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My son's girlfriend just cemented her temporary job with a large corporation because she just happened to notice their Spanish translations were just awful. She has been bilingual since grade school, and is very well versed in the nuances of both languages. It would be hard for a high school Spanish person to compete with that.
- English will be even more important in the business world, already many places operate internationally in English only in regards to business. This will become even more so as everyone's second language becomes English.
- Translating and the whole language skills thing is almost 100% low paid translating work. There are a few people who have gotten their name out there and make good money, but it really is low wage, tedious work. Contractors basically rule this area, with companies and the gov contracting out their needs to these translation services. The old stereotype of "you know languages! The State Department will hire you!" is non-sense. There are very few direct language roles available in the gov; a person needs a high degree of fluency in writing, reading , and speaking; in country experience; ability to pass the clearance process; a degree often an advance degree with work experience; a certification in which the most advanced certification is actually a two year graduate course, and very few places offer this course like the University of Maryland.
- Social services will continue to have the need of translators on the informal level, such as fielding calls and assistance to residents. These language skills do not need a high degree of fluency and accuracy, and range from just speaking (as many heritage language skills are just speaking skills), to reading and writing; but nothing near the proficiency needed for legal items associated with business transactions, heck, many native English speakers do not have the vocabulary and skills to read, let alone write, legal and business documents in English.
If you want to make money, do not major in languages. Even if you are gifted, you will not make any money. The only people making any money are native speakers, and even they do not make very much.
These days, companies and schools are simply hiring native speakers from other countries: the visa is a write-off and the native speakers often speak English. Moreover, being a native speaker carries more prestige and respect: a non-native will never be considered as qualified as a native speaker, no matter the amount of education, training and experience.
The problem with native speakers is that you can't always trust their loyalty. Some of them side with their compatriots, and criticize the project they're working for. I've been on an assignment working alongside a native speaker who got fired because of this, and I was retained. I've also been in a position to hire a native speaker, and the same thing happened. In fact, a non-native-speaker volunteer who accompanied the group was much more knowledgeable about the specialized vocabulary involved in the project. The native speaker couldn't do the job when it came down to the technical language. So I always advise people to hire non-native speakers. They'll never betray their employer or badmouth them to the foreign guests. There is definitely a demand for skilled non-Native speakers!
The problem with native speakers is that you can't always trust their loyalty. Some of them side with their compatriots, and criticize the project they're working for. I've been on an assignment working alongside a native speaker who got fired because of this, and I was retained. I've also been in a position to hire a native speaker, and the same thing happened. In fact, a non-native-speaker volunteer who accompanied the group was much more knowledgeable about the specialized vocabulary involved in the project. The native speaker couldn't do the job when it came down to the technical language. So I always advise people to hire non-native speakers. They'll never betray their employer or badmouth them to the foreign guests. There is definitely a demand for skilled non-Native speakers!
This is why i was alluding to that it is more than just "language skills"; related to my example in my previous post, there are numerous native English speakers who do not possess the vocabulary and skills to read, let alone write, legal and business documents. There is a lot to having language skills.
That is why cert programs like at the University of Maryland are considered the gold standard to have, and agencies like the State Department have their own tests.
Despite the hype around heritage speakers, their language skills are mediocre at best, good enough for conversational and that is about it. Great for social services and customer service areas, poor for any professional job.
This is why i was alluding to that it is more than just "language skills"; related to my example in my previous post, there are numerous native English speakers who do not possess the vocabulary and skills to read, let alone write, legal and business documents. There is a lot to having language skills.
That is why cert programs like at the University of Maryland are considered the gold standard to have, and agencies like the State Department have their own tests.
Despite the hype around heritage speakers, their language skills are mediocre at best, good enough for conversational and that is about it. Great for social services and customer service areas, poor for any professional job.
hmm. Well, people usually differentiate between "heritage speakers" and "native speakers". I had in mind immigres who are fluent in English as well as their home language. They're the ones whose loyalty can be iffy, though one can't generalize broadly.
The context in which I've heard the term "heritage speakers" is with the American-born children of immigres. Often their skills in their heritage language isn't good enough even to pass a 2nd- or 3rd- year university exam in their language, let alone function as an interpreter. But some heritage speakers are excellent, and being US-born-and-raised, I'd be more inclined to trust them.
I'm not sure why this thread was revived, but the languages that are most in demand with the US gov't security services are the Central Asian Turkic languages, various Near Eastern languages, Afghan languages, and so forth. Russian is still on the list, AFAIK, and certainly Chinese (Mandarin and probably Cantonese as well).
Disclaimer: This post is from the standpoint of studying languages "to make money", not for the love. My personal preference and recommendation is to study a language you like from a country/culture you're genuinely interested in.
Conventional wisdom says to study "profitable" languages.
French, Arabic, Spanish are I'd say the big three right now.
The argument is that those are languages with both the geographic size, and political and/or cultural and/or economic relevance to be "worth" studying.
However, I've noticed that increasingly French, Arabic and Spanish native speakers are reasonably competent in English. This for me is one advantage of being raised in a non-english speaking country, almost by default you'll be bilingual. Anyway, doesn't that kind of lower the "prestige" of knowing these langauges?
Also would outsourcing and technology (i.e. instant interpretation by people or computers) affect the prestige of knowing French or Spanish?
Assuming you are asking which languages, if developed to reasonable fluency, could benefit one's career significantly, then I think the list would be quite long. Thinking about the next 25 years, I would include, at least: Spanish, French, German, Mandarin, Cantonese, Japanese, Korean, Russian, Arabic, Farsi, Turkish, Portuguese, Dutch, Danish, Swedish, Norwegian, Vietnamese, Hindi, Urdu, Thai, Tagalog, Indonesian, Somali, Swahili, Hausa, Igbo, Yoruba, Georgian, Tamil, Bengali, and others. For one intending to use a language in their profession, I highly recommend studying abroad in an immersive program, preferably during university years.
Quote:
Originally Posted by figmalt
It's highly unlikely computers will ever perfect the semantic and pragmatic nuances necessary for translation. By this I mean things like sarcasm, double entendres, "reading between the lines," etc. Language is not just about words, it's also about culture and society, things that you develop intuitively as a speaker. It's nearly impossible to program all of that into computer translation. However, I do agree that the programs are getting better and better. I would say whether you choose computer or human depends on the type and purpose of your translation.
I wouldn't bet against technology on being able to give us a reasonable approximation of meaning in the near future. But I don't think that human language ability is going to be obsolete in the near future, either. What happens when you are making an important deal and your Google translator gives a dangerously incorrect translation or runs out of power?
Quote:
Originally Posted by superseiyan
Nice discussion.
1. In my original post, for me, i didn't mean "languages" as a field of study like majoring in a language. i meant the utility/novelty/business advantage of knowing an advantage in whatever field in addition to what you do. My suspicion was that the advantage is becoming reduced as boundaries fall, and therefore there's native speakers available on the market if needed, and also because most people speak English already.
2. I see lots of people saying *I or so and so* did X, therefore X happens all the time. We should always be careful not to assume a unique situation is widely applicable or is happening all the time everywhere (although it is certainly good in that it sheds light and shows it is possible).
3. I think automated/computer translation is a real consideration. It can't replace humans for sure, but other than very sensitive or high-level instant translation requirements, I'm sure they'll start creeping in the picture. It's like how you still need accountants, they wont' go away, but nonetheless automated tax software has chipped into some of their domain.
If you are trying to bid for a contract, for example, in Qatar, then I think that knowledge of Arabic would give you a significant advantage over competitors who are only proficient in international English. The bottom line matters, but so do personal relationships.
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