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A recurring sentiment that I read on this forum is of the sort
"there is nothing to do" or "its so boring" or "there is nothing for young
professionals."
While I am no longer considered a young professional, I know what I enjoyed then
and what I enjoy now. We did our homework before coming here and also
subscribe to "make home where you stay."
Granted, I've lived in large, so called, bustling urban centers, college towns, and
rural farming areas in different states around the country. To be honest,
the most fun I've had was a 3 year period during graduate school where my
housemates and I rented from a farmer (his old house right there on his farm across a field from his new house).
I had never experienced such generosity, natural beauty of the surrounding area,
and quality of life prior to that. He would let us pick produce from areas of his farm
with the stipulation that we only take what we will eat and respect the farm
(don't trample young buds, if you don't know what you are doing ask first).
I used to wake up early on weekends, get doughnuts and leave a dozen for
him and share with him the stuff we cooked.
So my big question to the current day's young professionals is what is the fun or
activity that you so ache to do?
What does having something to do mean to you? I'm genuinely curious.
Please be specific (and mature, i.e. not saying this place stinks).
Is it the theater? Then what kind? What acts? Is it restaurants? THen what kind?
Is it events? Then what kind? Street performers? Jazz ensembles? Rock bands?
Is it parties? Then what kind? Professional mixers? Speed dating?
This should be interesting as it has been some 20 years since "back in those days."
People used to tell me that I was an old soul. To me, I just found home wherever
I was.
Last edited by newmassphd; 05-20-2014 at 09:10 AM..
Reason: fixed another typo
I will preface my post by saying this isn't a one size fits all situation. "Young professional" may define a demographic, but what one person enjoys is not what another person enjoys and I think we can all respect that. Delaware isn't for everyone. The big city isn't for everyone. What I can offer is my opinion and it's just that: my opinion.
I attended UD for my undergraduate and I loved my 4 years there. But, I would not stay in Delaware as a postgrad and there are several reasons why. Here are a few things that I enjoy in Baltimore (an urban setting) - where I live now - that are completely lacking in Delaware:
1.) Diversity. Delaware has none. You may find some in Wilmington, but as a whole the place is pretty homogeneous. Baltimore has given me a rich cultural experience that both suburban New Jersey (where I grew up) and Delaware could not give me.
2.) Professional sports. As a huge baseball fan, one of my favorite things to do on the weekend is catch a ballgame. I can ride the subway one stop and go to an O's game at the drop of a hat. The nearest professional sports teams to Delaware are at least a 45 minute drive away in Philadelphia.
3.) Nightlife that fits all my needs. If I'm in the mood for a pub with a chill atmosphere, good beers, and amazing burgers, I can get it. If I'm in the mood to dance the night away, I can do so. If I want a place that does its own custom cocktails with fresh ingredients at a relatively cheap price, I can have that too. Cities simply have any type of bar or club you want to go to. Delaware just doesn't have the variety that a city can offer as far as nightlife. Basically I've found that in Delaware, there are either bars that are for townies or bars that are for college kids. There is no in between. I either have to have a sorority girl spilling a drink all over me at a bar packed wall to wall with wasted college kids or a creepy dive bar or overpriced restaurant full of 50 somethings. There is no hip area full of young professionals that just like to have a couple of drinks and socialize. That is completely lacking in Delaware.
4.) Reliable public transit. DART sucks. Simple as that. For the first three years of my undergrad, I didn't have my car on campus, so I had to take the DART bus to get to the Christiana Mall and it was a nightmare. I had to budget an extra hour and a half of time just for waiting for the bus and the bus ride. It took an hour for a 15 minute drive from Newark to Christiana. In Baltimore, I have several public transit options and I can get pretty much anywhere I want to go without a car. I am lucky enough to have a car, but keep in mind that not every young professional can afford one.
Those are just the things I can think of off the top of my head, but I have found that the urban setting just feels right at this time in my life. Whatever my needs are, they aren't too far away. There is a lot to do and a lot of different folks of different cultures surrounding me every day. I feel like I can never be bored and that if I just take in what's around me, I can learn something new every day. And that's exciting to me. I feel engaged in my community; it's dynamic. And I love that.
@newmassphd
What do us "young professionals" want? Well I'll tell you what this one wants.
1. Modern apartments. 98.98342% of the apartments are outdated. Very frumpy. The only "modern" apartments or apartments that look to have been renovated are the ones in Wilmington near the riverfront, which are extremely over priced for the million of corners they cut. It seems they priced the apartments with the attitude of.. "we know we are the only modern apartments in DE, therefore we will charge you whatever we want, DEAL WITH IT.
