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This thread has really been derailed. It was, or I thought it was, about Tim Cook's sexuality and who would care? I gave a reason that Cook might have felt compelled to talk about his lifestyle, but it was ignored because it made sense. Also, I didn't choose a side to argue.
Sorry for being involved in the derailing. Multiple people have good trains that he did it. I don't know if any of them made sense to those who still keep asking the question, "Who cares?". If seems like they ask our just for the sake of asking it instead of wanting an actual answer.
We have no innate sexual desires directed towards a specific gender AT ALL so we were not BORN THAT WAY. A.k.a. BORN GAY.
As infants, we have no innate sexual desires period. I don't see anyone ever question this. However, as many have tried to explain here, being born that way, doesn't necessarily mean that feature manifests itself right at birth. There are many other things we are born with that only become obvious later in our lives. Autism isn't usually recognized until after several months or even years. Or certain types of diabetes or some other genetic disorders. Or (not to bring up only negative examples) high IQ or exceptional mathematical or creative skills, etc, etc. These are all features that we are born with, not that we learn or develop later in our lives. Yet you cannot see them or recognize them in an infant just as you can't recognize their sexual preference. It doesn't mean they can't be born that way, though. We just don't know for sure.
Now, as a moderator, I've read enough of this debate here. If you wish to continue, please start a dedicated thread in Great Debates. You're welcome to quote me there if anyone wishes to argue. This one is about Tim Cook so please, back on topic everyone.
It's odd because we're told that being gay is no big deal, but then everyone makes a big deal about being gay.
Here's another thing that's odd about gays. You only ever hear about them after they are successful. You will always hear about lots of successful gay people. I presume one gay person at least ever has formed a company that has failed. But you'll never hear about that guy being the first failed gay CEO.
Here's another thing about Tim Cook. Who cares, regardless, whether he's gay or straight? And what I mean by that is, he's just the most recent CEO of a company. All that means is that at some point Apple hired a gay guy. He didn't lead the company to greatness, did he? I didn't care about him three days ago when I didn't know he was gay and I certainly don't care about him now when I do know he's gay. I keep hearing about how he's the first gay CEO of a Fortune 500 company. Big deal. I don't care who any of the other CEOs are and neither do most people, if they're being completely honest, so why do I care about Tim Cook, other than he's gay?
No.
You only hear about them after they are confident. Since confidence often brings success, only the gays who are quite sure that coming out will set their mind at ease at last will do so. For some, their only reward is the relief of living honestly; there's no money in that.
With no doubt, there has to be at least one more CEO out of those 500 companies who is also gay.
Mp Chief Executive Office of the 500 most vital companies in America does anything personal with no thought beforehand. Like you said, you didn't know or care who Cook was before his announcement, and you don't care what his sexual orientation is after his announcement, but you sure know who he is now.
Do you remember the guy who took over Apple after Jobs left the company? I doubt it. I don't, and I've always used an Apple computer, beginning in 1990. Jobs left the company in the spring of 1985.
The guy who took over the command could have been gay, but an announcement of his sexuality would have only harmed his company back then.
Cook's timing, coming in a year when gays were finally beginning to triumph over the social scorn heaped on them, just drove another nail in Apple's competition.
While we are more tolerant now than we used to be, remember that Apple products are sold all over the world. Every time some gay person in some country that is oppressing gays fires up an Apple computer, what do they think about when it's time for them to purchase some new product? How does their thoughts impact their job and their nation? Who do you Cook was addressing the most with his announcement?
Steve Jobs was a visionary, but he was a rotten CEO. He had to learn that job the hard way, by creating and failing with his other computer company, NeXT. When he came back to save his first baby, he let his second one die quietly in the crib, and he was a pain in the butt to his corporate investors all the way to the end of his life.
But that, too, is part of being a visionary. it wasn't all that long ago when Microsoft ruled the computer world. Bill Gates was a visionary, too, but first and foremost, he was a natural businessman. His vision only carried as far as the same vision Jobs had when they both saw the same potential for huge change at the same meeting at the same time.
There were a lot of other kids there, too, at that meeting, and none of them ever thought of the potential that was being presented to them. A little vision goes a long way sometimes, but a lot of vision will either be amply rewarded or come to total failure. Gates pursued the first, and Jobs had no choice but pursue the second. Both had partners who were better bolts and nuts guys than they were. Both did what they were already good at.
Is Cook visionary? Maybe. Jobs thought he was, and Cook has a hide thick enough to have shrugged off the abuse Steve Jobs heaped on those closest to him in the workplace. Cook understands what happened to Apple in those years between 1985 to 1995. He was there. He already knows what Jobs needed 10 years to learn, and he is not about to repeat Job's failures.
Only time will tell the rest. Guys like Jobs are a much rarer breed than guys like Gates. Or Cook. Sexuality plays little part in a lot of what propelled them all.
Last edited by banjomike; 11-08-2014 at 01:22 AM..
SNIP "Cook's timing, coming in a year when gays were finally beginning to triumph over the social scorn heaped on them, just drove another nail in Apple's competition.
While we are more tolerant now than we used to be, remember that Apple products are sold all over the world. Every time some gay person in some country that is oppressing gays fires up an Apple computer, what do they think about when it's time for them to purchase some new product? How does their thoughts impact their job and their nation? Who do you Cook was addressing the most with his announcement?
"SNIP
Just how does Cook's PR, and lets not confuse things, it was a press release, drive another nail in Apple's competition. Are you saying or implying that in order to compete with Apple the CEO of another company needs to be Gay?
Pendulums always swing both ways. Does little jonny or little sally now imagine they need to be Gay to become the CEO of a very successful company?
In the future, there will come a time when CEOs or other prominent figures in business or public life will start to announce they are not Gay.
Obviously Jobs and Cook knew quite far in advance that Cook would become the next CEO, that decision surely wasn't made on Jobs' deathbed. Why didn't Cook announce before when he was obviously very successful?
After someone reaches a successful goal it is always easy to make public announcements. Because Cook waited, he really didn't make a statement. Plainly, Cook didn't reach this plateau in spite of being Gay, he didn't bring it up before.
The true test of accomplishment is reaching a goal in the face of adversity and challenge, not being a pip-squeak on the way up and then roaring like a lion afterwards.
I truly think that we are at a point when straight/gay comparisons are meaningless....
They are not signifiers anymore......the Supreme Court has essentially legalized gay marriage by not striking down appellate court decisions.....
the debate is over..there is none.......
gay news is no news........
As I mentioned, it is no different now than wanting a pizza with or without pepperoni.......
In some regions, ala the south, or fundamentalist/religious groups, obviously this will still be a thing, but these areas are greatly marginalized by the USA as a whole...
Actually, the Supreme Court has struck down every southern state that protested the same sex marriage act....
The debate is over.....
Only issue now, and the only important one, is if Tim Cook can follow Steve Jobs legacy..
Personally, I don't think so.......He will never come near Jobs' legacy, and prob will be remembered far more for coming out than any tangible contribution he made to Apple....
The bottom line...Tim Cook is far from, and never will be, Steve Jobs...
I wonder what this thread had to do with gay marriage?...as the moderator said, dont we have to "stay on topic?"...or "go start another thread" if you want to start political, scientific, or philosophical discussions about issues of sexuality. What changed?
Nothing changed..just that this is probably the most loaded issue outside of guns and abortion....
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