may be less likely to locate in high-crime neighborhoods, effectively limiting employment opportunities for local residents.>>

The Most Dangerous Cities in America - 24/7 Wall St.

Detroit is number 2, Milwaukee is number 5, Baltimore is number 7 and Kansas City is number 10.

Indianapolis is number 13, Washington, DC, is number 15, Atlanta is 19, and Buffalo is 20.

Tallahassee is 24 and Minneapolis is 25.

Cleveland didn't rank as one of the 25 most violent cities on this list.
I saw the most recent FBI list online which said it was the most current and was using 2015 data. It also said that Cleveland wasn't ranked because the FBI didn't provide data for Cleveland.
 
Old 07-14-2017, 10:45 AM
 
11,610 posts, read 10,420,786 times
Reputation: 7217
Quote:
Originally Posted by october2007 View Post
I saw the most recent FBI list online which said it was the most current and was using 2015 data. It also said that Cleveland wasn't ranked because the FBI didn't provide data for Cleveland.
Link???
 
Old 07-14-2017, 03:08 PM
 
Location: Cleveland, OH USA / formerly Chicago for 20 years
4,069 posts, read 7,312,310 times
Reputation: 3062
Quote:
Originally Posted by Minervah View Post
Yes. My point is that crime is ticking upward in many cities in many upscale neighborhoods. Cleveland doesn't have a lock on that. The neighborhood where those two young men were knifed to death on the Portland light rail was recently gentrified. My former neighborhood, the first to become gentrified is now although very upscale is one in which crime is on the upswing.
I saw it going on in Chicago too, in the last few years before I left. In particular, the gentrified Lakeview community, which is where I lived.
 
Old 07-14-2017, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Cleveland
816 posts, read 1,394,851 times
Reputation: 418
Man tied to fatal police-involved shooting accused of raping girl at gunpoint in downtown Cleveland | cleveland.com

Man robbed, shot in Tremont after bumping gunman, police say | cleveland.com

Both incidences just happened recently.

And these are supposed to be our "nice" neighborhoods

Can't escape the Cleveland thugs, wherever you're at!
 
Old 07-14-2017, 05:17 PM
 
Location: Ipswich, MA
840 posts, read 759,173 times
Reputation: 974
Quote:
Originally Posted by october2007 View Post
I saw the most recent FBI list online which said it was the most current and was using 2015 data. It also said that Cleveland wasn't ranked because the FBI didn't provide data for Cleveland.
I saw it on lawstreetmedia.com Maybe they were talking about last year?
 
Old 07-14-2017, 05:26 PM
 
Location: Ipswich, MA
840 posts, read 759,173 times
Reputation: 974
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clevelander216 View Post
Man tied to fatal police-involved shooting accused of raping girl at gunpoint in downtown Cleveland | cleveland.com

Man robbed, shot in Tremont after bumping gunman, police say | cleveland.com

Both incidences just happened recently.

And these are supposed to be our "nice" neighborhoods

Can't escape the Cleveland thugs, wherever you're at!

It does seem like crime is up in lots of cities - maybe a combination of the drug problem, mental health issues, gangs. I do find it troubling that you can't just avoid certain "bad" areas and that crime seems to be seeping into previously safe areas.

Although I don't really worry too much about being a victim of crime in Cleveland (sometimes think it's more dangerous trying to cross a street here) I'd like to see more effort made to deal with it especially in the areas where people are hearing gunshots on a regular basis. That's crazy.
 
Old 07-14-2017, 06:04 PM
 
Location: Boston, MA
3,970 posts, read 5,762,977 times
Reputation: 4721
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clevelander216 View Post
Man tied to fatal police-involved shooting accused of raping girl at gunpoint in downtown Cleveland | cleveland.com

Man robbed, shot in Tremont after bumping gunman, police say | cleveland.com

Both incidences just happened recently.

And these are supposed to be our "nice" neighborhoods

Can't escape the Cleveland thugs, wherever you're at!
That punk in the first article's picture has that "So what if I had done it, you're gonna do something to me?" smirk on his face. Why not since he got out once already after quick time. That's another problem. To normally raised citizens, the thought of getting arrested much less going to prison for even a day is already a shameful thought in our minds. We'd never want to give up our education, our jobs, and our future to go to prison. These individuals have no pride in themselves and no future other than what they're doing right now and they seem to be getting away with it more often than not.
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