2. Walkable neighborhoods. For instance the neigborhood around the apartments in the Wilimington Riverfront area, where are the bars? Where is the nightlife? Firestone? (Last call at 12AM nearly crushed my soul the first night I heard that) But what else? Is there a Whole Foods or Traders Joes you can walk to Saturday mornings to get your groceries? Where are the establishments that a city would offer you? Heck where is the fancy/hip gym that allows you to run on a treadmill while overlooking the river/citylife? Hell where is the outdoor morning yoga sessions, that would be great in summer/spring on the weekends. Outdoor concerts, outdoor movie nights, and where is the venue for artists to come and perform?
3. Social Scence. There aren't places/events for us to congregate and socialize together. Or maybe there is and you just have to be in the inner DE circle to know. God knows I have tried but I guess an internet search and co-workers who chose to commute to DE from work aren't good people to ask? But as a transplant who do you ask? I ask the cutesy girls who work in Christiana Mall what they do, they always say go to Philly/NY/DC/AC for fun. And don't get me started on the selection of stores in Christiana mall. I often chat up the sales girls to discuss the lack of variety of clothing the stores sell based on the demographic, and how the hip/edgy clothing selection sells out quick. I would think since DE is so small that Christiana mall would be MEGA MALL such as Tyson Corner in VA.
4. Diversity. Enough said, no need to elaborate.
I've been told that I did not do my research, but what research did you expect me to do? Personally, I think that if you never grew up in a rural environment no matter how much research you do you will be ill prepared. Unless you lived here for a month+ you would not realize the little things of the city you miss.
I didn't mean to start a young professional transplant v. DE war. I just thought that others who come in should get a honest opinion. I know when I was looking I could barely find a voice for my age group. Maybe there are other young professionals who love it here.
It makes me sad, that we can't attract young professionals. We need them desperately, in Delaware, which has become an "old" state. I'm old, at 74, but have been here my whole life. It's disheartening to me to see Delaware filling up with retirees. Don't get me wrong, some of my BEST friends are retired transplants. But Delaware needs to do better, offer more, do SOMETHING, other than offering retirees cheaper real estate taxes (50% off school taxes after X age), and lots of 55+ communities.
Delaware, is now, suffering from a budget deficit. I'm no wiz, but I could see this coming. Quit advertising "the retirement state" and find a way to attract young professionals, who will pump money into the economy. http://delaware.newszap.com/centrald...rsen-for-state
Is it the theater? Then what kind? What acts? Is it restaurants? THen what kind?
Is it events? Then what kind? Street performers? Jazz ensembles? Rock bands?
Is it parties? Then what kind? Professional mixers? Speed dating?
It's actually not about what you get but how you get there. This only happens in america when you finally have an area so dense that cars are not feasible anymore. The car culture in america is basically like living in a bubble. For some people this is just fine, they prefer just hanging out with the few others in their bubble. For others they don't know what life outside the bubble is even like. Otherwise everyone else wants to be apart of a bigger community and this only happens when people start walking and taking public transportation for their daily needs and crossing each other's paths for all reasons and not just ceremonially gathering for things like mall shopping, grocery shopping, and sports games.
You can always tell the difference when you are in a crowded area of urban people or a crowded area of suburban people. Suburban people feel they are entitled to a certain amount of space so they become passively irritable / agitated while urban people have a bigger sense of community. I think this is also why suburban people can't figure out why you'd want to live in a highly dense area... "why would you want to live in constant close proximity to a bunch of irritable people who in reality don't want to be near anyone?".
It's actually not about what you get but how you get there. This only happens in america when you finally have an area so dense that cars are not feasible anymore. The car culture in america is basically like living in a bubble. For some people this is just fine, they prefer just hanging out with the few others in their bubble. For others they don't know what life outside the bubble is even like. Otherwise everyone else wants to be apart of a bigger community and this only happens when people start walking and taking public transportation for their daily needs and crossing each other's paths for all reasons and not just ceremonially gathering for things like mall shopping, grocery shopping, and sports games.
You can always tell the difference when you are in a crowded area of urban people or a crowded area of suburban people. Suburban people feel they are entitled to a certain amount of space so they become passively irritable / agitated while urban people have a bigger sense of community. I think this is also why suburban people can't figure out why you'd want to live in a highly dense area... "why would you want to live in constant close proximity to a bunch of irritable people who in reality don't want to be near anyone?".
MikeNigh, sorry but I don't completely understand what you meant in your response. I will think more about it.
