Will All New Equipment Be Needed with ATSC 3.0? (screen, connect, system)
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The newer, upgraded versions of the ATSC digital TV broadcasting system are either being implemented or are soon to be so. But I'm wondering just how many broadcast stations around the U. S. are currently using ATSC 2.0? It is backwardly compatible with the older ATSC 1.0, but ATSC 3.0 will not be. Maybe there will be inexpensive converters that will shift 3.0 down to 2.0?
I was checking all my local broadcast stations today, with the signal-analysis feature on my DVR. I was surprised to see that one of them (PBS) was running two channels of 1080i and one of 480i, on its 6 MHz bandwidth. I've never known before, that a station could squeeze-in more than one 1080i channel. Another station was running two 720p channels on its bandwidth. There seems to be no degradation in quality.
There are also some improved SD side-channels, from all the stations. Although using 480i, they were full widescreen and looking very sharp. One station had a 480i side channel showing an old Mayberry RFD program in color, that appeared to have an aspect of about 4.4 X 3, with narrow black sidebars. The picture quality was great and could almost have passed as HD. I'm thinking that the show was produced on film and that was used for direct encoding to digital video.
If anyone knows more about the implementation of ATSC 2.0 and 3.0 and the things I've discussed here, I'd appreciate being brought up to date. There isn't much on the Internet about which stations are using 2.0. My 8 year-old DVR is having no trouble recording any of the programming.
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Last edited by Steve McDonald; 11-22-2017 at 02:16 AM..
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Originally Posted by Steve McDonald
The newer, upgraded versions of the ATSC digital TV broadcasting system are either being implemented or are soon to be so. But I'm wondering just how many broadcast stations around the U. S. are currently using ATSC 2.0? It is backwardly compatible with the older ATSC 1.0, but ATSC 3.0 will not be. Maybe there will be inexpensive converters that will shift 3.0 down to 2.0?
I was checking all my local broadcast stations today, with the signal-analysis feature on my DVR. I was surprised to see that one of them (PBS) was running two channels of 1080i and one of 480i, on its 6 MHz bandwidth. I've never known before, that a station could squeeze-in more than one 1080i channel. Another station was running two 720p channels on its bandwidth. There seems to be no degradation in quality.
There are also some improved SD side-channels, from all the stations. Although using 480i, they were full widescreen and looking very sharp. One station had a 480i side channel showing an old Mayberry RFD program in color, that appeared to have an aspect of about 4.4 X 3, with narrow black sidebars. The picture quality was great and could almost have passed as HD. I'm thinking that the show was produced on film and that was used for direct encoding to digital video.
If anyone knows more about the implementation of ATSC 2.0 and 3.0 and the things I've discussed here, I'd appreciate being brought up to date. There isn't much on the Internet about which stations are using 2.0. My 8 year-old DVR is having no trouble recording any of the programming.
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You will need, as with older NTSC sets, a converter box to feed regular 1.0 sets. The only factor driving these constant upgrades to our broadcast infrastructure is the lust for MONEY.
NTSC worked fine for sixty years, then they decided to make everyone go out and buy new TVs, or converter boxes.
I'm just waiting for you-know-who to come on here and refute me, as he has on every other topic I've participated in!
2.0 is being skipped over for 3.0. Yes, if you want to receive these OTA, you will need new tuners, or devices with ATSC 3.0 tuners in them. These do not exist as of now, so don't bother looking for them. Before somebody says: "yes they do, they exist in South Korea" be aware those aren't compatible with what our version of ATSC 3.0 will ultimately broadcast.
2.0 is being skipped over for 3.0. Yes, if you want to receive these OTA, you will need new tuners, or devices with ATSC 3.0 tuners in them. These do not exist as of now, so don't bother looking for them. Before somebody says: "yes they do, they exist in South Korea" be aware those aren't compatible with what our version of ATSC 3.0 will ultimately broadcast.
