Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Zirconium crowns are much better than PFM crowns, and they can usually be made in the office while you are waiting. Unless you have really bad periodontal pockets just get a regular cleaning and use a water pik. You'll be fine. PFM crowns aren't great they can cause gum recission at the point where the metal meets the porcelain. I have a mouth full of crowns and over the past 4 or 5 years had most of the PFM crowns replaced with zirconium. As far as osteoporosis, people get it as they age, I have been taking 4k units of vitamin D a day for 12 years and I have osteoporosis. Don't worry so much, go to a dentist you trust- if they're 3 hours a way the peace of mind will be worth the drive. (PS - why not get the dentist who made the bad crown to replace it for free and call it a day?)
I really appreciate your insight.
I guess I need to be more open minded about Zirconia, and I've learned that dentists are going to do what they want to do regardless. It just seems that this material hasn't been around long enough to determine things like longevity and if it truly is better than a PFM in the long run. I found this scary article today:
Both Dentist #1 and #2 here said they send theirs to a lab. It seems labs would be better than a dental office because that's all they do all day long.
Is your zirconium the monolithic kind (solid block) or layered and do you have Zirconia on any bottom molars?
I apparently only have a few 4 and 5 pockets, but Dentist #2 said that I need the deep cleaning because I also have mild bone loss. It's confusing because Dentist #1 said I don't have bone loss, but I'm inclined to do as you and others have suggested and just do the regular cleaning and use a waterpik.
I might end up driving back to where I used to live, but I don't know how my dentist that I had for 25 years would feel considering I didn't go back to him for that crown in 2016. And I did go back to the scumbag dentist in 2016 about the #18 bad crown, but he didn't do anything about it. He told me to go to an endodontist, but the endodontist said I didn't need a root canal.
I guess I need to be more open minded about Zirconia, and I've learned that dentists are going to do what they want to do regardless. It just seems that this material hasn't been around long enough to determine things like longevity and if it truly is better than a PFM in the long run. I found this scary article today:
Both Dentist #1 and #2 here said they send theirs to a lab. It seems labs would be better than a dental office because that's all they do all day long.
Is your zirconium the monolithic kind (solid block) or layered and do you have Zirconia on any bottom molars?
I apparently only have a few 4 and 5 pockets, but Dentist #2 said that I need the deep cleaning because I also have mild bone loss. It's confusing because Dentist #1 said I don't have bone loss, but I'm inclined to do as you and others have suggested and just do the regular cleaning and use a waterpik.
I might end up driving back to where I used to live, but I don't know how my dentist that I had for 25 years would feel considering I didn't go back to him for that crown in 2016. And I did go back to the scumbag dentist in 2016 about the #18 bad crown, but he didn't do anything about it. He told me to go to an endodontist, but the endodontist said I didn't need a root canal.
My zirconium crowns are layered for the front teeth, solid for the back. I got my first two zirconia crowns in 2013 and they are still perfect. A "deep cleaning" can cost upwards of $250 a quadrant, there is no way that I would agree to it unless a competent periodontist said it was 100% necessary.
You should have contacted the state board of dentistry and filed a complaint if the dentist wouldn't fix or replace the crown, it's likely too late now.
Zirconium crowns made in the office are every bit as good as those made in a lab. For one thing you know before you leave the office if the crown is comfortable and fits correctly
My advice to you is quit googling scary stuff about your dental work. Millions of zirconium crowns have been made and are successful, the story you linked was about crown failure due to improper preparation of the tooth; that happens to PFM crowns too.
If you trust the dentist you had before, go see him, he won't judge you or criticize you for going to another dentist, but he will probably be pleased that you returned.
The sanitizer is great for obvious hygienic reasons. The brush has kept my gums and teeth in great shape for years. I used to have dental problems yearly, and gum problems starting to crop up, but none in the nearly 15 years I've been using it. It has saved me a lot of money. Had to replace the unit once a couple of years ago. I don't how much of this can be attributed to the sanitizer, but I won't risk doing without it.