Certainly coming into contact with chance people builds larger community and the many things that
can and often happen "organically." In one city where I lived, someone simply putting sturdy iron framed
tables on the sidewalk with stone tops into which a chess board was carved encouraged people to sit, play
chess, checkers and hang out throughout different times of the day. Soon afterwards, along came people
who played musical instruments (some very talented, some less so adding to the fun) came along and added to
the atmosphere. So, a few years later the city build a round slightly elevated structure removed a lane and created
a stonescaped courtyard of sorts with lighting to facilitate the impromptu performances. There are many things for not much money that one can do to help along such things. Some things such as reclaiming a lane to build a
courtyard needs municipal involvement.
In two different places, I've seen the young and creative (artists, musicians, techies) "pioneers" move into an area
for the low cost of living and the type of activities young professionals (and older folks alike) cherish sprout and
thrive. I imagine it takes the first few.
Newmass you ask an interesting question. For example, as a native Long Islander (NY), I lived within 20 miles of NYC. I worked there for over 20 years but cherished the ability to escape after work. Did I enjoy the city back in the day, sure I did, but at the end of the day, I always knew I could go home to a backyard barbeque in the summer and sleigh rides in the winter. No cramped Manhattan living for me, it was like the old saying, "it's a nice place to visit but I wouldn't want to live there". I am glad I worked there and could take advantage of what I wanted to after work.
Yes, NYC, is the city that never sleeps and has a lot to offer. You want theaters, art museum, pubs, night clubs, specialty food markets, boutique clothing stores etc. they were all there. Old run down neighborhoods, that you could not beg people to rent in, like Greenpoint and Williamsburg in Brooklyn are the new Tribeca now. Try getting a place there now but it all comes at a price. A substantial one at that.
When I was in my late 20's I lived in a military community in a Southern state. I met a doctor who lamented to me that the only culture there, was the stuff they grew in the lab. He would not think of driving a half hour or so to a major city for the theater he missed so much, why? Because he grew up in NYC and it was all there at his fingertips. Great plays, museums etc. But, he missed the bright lights of Broadway and nothing would make him happy. It was all second class. Boy, did he miss a lot and the prices could not be better.
As a retiree, I think the problem in De. is partially what RDLR stated, but also, the younger generation of professionals have been driven by instant gratification, with computers and IPhone and I Pads to name a few things. In many cases, but certainly not all, I think they have fallen victim to this instant world and therefore anything "slower" is boring.
Speaking only for myself, as a child of the '50s, we learned to do a lot with very little because many of our parents were either children of the Great Depression or their siblings were, so they knew what sacrifice was. We had a single tv for the whole family and we watched the Wonderful World of Disney on Sunday night. I am not saying that was a better way, it was just the way it was and we had nothing to compare it to. Today, we want everything yesterday, because we already can get almost everything instantly.
I can only go by my nieces and nephews who are out on their own now and before they make a major decision on a job or an apartment in a new city. They research it (and yes, that is how I found CD) and then go for a visit over a weekend. Once such niece, came back from an interview and declared that the town had one movie theater and a brewery tour and that she would be crazy in no time if she had to live there, great job offer or not.
I think it changes by generation too, as a tail end boomer, I am different from the Generations X,Y and Z. I can say however, that as a retiree, the Rehoboth Beach area is far from lacking many of the things that one of the posters was looking for, but she was also in need of a job, which is not plentiful in this area unless it is of a seasonal nature.
2. Walkable neighborhoods. For instance the neigborhood around the apartments in the Wilimington Riverfront area, where are the bars? Where is the nightlife? Firestone? (Last call at 12AM nearly crushed my soul the first night I heard that) But what else? Is there a Whole Foods or Traders Joes you can walk to Saturday mornings to get your groceries? Where are the establishments that a city would offer you? Heck where is the fancy/hip gym that allows you to run on a treadmill while overlooking the river/citylife? Hell where is the outdoor morning yoga sessions, that would be great in summer/spring on the weekends. Outdoor concerts, outdoor movie nights, and where is the venue for artists to come and perform?
Amen to this.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeNigh
Otherwise everyone else wants to be apart of a bigger community and this only happens when people start walking and taking public transportation for their daily needs and crossing each other's paths for all reasons and not just ceremonially gathering for things like mall shopping, grocery shopping, and sports games.
And this.
I love being able to walk everywhere and just take in what's around me. People watching and such. When you drive somewhere, you have to be focused on the road.