If in fact, ATSC 2.0 does not exist, how do you explain that some local stations are squeezing two 1080i HD sub-channels, plus one 480i sub-channel, into one 6 MHz channel? Is it simply a matter of implementing a newer and superior encoding scheme, that gives full quality, but uses less Mbps? If so, what are these encoding formats called? As I described in my first post, the picture quality on all channels has taken a big jump upwards in the past year or so. If ATSC 2.0 was being used, would my old DVR, which uses Microsoft TV format for recording, be unable to use the signals, even though ATSC 2.0 is supposed to be backwardly-compatible?
If in fact, ATSC 2.0 does not exist, how do you explain that some local stations are squeezing two 1080i HD sub-channels, plus one 480i sub-channel, into one 6 MHz channel? Is it simply a matter of implementing a newer and superior encoding scheme, that gives full quality, but uses less Mbps? If so, what are these encoding formats called? As I described in my first post, the picture quality on all channels has taken a big jump upwards in the past year or so. If ATSC 2.0 was being used, would my old DVR, which uses Microsoft TV format for recording, be unable to use the signals, even though ATSC 2.0 is supposed to be backwardly-compatible?
Once again, there is NO ATSC 2.0, and there never will be. They are jumping right over it to ATSC 3.0 due to technical advances
What they can do, is compress the bandwidth (bit-starve) of their broadcasts, and fit what they need to fit into that 6mhz channel.
Following are the features of ATSC 1.0 standard:
• Supports one bit rate of 19.4 Mbps
• Provides coverage with 15dB CNR at rooftop.
• Supports HDTV, multicast and data transmission.
• Here both TV and internet were separately served to users or customers.
• It allows HDTV and SD multicast.
• It uses 8VSB modulation
When local broadcasters get around to sending a 4k signal, you will need a TV with a ATSC 3.0 tuner to receive the signal. If you presently have a 4k TV, I'm sure there will be converters just like there was with the digital to analog box.
When MEtv went on air, as a sub channel, their 480 signal was 4:3 . I set my Samsung picture size to 'zoom' to fill the screen. Even though almost all of their programs were produced in a 4:3 format, they changed the signal to 16:9 That decision negated the 'zoom' function and I started receiving their programs with side bars. I sent a complaint to MEtv and I guess so did thousands of other people because a couple of months later, they started sending a modified 4:3 signal that looks like a 'zoom' that has very thin side bars. Zoom basically makes a 4:3 a 16:12 AND of course, all commercials are 16:9
A few other sub-channels have gone 16:9 so all old programming now has side bars.
btw- with an OTA 4k signal, the TV will receive the full 4096x2160 signal and not compressed like with streaming, cable, satellite.
You'll need a new TV with the new ATSC 3.0 tuner in it or a tuner you can hook to your existing TV. Things are still sketchy as to all the details of what 3.0 will bring, but I know it will need internet access for some of the additional features that will be associated with OTA. Such as additional info on the TV shows you're watching, kind of like what Amazon Prime Video or Netflix gives you, and as well as access to subscription based material that cordcutters will be able to access.
I fear free OTA as we know it will be over once ATSC 3.0 gets here.
Not necessarily. I mean, I don't know, but I'm staying positive on the notion. Certainly under the new standard, one hopes to have the technology where you can stream your local OTA signals to your tablet or smart phone - this is one big area that I know they have been working on trying to perfect. Now, would this be subscription based or just a free aspect of ATSC 3.0? I don't know, we'll see.
What I also envision is a world where you don't need any other devices connected to your TV except for the antenna. Your TV will be connected to the internet, there will be "reserved" stations for On Demand, Premium, or Pay-Per-View, thus, doing away with the need for traditional Pay TV. This is probably where the paid stuff comes into play. A cord cutter could essentially subscribe to ESPN, HBO, SHOWTIME, or NFL Sunday Ticket without having to go through a cable company or satellite company. No need to wait for the cable guy to come out and install stuff, just subscribe directly through the companies that provide the content. Now, of course, I don't know if any of this stuff will come true, but it makes a lot of sense to me.
I mean, I'm already seeing companies like Spectrum change the approach to "Whole Home DVR". Instead of having a box in every room, just put the streaming App on each TV, and have the one box in the main room. No rent on extra equipment, and you can access your DVR stuff through the app. If they can do that, then I don't see why this couldn't also be done through OTA.
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