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Old 03-29-2024, 04:36 AM
 
Location: Eugene, Oregon
11,120 posts, read 5,583,894 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RetireinPA View Post
Been watching this, FNC has a video of the event from 5 minutes before, and they speed it up to take 30 seconds. The container ship was approaching the main channel, and in the last 500 yards or so, did hard a starboard and rammed the column. The smoke from the stacks indicates the big diesel was revved up last minute.

Was a harbor pilot on board? did he get confused as to the marker lights? his original course was CLEARLY mid channel until the last minute alter. conditions were CAVU, <3kt wind.
This is what I saw on a video. The smoke stack was blowing exhaust heavily and shortly before the impact, the ship made a hard right, which took it right into a main bridge support.
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Old 03-29-2024, 05:28 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve McDonald View Post
This is what I saw on a video. The smoke stack was blowing exhaust heavily and shortly before the impact, the ship made a hard right, which took it right into a main bridge support.
You can clearly see the ship lost power. Combined with a number of additional actions, A mayday call, dropping anchor to attempt to stop the ship, the black smoke could be an emergency restart of the engine or a sudden reverse to slow it. As far the turn to port, that could be a side effect of the anchor dragging or sudden reversal of power. It turn could have been intentional as a last ditch effort to ground the ship rather than hitting the bridge. There just was not enough time to change direction or speed of a a mass that large. Considering all the things that were done right, A conspiracy it was a purposeful attack is far fetched.
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Old 03-29-2024, 06:21 AM
 
2,020 posts, read 976,503 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MarianRavenwood View Post
Construction of the bridge was funded through a bond referendum, which passed in 1968. When Spiro Agnew was governor of Maryland. He was Republican......and famous for being Tricky Dick's running mate and veep who resigned and pled nolo contendre to felony fraud and tax evasion charges.

Bicycling was never (and still isn't) a primary vehicle, although during WWII it became a popular mode of transportation due to fuel rationing. After the war, people certainly didn't want reminders of that. By the 60s environmental movements and hippies were calling for bicycle infrastructure but the first bills for bike lanes weren't introduced until the 1970s...at which point the Key bridge was already under construction.

But of course even if there had been more support for bike lanes at the time, it wouldn't have been for the Key bridge, which carried I-95--an interstate. Just as there isn't a bike lane or sidewalk on the shoulder of I-80 from coast to coast, or any other interstate, there wasn't and never would have been one on the Key bridge.

All of this is easily verifiable with basic internet searching and can't be debunked with random made up BS that is absurd on it's face.
Thank you!
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Old 03-29-2024, 07:12 AM
 
16,414 posts, read 12,487,571 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lenora View Post
Random thoughts:
I can't find any reports of commuters who were on the bridge at the time of impact. IMO, it is likely that what looked like headlights moving along the bridge were either the headlights of vehicles owned by the workers, or weren't actually headlights. It was reported that one vehicle barely made it off the bridge in time
The police were able to stop traffic from going on to the bridge thanks to the mayday call. There are some camera angles that show the last cars/trucks going across the bridge. The vehicles they're identifying underwater are related to the pothole filling efforts. The only missing people were the workers. They've located two of the six missing bodies.
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Old 03-29-2024, 07:40 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hertfordshire View Post
The police were able to stop traffic from going on to the bridge thanks to the mayday call. There are some camera angles that show the last cars/trucks going across the bridge. The vehicles they're identifying underwater are related to the pothole filling efforts. The only missing people were the workers. They've located two of the six missing bodies.
Apparently, bridge staff had 90 seconds warning and its said, the highway Patrol dropped barricades to prevent others from crossing. Not sure of their system details but it worked and worked quickly. In the Video you can see a tractor trailer just clear the span before it fell. In the center section, you can see flashing yellow lights of the vehicles in the maintenance crew and see them fall with span. The two bodies that were found were inside one of the vehicles in about 25 feet of water.
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Old 03-29-2024, 08:02 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchoc View Post
Apparently, bridge staff had 90 seconds warning and its said, the highway Patrol dropped barricades to prevent others from crossing. Not sure of their system details but it worked and worked quickly. In the Video you can see a tractor trailer just clear the span before it fell. In the center section, you can see flashing yellow lights of the vehicles in the maintenance crew and see them fall with span. The two bodies that were found were inside one of the vehicles in about 25 feet of water.
I know absolutely jack about what it takes to operate a bridge, but even I would put "quick way of stopping people from entering" high on the list on things to prep for. Admittedly, for much more pedestrian reasons - say, a traffic accident leading to several hundred people being stuck while emergency vehicles can't get to the scene. Or weather - does (I guess did) the bridge close in high wind conditions?