My wife has a small mouth and has one too, she loves it. I actually find the brush head a bit small but it's great for getting in tight places (which was probably by design). The Philips replacement brush heads can be pricey, but we have found comparable third party brush heads at reasonable cost at Amazon. My previous dentist (now retired) advised me to get the Sonicare, and my present dentist advised me to add the waterpik. I'm so glad they did.
Thanks for the great testimonial.
I was hopeful that the brush head might be small enough to work for me, but it's currently out of stock around here. From what I can tell online, the unit itself might also be too big for my temporary living situation. I unfortunately sold my house and would have had plenty of room for it, but not so much now until I find my new house. I like the idea of the sanitizer, especially since I'm living right now in an older building that I've been concerned about moisture issues anyway.
I'm also going to look into and want to get a waterpik. WP-100W White Ultra seems to be recommended a lot. My problem right now is space, and I hate to buy anything when I know that I'm going to move away from this area, hopefully sooner rather than later, although the housing market couldn't be worse right now!
My zirconium crowns are layered for the front teeth, solid for the back. I got my first two zirconia crowns in 2013 and they are still perfect. A "deep cleaning" can cost upwards of $250 a quadrant, there is no way that I would agree to it unless a competent periodontist said it was 100% necessary.
You should have contacted the state board of dentistry and filed a complaint if the dentist wouldn't fix or replace the crown, it's likely too late now.
Zirconium crowns made in the office are every bit as good as those made in a lab. For one thing you know before you leave the office if the crown is comfortable and fits correctly
My advice to you is quit googling scary stuff about your dental work. Millions of zirconium crowns have been made and are successful, the story you linked was about crown failure due to improper preparation of the tooth; that happens to PFM crowns too.
If you trust the dentist you had before, go see him, he won't judge you or criticize you for going to another dentist, but he will probably be pleased that you returned.
I'm very grateful for you taking the time to help me in general and giving me your experience with zirconium crowns.
Your feedback about the deep cleanings is also very valuable. I'm pretty much convinced that I'm not going to do it, but the dentist scared me into thinking it's necessary every three months to prevent further bone loss that I'm not convinced that I have based on what Dentist #1 said. But, a friend said that she'd be surprised if I don't have bone loss in my mouth because my PCP said that I have severe osteoporosis in my hip. Dentist #2 never showed me the actual bone loss on the x-rays, and I don't know what it would look like. Thanks to you, I now assume that the $655 on Dentist #2's treatment plan is what will be charged four times a year ($2620 total) The hygiene total shows $655 for:
Prophy all teeth (1 HR)
Scaling and root planing teeth 2,3,14,15 (1 HR)
Periomed and Clinpro Prescriptions
Periodontal maintenance (175) every 3 months.
Isn't scaling and root planing of those four teeth and periodontal maintenance the same thing? I also assume that he's talking about two quadrants (two top left and two top right).
It's very interesting that you say that I should have contacted the state board of dentistry and filed a complaint against that bad dentist in 2016. I've said so many times that I'm going to do that at a minimum, and I don't know why I couldn't now. It seems I have even more proof of his poor quality work given what's happened recently, and there shouldn't be any decay under that crown if he sealed it properly.
That article stuck out to me because I believe that the crown material really doesn't matter as much as the dentist who does it and how much training they've had on the different crown types. Buying crowns now reminds me of when I bought my new HVAC system. It didn't matter if I bought a Carrier, Trane or whatever brand because the longevity and outcome of that system really depended on the installer/technician!
You actually have me thinking more about going back to my old dentist, and I may possibly move back there. I often thought that maybe he'll be flattered that I've hated every dentist since him, but there's no guarantee. I'd probably also have to get a hotel and go back more than once, etc., and I already feel that I keep digging myself further into this dental financial hole because of unethical dentists. I'm also worried that #18 has been dragging out so long, and I just want to get it done.
I got to the part where you specified you hadn't been to the dentist since 2016, and that you had a year dealing with cancer.
So here's my thoughts:
You didn't go to the dentist for almost six years, AND you had cancer - and I'm guessing at least some amount of either chemo, or radiation, or both. Either or both can have an effect on your bones and your teeth. You should not be surprised that there's still staining.