I hate the idea of thinking to myself, "Oh shoot, I forgot to buy milk yesterday. Better get in the car and drive 20 minutes to the nearest store." Especially with gas prices the way they are. Even though I have a car, I've saved so much money on gas by not using it nearly as much as I used it in Delaware and in New Jersey.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nuts2uiam
Newmass you ask an interesting question. For example, as a native Long Islander (NY), I lived within 20 miles of NYC. I worked there for over 20 years but cherished the ability to escape after work. Did I enjoy the city back in the day, sure I did, but at the end of the day, I always knew I could go home to a backyard barbeque in the summer and sleigh rides in the winter. No cramped Manhattan living for me, it was like the old saying, "it's a nice place to visit but I wouldn't want to live there". I am glad I worked there and could take advantage of what I wanted to after work.
Believe it or not, you can have a backyard and live in the city. I know that may be a little difficult in a place like Manhattan, but here in Baltimore there are plenty of single family detached homes. Just like a lot of other cities (Philly comes to mind also), Baltimore is truly a city of neighborhoods. So, if you like the perks that a city gives you (nightlife, theater, shopping, etc), but want a more suburban living situation, you can live in a neighborhood within the city that gives you that, but still live within a stone's throw of bustling urban life. The neighborhood I live in (Patterson Park) actually has a pretty suburban feel, as there are almost no apartment complexes in my area. It's all rowhomes. I have a patio where I can plant a garden and yes, even have a cookout! And unlike the stereotypes will tell you, everyone is extremely friendly and neighborly. There are block parties and everyone sits out on their stoops and watches the kids play ball on the sidewalk.
It makes me sad, that we can't attract young professionals. We need them desperately, in Delaware, which has become an "old" state. I'm old, at 74, but have been here my whole life. It's disheartening to me to see Delaware filling up with retirees. Don't get me wrong, some of my BEST friends are retired transplants. But Delaware needs to do better, offer more, do SOMETHING, other than offering retirees cheaper real estate taxes (50% off school taxes after X age), and lots of 55+ communities.
Delaware, is now, suffering from a budget deficit. I'm no wiz, but I could see this coming. Quit advertising "the retirement state" and find a way to attract young professionals, who will pump money into the economy. Budget numbers worsen for state - Delaware Newszap
He's the deal as I see it: As someone who felt forced to spend about a year and half in Wilmington in my 20's due to a transfer, there is no way Delaware could have offered me what I wanted. What I wanted was up the road in Philly: variety, night spots, social networks to link into, culture, walkability - in short an urban "buzz." Given this level of urbanity was unobtainable in Delaware and always will be, I spent most of my time back then looking for a job I liked in a city I liked.
For people of any age, Delaware will never have a large enough city to offer the level of urbanity they want. OTOH, Delaware has other fine features and amenities people of any age will also value. That's the way it is: an apple can never be an orange. What surprises me is that some people move to Delaware thinking they will find an environment that matches midtown Manhattan. I'm not sure what led them to this conclusion, but perhaps this can just be a lesson learned.
He's the deal as I see it: As someone who felt forced to spend about a year and half in Wilmington in my 20's due to a transfer, there is no way Delaware could have offered me what I wanted. What I wanted was up the road in Philly: variety, night spots, social networks to link into, culture, walkability - in short an urban "buzz." Given this level of urbanity was unobtainable in Delaware and always will be, I spent most of my time back then looking for a job I liked in a city I liked.
For people of any age, Delaware will never have a large enough city to offer the level of urbanity they want. OTOH, Delaware has other fine features and amenities people of any age will also value. That's the way it is: an apple can never be an orange. What surprises me is that some people move to Delaware thinking they will find an environment that matches midtown Manhattan. I'm not sure what led them to this conclusion, but perhaps this can just be a lesson learned.
What I wonder is how quite a number of relatively small cities have been able to make it work.
off the top of my head, Fort Collins CO, Irvine CA, Northampton/Amherst MA. What is it cities/towns such
as these have?
My best guess (from seeing these places) is something to bring young people to the area and something
to keep them there.
- universities/colleges (undergrad and graduate)
- arts and entertainment venues (creative district?)
- venues, opportunities, and support for artists of all sorts
(EX: for $25 performers in Boston can get permit to play/perform in the subway system)
- supporting industry for young people to "get their start." Multiple industries
high-tech/IT, advertising, finance/investments
- business incubation (innovation district) for all sorts of businesses including
food trucks (my favourite).
- fun promotions for friendly bragging rights: best ice cream in state, best pizza in state,
best BBQ in state, best yodeller in state, weiner dog races, talent shows, etc.
- broad array of social venues
- places to gather (Jeffersonian), discuss, and enjoy a tankard or cup
- a center green? public flower garden
- sidewalks and courtyards
- perception of low crime (I've seen young mothers pushing strollers at night in some towns
to help get the baby to sleep)
- a general sense of ownership (this is my town) and care about one's city
Is it something that could be replicated in Delaware?
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