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The reason why I said poli sci is because of the career opportunities you can get with a BA and MA in the field. Here are some facts about Political science that AREN'T bad like some of this posters are trying to say.
According to the U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS), employment for political scientists was expected to grow 19% from 2008 to 2018, a higher rate than other professions. Graduates of master's or Ph.D. degree programs have a significant advantage in the job market, although there is heavy competition for teaching positions at universities. The BLS reported in May 2010 that the median annual wage of political scientists was $107,420 (U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics). Industries Employing Political Science Majors
As reported by the BLS in 2009, the industries that employed the most political scientists with degrees of all levels were the federal executive branch of government, scientific research and development services, colleges and universities, local governmental bodies and social advocacy organizations. The breakdown of the annual 2009 mean wage of these industries is as follows:
Federal executive branch $114,040
Scientific research and development services $77,160
Colleges and universities $54,190
Local governmental bodies $83,790
Social advocacy organizations $77,410
Geographic Concentration of Employed Political Scientists
The states and cities with the most political science workers are broken down using information reported by BLS and include the 2009 annual mean wage for each location. States with the Most Political Science Workers
District of Columbia $111,730
Virginia $130,850
Washington $64,990
Colorado $62,470
California $69,280
Metropolitan Areas with the Most Political Science Workers
Thing is - if everyone went out and get STEM degrees, the value of those degrees and the salaries given would plummet. It's just a basic economic fact; one of the key reasons that humanities and social science degrees are so devalued today. Too many people got them.
It doesn't make sense to me to push someone without the aptitude into a STEM degree. Does the world really need more mediocre engineers?
A mediocre engineer adds more value to society than a good political science undergrad.
A mediocre engineer adds more value to society than a good political science undergrad.
really? You prefer badly designed bridges to well written policy papers (or small town journalism, or whatever other general office work a poli sci undergrad would be qualified to do)? Seems like mediocre engineers would have the potential to add more costs to society. (see katrina 2005 and minneapolis 2007)
really? You prefer badly designed bridges to well written policy papers (or small town journalism, or whatever other general office work a poli sci undergrad would be qualified to do)? Seems like mediocre engineers would have the potential to add more costs to society. (see katrina 2005 and minneapolis 2007)
What percentage of poli sci majors who doesn't go to grad school writes policy papers? And small town journalism is fairly useless.
Besides, do you really think mediocre engineers actually design bridges? Mediocre engineers write technical specs and do grunt work analysis. You are dreaming (or ignorant of the technical world) if you think anyone but the best of the best gets to work on something where lives are actually at stake.
What percentage of poli sci majors who doesn't go to grad school writes policy papers? And small town journalism is fairly useless.
Besides, do you really think mediocre engineers actually design bridges? Mediocre engineers write technical specs and do grunt work analysis. You are dreaming (or ignorant of the technical world) if you think anyone but the best of the best gets to work on something where lives are actually at stake.
So you expect bright people with an aptitude for the non-technical to struggle through technical programs to do grunt work when they could do much more interesting work in a field which they are better suited? It makes little sense and would only serve to reduce the wages of the people in those technical fields.
The average engineering student might add more value to the economy (as distinct from society) than the average poli sci major, but good poli sci majors are often much better problem solvers and have the potential to go further in their careers than pure technocrats. I think the breadth of some of these liberal arts, social science degrees prepare people (with outside training in a particular field) to go beyond middle management. If you look at high ranking execs, lots of them have undergrad degrees in history or polisci and picked up an MBA while working.
And if you graduate from some of the best schools, companies will recruit you regardless of major. Google has tons of communications and poli sci majors from the Ivys and places like Michigan working for them.
Futhermore, I dispute your definition of societal value. Small town journalism is hardly useless to society. It's often the only form of coverage of local government. You want to see real corruption, get rid of the newspaper reporters.
I know a lot of poli sci and history BAs in state and local political offices, running campaigns and handling communications. The "value" of this is debatable, but the influence isn't.