It also sounds like you might've been allergic to the adhesive they used to secure the crown. That happens, some people have allergies.
Also, if you haven't been using an electric toothbrush all this time, you'll find the difference profound when you get one. You can buy a "basic" model Oral B for around $20. The replacement heads are stupidly expensive, almost $10, each one good for around 3 months. But that's $40 a year for replacement heads, compared to the cost of not going to the dentist for 6 years. WaterPiks are awesome. Used them when I was a kid, then stopped, and got one again around 2 years ago and am SO glad I did. That thing pushes stuff out from between my teeth that I didn't even know was there. Every night before bedtime, just 90 seconds of pulsing water with a few drops of mouthwash in the bin (because the water here tastes horrible). Huge difference.
I am considering going to a third dentist. I wish I could wait until I move away from this area, which is also a priority, but I'm worried about delaying the #18 crown even longer.
I read all of your first post and decided I need to stay with my current dentist. LOL
If what you want is to have #18 crowned, then say that when you go to a dentist. Cut them off if they start trying to sell you all kinds of other stuff. Don't leave if you feel they haven't adequately addressed #18. Tell them you can't afford all that other stuff. After you get #18 fixed to your satisfaction you can consider what else you might need.
Alternatively, drive back to where your old dentist is, stay in a motel if necessary, and have him put a crown on. If it needs a root canal, and you trust what he says, then do that.
Cancer, and chemo if you had that, can mess up your teeth. You probably waited too long to see a dentist afterward.
I got to the part where you specified you hadn't been to the dentist since 2016, and that you had a year dealing with cancer.
So here's my thoughts:
You didn't go to the dentist for almost six years, AND you had cancer - and I'm guessing at least some amount of either chemo, or radiation, or both. Either or both can have an effect on your bones and your teeth. You should not be surprised that there's still staining.
It also sounds like you might've been allergic to the adhesive they used to secure the crown. That happens, some people have allergies.
Also, if you haven't been using an electric toothbrush all this time, you'll find the difference profound when you get one. You can buy a "basic" model Oral B for around $20. The replacement heads are stupidly expensive, almost $10, each one good for around 3 months. But that's $40 a year for replacement heads, compared to the cost of not going to the dentist for 6 years. WaterPiks are awesome. Used them when I was a kid, then stopped, and got one again around 2 years ago and am SO glad I did. That thing pushes stuff out from between my teeth that I didn't even know was there. Every night before bedtime, just 90 seconds of pulsing water with a few drops of mouthwash in the bin (because the water here tastes horrible). Huge difference.
Thank you for your thoughts. It was actually five years and longer than my normal schedule due to several extenuating circumstances, but my regular hygienist had my teeth super sparkly when I had a delay one other time (2008 Great Recession). I didn't have chemo or radiation. The bottom line is the hygienist that I went to recently was the worst ever and should not being doing that job.
I have other crowns, but I've never been allergic to the adhesive/cement before. I'll never forget the day that terrible dentist put the crown on #18. I can't recall his exact words without looking back at my notes, but I remember finding it strange when his assistant first handed him the cement. He basically said that it was the wrong one so she gave him something different. I was extremely dizzy for quite some time after I got the crown, but it eventually subsided. I've never had that happen before either.
I bought an Oral B Pro 1000, but I haven't used it yet. I wanted to make sure that I get one with the smallest toothbrush head, but I found there aren't a lot of options here so I'll probably keep it. I intend to also get a Waterpik, but I think it might be wise to wait until I get the permanent on #18 because I don't want to cause the temporary to come off. I'm excited about starting to use both and can't believe I never have, especially considering so many people seem to love them.
I read all of your first post and decided I need to stay with my current dentist. LOL
If what you want is to have #18 crowned, then say that when you go to a dentist. Cut them off if they start trying to sell you all kinds of other stuff. Don't leave if you feel they haven't adequately addressed #18. Tell them you can't afford all that other stuff. After you get #18 fixed to your satisfaction you can consider what else you might need.
