Will Columbus become largest Ohio metro? (Cleveland, Marion: big home, places to live, cost)

[midwest1]

This link reminded me of this thread. CombsBBQ has been rated best in Ohio.

https://www.onlyinyourstate.com/ohio...ntent=nlimage1

[midwest1]

Spooky Nook, the world's largest sports training facility opened today. Guessing the C-bus media is not covering this, a rather huge story for the state of Ohio. And for the city of Hamilton, Butler County....and the CBD Metroplex. Note this is Dayton media. The D covering the B.


https://www.dayton.com/news/people-p...GSY7KFGCFPNDI/

[pontiac51]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

Now we're going to devolve into conspiracy theories over something as mundane as an MSA designation? SMH.

Here are the standards that have been in places for 20 years. https://www.govinfo.gov/content/pkg/...f/00-32997.pdf
To form a new metro:
-Have a Census-defined urbanized area containing at least 50,000 people or a Census-defined urban cluster of at least 10,000. In both cases, these are referred to as urban areas.
-The central county of a designated metro area has to have at least 50 percent of their population in urban areas of at least 10,000 population, or have within their boundaries a population of at least 5,000 located in a single urban area of at least 10,000 population.

The criteria to add outlying counties to core/central counties:
-Have at least 25 percent of the employed residents of the county work in the central county or counties.
-Have at least 25 percent of the employment in the county be accounted for by workers who reside in the central county or counties.
-Have to be contiguous to other counties in a metro, and can only be in one metro area at a time.

To merge 2 separate metro areas:
-If the central county of one metro meets the criteria of an "outlying county" for another metro, meaning that at least 25% of its own workforce commutes to the core county of another metro, or otherwise accounts for 25% of the other core county's workforce.
-Local opinion is in favor of combination in both metro areas.

So outlying counties largely just need to be contiguous and have 25% commuting to the core, as I said. Combining Dayton and Cincinnati would require that Montgomery or Hamilton County have at least 25% of its workforce going to the other, which is a very high standard to meet on its own, which is why you only very rarely see 2 large metros merged. The only potential "politics" involved is that public opinion in both metros has to be in favor of merging. The reality is that the 1st standard for merging has not been met and likely will never be met. Dayton is big enough where it's highly unlikely that at least a quarter of its own workforce will travel to Hamilton County for employment. The same is true going the other way, so the 2nd part requiring public approval is irrelevant.

But only the US' Office of Budget and Management set the standards for what make US metropolitan areas. Different nations may have different standards and criteria, but the OBM sets them for US cities and it's always been that way. It doesn't matter what Demographia, non-government or non-US entities or organizations say or what criteria they use. There is only one official designation. The only people making up their own definitions are the people who are ignoring the ones above.

I'm really not trying to be difficult or discount anything. I just think that the standards set- which are applied equally to all metros across the country- should also be equally applied to metros in Ohio, and they are. What any of us want or personally believe doesn't matter.

Most of us, including myself, are quite familiar with the requirements, and the fact that you took the time to copy and paste this doesn't give you a good look!!

Again. you are extremely naive if you believe that EVERY MSA/CSA in the country meets the commuting requirements! You are also extremely naive to think that local opinions, in other words, politics, aren't a factor in putting these together. For example, Balt/DC will never ever become an MSA because of politics. Hartford/Springfield, 20 miles apart, will never ever become an MSA or CSA because of local politics. Daytonnati probably meets the requirements for a CSA, but my guess is that Dayton officials don't want any part of it. So this isn't about conspiracy theories; it's about politics. And common sense!

My point about looking at various metro area definitions, govt and non govt, is that they all have flaws. Some are too broad, others are too narrow. Yes Columbus will probably be the largest MSA in Ohio at some point. But we also know that Columbus is a farm metro! In other words, only a small percent of the area is actually developed, unlike other major metropolitan areas. So that's why it's fair to look at more than one list. But I know, being the Columbus booster that you are, you're just going to find the one that makes you feel good, and that's it!

[216facts]

Originally Posted by pontiac51

Most of us, including myself, are quite familiar with the requirements, and the fact that you took the time to copy and paste this doesn't give you a good look!!

Again. you are extremely naive if you believe that EVERY MSA/CSA in the country meets the commuting requirements! You are also extremely naive to think that local opinions, in other words, politics, aren't a factor in putting these together. For example, Balt/DC will never ever become an MSA because of politics. Hartford/Springfield, 20 miles apart, will never ever become an MSA or CSA because of local politics. Daytonnati probably meets the requirements for a CSA, but my guess is that Dayton officials don't want any part of it. So this isn't about conspiracy theories; it's about politics. And common sense!