They had a plan, it worked. Competence. More of that, please.
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Old 03-29-2024, 08:05 AM
 
46,943 posts, read 25,964,420 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moguldreamer View Post
The Singaporean owner of the cargo ship is expected to invoke a law dating back to the 19th century that limits the liability of ships’ owners. This Limitation of Liability Act law caps the liability of the cargo ship’s owners—and their several insurers—at the value of the goods the ship was carrying plus the value of the ship itself.

The damages side likely will tally up to a big number. The damages side includes reconstruction costs, loss-of-life, loss-of-revenue for the Port itself, loss-of-revenue for nearby businesses that cater to the Port and even down to bars & restaurants where port employees eat & drink after work... plus a lot of other damages as well.
The value of the bridge far exceeds the cost of the bridge. Which is why it would be smart for government to fund a new one, and then go after the shippers/insurers to claw back what they can.
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Old 03-29-2024, 08:13 AM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,323 posts, read 60,500,026 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dane_in_LA View Post
I know absolutely jack about what it takes to operate a bridge, but even I would put "quick way of stopping people from entering" high on the list on things to prep for. Admittedly, for much more pedestrian reasons - say, a traffic accident leading to several hundred people being stuck while emergency vehicles can't get to the scene. Or weather - does (I guess did) the bridge close in high wind conditions?

They had a plan, it worked. Competence. More of that, please.
The Chesapeake Bay Bridge as well as the during Harry Nice/Thomas Middleton Bridge close very occasionally for high profile vehicles during high winds. Not so much for cars although my F150 can be tossed a bit by winds on them.
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Old 03-29-2024, 08:36 AM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,552 posts, read 17,256,908 times
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That smoke pouring from the exhaust just before the ship hit was caused by the engine room crew trying to restart the engine. It is not known yet why the engine shut down.

Engines of that size are started by forcing compressed air and fuel into them.
Cut to time 6:15. This is a smaller engine than the Dali has, but it gives a good view of what goes on.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppNbSB0mrz8


But Chief MAKOi does a much more thorough job of showing a full size set-up.. Chief MAKOi makes the important point that marine engines do not have a transmission. The only way to reverse the engine is to stop it and make it turn the other way.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mFmCxOjY_A&t=10s

Last edited by Listener2307; 03-29-2024 at 08:44 AM..
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Old 03-29-2024, 09:42 AM
 
8,377 posts, read 4,359,448 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
That smoke pouring from the exhaust just before the ship hit was caused by the engine room crew trying to restart the engine. It is not known yet why the engine shut down.

Engines of that size are started by forcing compressed air and fuel into them.
Cut to time 6:15. This is a smaller engine than the Dali has, but it gives a good view of what goes on.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ppNbSB0mrz8


But Chief MAKOi does a much more thorough job of showing a full size set-up.. Chief MAKOi makes the important point that marine engines do not have a transmission. The only way to reverse the engine is to stop it and make it turn the other way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5mFmCxOjY_A&t=10s



Interesting


It seems these big cargo transports do not have many back up systems. There is a single diesel that primary runs a generator. The generator runs every thing else, ships electrical including an electric motor that drives the propeller and the rudder. So if the diesel engine stops, the ship is dead in the water. I understand that many of these ships do have a small back up diesel on deck for emergencys but the transition time to switch over can be at least a few minutes. I am not sure about stopping and reversing the diesel. In addition to the generators that supply power there are gear boxes to distribute diesel power as needed. It only makes sense this gear box would have a reverse much like a car.


The black smoke could have been an engine restart, it could have been an enormous change in load as the gearbox a motors where given the command to hard astern.


Reading in one article it was said the possibility of dirty fuel may have caused the engine to quit. What ever the reason, it seems remarkable the crew was able to re-establish power in such a short time. According to another article, the time frame from initial alarms and failure to impact was only about 3 minutes. A lot happened in those 3 minutes.
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