Furthermore, poli sci and psychology BAs do quite well in the business world (particularly psychology majors) with some outside skills, usually picked up on the job. I know of two psychology BAs from third tier colleges quite high up in the IT world as project managers. Learning about the psychology of organizations and motivations is not useless.
Again, a humanities degree (without internships) is not the best route to a high paying job immediately after graduation. But it does add value that purely technical degrees do not.
So you expect bright people with an aptitude for the non-technical to struggle through technical programs to do grunt work when they could do much more interesting work in a field which they are better suited? It makes little sense and would only serve to reduce the wages of the people in those technical fields.
With all due respect, yes. We have an overabundance of non-technical people. Our country is getting killed in STEM simply because so many people think those skills cannot be easily learned.
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The average engineering student might add more value to the economy (as distinct from society) than the average poli sci major, but good poli sci majors are often much better problem solvers and have the potential to go further in their careers than pure technocrats. I think the breadth of some of these liberal arts, social science degrees prepare people (with outside training in a particular field) to go beyond middle management. If you look at high ranking execs, lots of them have undergrad degrees in history or polisci and picked up an MBA while working.
I strongly disagree with this. The average poli sci major is completely clueless on how to solve real problems.
Further, I am talking about a poli sci major who does not want to go to grad school. Name a single top ranking exec who has a poli sci major and does not have a graduate degree. If you want to major in poli sci and plan on going to grad school, then that is a completely different conversation.
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And if you graduate from some of the best schools, companies will recruit you regardless of major. Google has tons of communications and poli sci majors from the Ivys and places like Michigan working for them.
The majority of people are not in the best schools. If the OP is at harvard, then we can have that conversation, however making the assumption that a person is going to a top school is fairly stupid.
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Futhermore, I dispute your definition of societal value. Small town journalism is hardly useless to society. It's often the only form of coverage of local government. You want to see real corruption, get rid of the newspaper reporters.
I disagree. We have more than enough people willing to do that work already. We do NOT have enough people in technology/engineering.
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I know a lot of poli sci and history BAs in state and local political offices, running campaigns and handling communications. The "value" of this is debatable, but the influence isn't.
Furthermore, poli sci and psychology BAs do quite well in the business world (particularly psychology majors) with some outside skills, usually picked up on the job. I know of two psychology BAs from third tier colleges quite high up in the IT world as project managers. Learning about the psychology of organizations and motivations is not useless.
Again, a humanities degree (without internships) is not the best route to a high paying job immediately after graduation. But it does add value that purely technical degrees do not.
I know what you are saying, but there is a fairly significant influx of those type of people already. What we really need are people who understand how to be social (not the stereotypical awkward engineer) who know the technical aspects of a job as well. Learning about psychology is absolutely useful! Major in IT and read about psychology on the side. Don't do it the other way around.
Also, as a side note, most of the non-technical people I work with who are technical managers are very terrible at their jobs.
A mediocre engineer adds more value to society than a good political science undergrad.
Depends on the engineer and polysci person. The Soviet Union could have used a few more liberty minded social scientists than nuclear bomb making engineers.
Many engineers come from the 3rd world or near 3rd world, those places could also use a few better minded social science types than producing engineers that want to leave the country.
Look at Adman Smith for example, not an engineer, but he set forth the environment in which engineers could prosper.
After much deliberation, i have decided to drop the psychology class.
Reason being that:
- i feel that PS has quite similar skills to law and many PS students get to join debating contests and youth political organisations. Talking about opportunities to hone their written and oral communication skills which employers are seeking nowadays
- though i'm quite interested in organisational psychology, i realised that it requires Masters which i probably can't afford by the time i graduate from my bachelors
- as i last checked on several websites including PayScale, PS graduates are paid much higher than psychology grads at both entry and mid-career level.
- as someone who suck at math and sciences, the scientific components in psychology just turn me off :@
There are other reasons of course but it will be endless.
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