My point about looking at various metro area definitions, govt and non govt, is that they all have flaws. Some are too broad, others are too narrow. Yes Columbus will probably be the largest MSA in Ohio at some point. But we also know that Columbus is a farm metro! In other words, only a small percent of the area is actually developed, unlike other major metropolitan areas. So that's why it's fair to look at more than one list. But I know, being the Columbus booster that you are, you're just going to find the one that makes you feel good, and that's it!

Its not going to be a farm metro for long: https://www.nbc4i.com/intel-in-ohio/...in-new-albany/

In fact it is not a farm metro at all. It has arrived. We used to call it a cow town a few decades ago, but that is all passe now. Columbus as a city will probably go over 1M in about 4 or 5 years. Its metro area will surpass Pittsburgh's in the next 10 years and its demographics (think suburbs, young families, lots of jobs) will power its CSA towards 3M where Cleveland's CSA is now.

One can make comparisons with Cleveland's MSA but its not a good comparison, since it does not include the Akron metro in the next county - which is absurd. Nonetheless, I give credit to Columbus where it is deserved and they are growing like gangbusters and there is no end in sight.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by 216facts

Its not going to be a farm metro for long: https://www.nbc4i.com/intel-in-ohio/...in-new-albany/

In fact it is not a farm metro at all. It has arrived. We used to call it a cow town a few decades ago, but that is all passe now. Columbus as a city will probably go over 1M in about 4 or 5 years. Its metro area will surpass Pittsburgh's in the next 10 years and its demographics (think suburbs, young families, lots of jobs) will power its CSA towards 3M where Cleveland's CSA is now.

One can make comparisons with Cleveland's MSA but its not a good comparison, since it does not include the Akron metro in the next county - which is absurd. Nonetheless, I give credit to Columbus where it is deserved and they are growing like gangbusters and there is no end in sight.

ehhh kinda disagree though, the character of columbus is indeed cow townish. it's made up of lots of small town ohioans who in any other century would have grown up and been farmers. now they have office jobs and can't work in Marysville or Richwood or Marion or whatever. Outside of the center few neighborhoods, you don't find much anything to suggest you live in a capital, or even medium sized city.

a lot of columbus is more like this https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0474...7i16384!8i8192

[BRNorth]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

ehhh kinda disagree though, the character of columbus is indeed cow townish. it's made up of lots of small town ohioans who in any other century would have grown up and been farmers. now they have office jobs and can't work in Marysville or Richwood or Marion or whatever. Outside of the center few neighborhoods, you don't find much anything to suggest you live in a capital, or even medium sized city.

a lot of columbus is more like this https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0474...7i16384!8i8192

Looking at the aerial imagery of that site you picked, you literally chose the most sparsely populated street for miles around. I am not saying Columbus is Boston dense, but for as much as everyone loves to paint Columbus as nothing but sunbelt-built, it has dense and walkable neighborhoods with unique architecture that most sunbelt cities do not have.

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by BRNorth

Looking at the aerial imagery of that site you picked, you literally chose the most sparsely populated street for miles around. I am not saying Columbus is Boston dense, but for as much as everyone loves to paint Columbus as nothing but sunbelt-built, it has dense and walkable neighborhoods with unique architecture that most sunbelt cities do not have.

It's in the middle of the city. Pretty insane how sparse the middle of the city is, I know.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9320...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0586...7i16384!8i8192

^These are both just 7 miles from downtown.

THen you have main commercial streets that mostly look like this
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0601...7i16384!8i8192

[BRNorth]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

It's in the middle of the city. Pretty insane how sparse the middle of the city is, I know.

https://www.google.com/maps/@39.9320...7i13312!8i6656

https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0586...7i16384!8i8192

^These are both just 7 miles from downtown.

THen you have main commercial streets that mostly look like this
https://www.google.com/maps/@40.0601...7i16384!8i8192

You can cherry pick the same images in Cleveland, Nashville, etc. Crazy!

[bjimmy24]

Originally Posted by BRNorth

You can cherry pick the same images in Cleveland, Nashville, etc. Crazy!

I don't know anywhere in Cleveland laid out like that. It's not actually much cherry picking. If you spend any time in Columbus at all, you know there are plenty of areas very spread out with no sidewalks. Sorry the truth hurts.

Nashville also mostly sucks so yeah

[BRNorth]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I don't know anywhere in Cleveland laid out like that. It's not actually much cherry picking. If you spend any time in Columbus at all, you know there are plenty of areas very spread out with no sidewalks. Sorry the truth hurts.

Nashville also mostly sucks so yeah

I could truly care less about Cleveland or Columbus, to tell you the truth.

Cleveland:

https://www.google.com/maps/@41.4973...7i16384!8i8192

Basic sidewalk infrastructure is basically gone because no one is left to maintain it anymore. There is plenty of cherry picking to go around in Cleveland and Columbus. I know both well.