Alternatively, drive back to where your old dentist is, stay in a motel if necessary, and have him put a crown on. If it needs a root canal, and you trust what he says, then do that.
Cancer, and chemo if you had that, can mess up your teeth. You probably waited too long to see a dentist afterward.
Thanks Windwalker2. I really appreciate you taking the time to read my first post and for being so patient.
I realize it was way too long so I shortened it in a later post.
It's amazing how many people I've talked to who also say they've had bad experiences in this area. Someone recently told me that their neighbors are a married couple who are both retired dentists who moved from up north. When this person asked who they'd recommend here, they said no one and said they still go to their dentist up north. Sad.
I appreciate your advice on what I should do with this big dilemma that's continuing to hang over my head. I definitely need to get #18 done pronto because I've had this temporary on for way too long. Others have suggested that I drive back to my old dentist so you also have me thinking that maybe I should do that. I just don't know how he'll be towards me now since I didn't go back to him in 2016 for that crown, and time is also of the essence. I hope I don't need a root canal, but if I do, I'd go to an endodontist to have that done. The dentist who put that #18 crown on better hope it's not necessary!
I never would have gone five years without going to the dentist and having my teeth cleaned, but sometimes things happen in life where you have no choice, like getting cancer, then COVID happened, etc.
Last edited by LFJourney; 03-21-2022 at 04:16 PM..
Thank you for your thoughts. It was actually five years and longer than my normal schedule due to several extenuating circumstances, but my regular hygienist had my teeth super sparkly when I had a delay one other time (2008 Great Recession). I didn't have chemo or radiation. The bottom line is the hygienist that I went to recently was the worst ever and should not being doing that job.
I have other crowns, but I've never been allergic to the adhesive/cement before. I'll never forget the day that terrible dentist put the crown on #18. I can't recall his exact words without looking back at my notes, but I remember finding it strange when his assistant first handed him the cement. He basically said that it was the wrong one so she gave him something different. I was extremely dizzy for quite some time after I got the crown, but it eventually subsided. I've never had that happen before either.
I bought an Oral B Pro 1000, but I haven't used it yet. I wanted to make sure that I get one with the smallest toothbrush head, but I found there aren't a lot of options here so I'll probably keep it. I intend to also get a Waterpik, but I think it might be wise to wait until I get the permanent on #18 because I don't want to cause the temporary to come off. I'm excited about starting to use both and can't believe I never have, especially considering so many people seem to love them.
The pro-1000 is fine. You don't need bluetooth connections to a toothbrushing app or the myriad of settings that I have (and never use). I've been using an OralB electric for many years. Current is a pro-5000 that's a few years old, and I keep my first one, the $20 special from Costco/Sam's/BJ's in my suitcase for travel. Honestly, the only downside to these things is the cost of the replacement heads. If you have an Amazon account get them there. But get the "legit" OralB heads. The fake ones pop off while you're using the brush. It can get messy.
Very smart about not using a waterpik until you get the crown properly replaced and seated. Your dentist would approve. Don't be afraid to use the toothbrush right away. Very important with electric toothbrushes: you need a LIGHT touch with them. Don't push down, don't "brush" with the brush. Let the brush head do all the work. There should be no more pressure than how it would feel to rest a quarter on the back of your hand. Use the brush on the surface of the teeth. With an even more gentle touch, use the brush on your gums as well. Super-light touch. Just tickle them. It'll help with the circulation.
Use just a pea-sized drop of fluoride toothpaste, and brush for around 30 seconds on each quadrant, for a total of 2 full minutes of brushing.
Root planing and scaling is one of several things they do during periodontal maintenance. It's part of a treatment plan called periodontal maintenance. They don't have to do a root planing and scaling every three months. They should only need to do that once, and the other three month checkups are the REST of the treatment plan. Think of periodontal maintenance as a series of four visits in a single year. One visit is root planing and scaling. Another is a followup for that, to make sure everything is healing well and the pockets are tightening up again. The third is bitewings and cleaning, and checking for cavities and recession. The last is usually just a checkup and polish, if the rest of the year went according to plan.
All of that, combined, is the treatment plan known as periodontal maintenance.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
