The retail in the Downtown Tunnels could move above ground. (Dallas: different, recent)

[kazyn]

Link's broken.

[mm4]

I think this new campaign is misguided; underground retail coexists in other larger cities with vacant street-level storefronts: New York among them. Rockefeller Center, the old WTC, numerous subway exits in office bldgs. around lower Manhattan, they all host(ed) the same types of lease space. 10% vacancy rates at street level have been the norm in many well traversed parts of the City.

An evolved policy recognizes that retailers successfully go where they want to, not where planners (both public and private) attempt to push them. Worse, if you limit where they can go, they end up potentially paying more for the privilege, even driving them into insolvency.

Also recognize that all cities had tall business districts that emptied out after dark, NYC among them. There, it was Lower Manhattan, where only one or two small all night deli's stayed open--sans hot food where trays were empied and cleaned overnight for lack of customers. Not much has changed there even with the retrofit of old bank buildings into apartments. In fact Wall Street lost a Starbucks a few years back.

If these outlets are doing business, paying rent, in the tunnels, leave them be. They're success stories. It may not be William Holly White, but since when does every city have to be the same? If D wants more outdoor conditions, they'll happen organically with thrust from the retailers, much like food cart vendors changed city ordinance in the 1980s.

[kenshi]

Who really cares if people aren't walking on the streets anyway? Dallas summers are freakin hot! I'm not walking on the streets in July whether there are tunnels or not. Shut down the tunnels and that gives me a good reason to avoid downtown entirely. That's why people go to malls.

[Twincam666]

The authorities need to get rid of the trash that roams the streets there so people feel safe LIVING in the city first!

[talkispoison]

Originally Posted by kenshi

Who really cares if people aren't walking on the streets anyway? Dallas summers are freakin hot! I'm not walking on the streets in July whether there are tunnels or not. Shut down the tunnels and that gives me a good reason to avoid downtown entirely. That's why people go to malls.

Have you ever been to NYC in the summer? It gets really hot there. And your mall logic is failing America. Why do you think there are so many vacant malls and so much emphasis on downtown revitalization, not just here but all across the US. The downtown tunnels are fairly vacant. I roam them occassionaly when I'm bored at lunch. And many people care if people are walking on the streets. Also, whoever was speaking about the "trash" that roam the streets, have you been recently? Much of the homeless population I am sure you are referring to as "trash" has moved up and down 75, 35E, and the Tollway.

[kenshi]

Originally Posted by talkispoison

Have you ever been to NYC in the summer? It gets really hot there.

Average highs during the hotest part of summer are around 85 degrees. As a Texan, I just can't imagine such unbearable heat...

And your mall logic is failing America. Why do you think there are so many vacant malls and so much emphasis on downtown revitalization, not just here but all across the US.

I haven't seen any vacant malls lately. Downtown revitalization is good for having a central core area to pull people into instead of everything being so spread out. Whether or not it's underground is inconsequential.

The downtown tunnels are fairly vacant. I roam them occassionaly when I'm bored at lunch.

I agree. The tunnels could be improved.

And many people care if people are walking on the streets.

People like to be crowded?

[talkispoison]

Originally Posted by kenshi

Average highs during the hotest part of summer are around 85 degrees. As a Texan, I just can't imagine such unbearable heat...



I haven't seen any vacant malls lately. Downtown revitalization is good for having a central core area to pull people into instead of everything being so spread out. Whether or not it's underground is inconsequential.



I agree. The tunnels could be improved.



People like to be crowded?

Have you not checked out Redbird, 6 Flags, Rrving, or Valley View lately?
NYC has heat waves all the time. It is also mostly concrete which reflects the heat right back. And yes, people do like to be crowded. Otherwise you wouldn't see crowded streets in other cities.

[kazyn]

Admittedly, I feel less awkward walking in a crowd than by myself through a vacant mall or store.

[kenshi]

Well it's one thing to be absolutely alone. Downtown Longview sucks for this reason. But I've been in downtown Dallas at various times and I've never been the only person walking along the sidewalks. But few people want to swim through a sea of other people as I did in Chicago on Independence Day.

[dfwcre8tive]

You can download an updated version of the tunnel map here: Noah Jeppson