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What an incredibly sad story!! It is really disgusting that a 180 lb person felt the need to take such drastic measures in the name of weight loss.
This is definitely sad. Sad that she died. Sad that she opted for a surgery at only 180 pounds. Sad that the doctor proceeded with this proceedure on her.
I am NOT a fan of surgeries like this. Sure it may be necessary and the only hope for someone who is older and/or physically unable to begin an exercise program, but for folks who are younger they should be able to workout and eat right.
Heard a commercial for this on the radio while driving the other day. One gal said she had procedure done and dropped 17 dress sizes and another said she dropped 23 dress sizes. WTF?!?! What were they doing when they were only 5-7 dress sizes too big? I think its a perfect storm of lazyness, stupidity, ignorance, and more lazyness.
What an incredibly sad story!! It is really disgusting that a 180 lb person felt the need to take such drastic measures in the name of weight loss.
This has been an extremely interesting thread. The various points of view are very interesting to me.
Something I am not seeing adequately addressed anywhere is the ADDICTION component of overeating/morbid obesity. Many morbidly obese persons are truly binge eaters (which is an eating disorder). Addictions are not cured by this surgery. I have researched this extensively, due to my best friend becoming a full-blown alcoholic years after her bariatric surgery, and now witnessing my own husband, unable to overeat, as angry and unhappy and developing different addictions. I know so many people who have had bariatric surgery personally, and I would say that 75% of them now have a different postop addiction, be it alcohol, drugs, gambling, sex, shopping, you name it.
The preoperative "counseling" in most cases is a joke. The docs want to talk you into surgery to make money, and then maybe you can even come back and give them or their friends/colleagues some more money for your plastic surgery. People like my husband blame ALL their problems on being overweight and figure this surgery is indeed a "quick fix" to solve the problems. When food has been a familiar comfort for years and then this comfort is abruptly removed, well I can see how it would really mess with a person's mental state.
Also in many cases, there is a general attitude of "noncompliance" with the morbidly obese as well. After undergoing surgery, they push the limits with regard to foods they are eating (one more bite of the cheesecake please), the vitamins they are supposed to take, and the exercise. Eating a couple of bites of cheesecake is not going to provide the body with the nutrition it needs. Skipping the vitamins can have disastrous health consequences as well. Heck, some very compliant weight-loss surgery patients end up with profound deficiencies in spite of their best efforts.
I think that all this treating of the "symptom" of morbid obesity rather than the cause is like running around trying to stomp out a forest fire with your boots...
Ironically enough, when my own best friend got the intensive help she needed for her alcoholism and really "took charge" of her life, she began losing weight on her own, which finally ended up taking her far beyond her lowest "post surgery" weight and she is healthier than ever now
I have seen what you mentioned about addictions and how the morbidly obese continue to have addictive personalities. A friend of mine was very overweight (600 lbs) and went to have weight-loss surgery (not sure which procedure it was). He had complications before, during and after the surgery. It did not benefit him to have horrible stuff such as Krispy Kremes snuck into the hospital afterward. Sure enough, he was dead 2 weeks after the surgery.
I am still considering having this surgery though my wife is against it.
Keep forgetting to mention this.. if anyone is considering weight loss surgery, don't even think about the lap-band. Roux-en-Y (gastric bypass) is called the gold standard for a reason. You can cheat with the lap-band and it requires constant adjustments; six in the first year alone according to the initial presentation they gave us when we decided which route to go. I would say about 90% of the room went with the ReY. Not sure if my clinic keeps track of which one is most successful, but it would be interesting. I'm sure you can cheat at least a little with each method, but I know for a fact the ReY will seriously mess you up if you go overboard. I still do it every once in a while and it's pure misery for at least an hour afterwards. Things like that really help you stay focused and also change your perception towards a lot of foods. Fried things always make me sick, so they're now disgusting to even think about. Sweets are supposed to make me sick, but I tolerate a moderate amount with no problems. However, there is that limit and bad memories of what happens when I cross that line usually keep me from doing it in the first place. I would say I screw up maybe once every couple months now.
I don't want to offend anyone, but it's really difficult for me to understand why someone would to choose to undergo a procedure that's not only risky, but makes your life hell afterwards, and most importantly, doesn't do anything that couldn't be achieved by dietary choices without it. I understand it's hard for someone used to eating large amounts of food to drastically cut back; but is it really easier to go through massive physical pain, extreme digestive disturbances, and to have each meal be a torturous process accompanied by pain, vomiting, etc.? Wouldn't it be easier to exercise willpower and maybe suffer through some - gasp! - hunger, than suffer through all of this?? And believe me, I hate to sound judgmental as I'm one of the most weak-willed people ever...but the idea of going through so much physical discomfort would scare the living hell out of me into doing whatever else it takes... Also, I find it puzzling how in other threads people always refer to health problems that make it impossible to lose weight through diet - hormone imbalance, thyroid, diabetes, etc., in which case the surgery technically shouldn't help either...and yet people claiming they can't lose weight by dieting end up losing weight with the surgery, even though it's still technically "dieting" since bypass doesn't change one's hormones or metabolism...so why not just diet in the first place? I just don't really understand...
Location: where you sip the tea of the breasts of the spinsters of Utica
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Quote:
I don't want to offend anyone, but it's really difficult for me to understand why someone would to choose to undergo a procedure that's not only risky, but makes your life hell afterwards, and most importantly, doesn't do anything that couldn't be achieved by dietary choices without it.
How many times do the same points need to be brought up and answered thoroughly?
To begin with, you might actually want to focus in on what RD and AnonChick have said. I don't say this flippantly - I mean you should actually go back with your objections in mind, and CAREFULLY read what they said. Word by word, phrase by phrase, sentence by sentence.
People who have put on weight recently in adult life probably can take it off without surgery. ALWAYS one must have tried diet and exercise several times - that's a requirement except perhaps for the sleaziest of clinics. To avoid getting into a sleazy private clinic, ask your family doctor for a referral.
Supposedly Einstein (multiple attributions for this) once said "Insanity is when you keep doing the same things expecting different results". That's why bariatric surgery is used when the other methods have failed again and again.
If a doctor recommended a treatment for something like, say, cancer ....... and that treatment only worked 5% of the time (as with diet and exercise), and if there were another option that worked over 50% of the time, then the doctor would be rightfully considered to be a quack and should lose his license if he keeps doing it.
How many times do the same points need to be brought up and answered thoroughly?
To begin with, you might actually want to focus in on what RD and AnonChick have said. I don't say this flippantly - I mean you should actually go back with your objections in mind, and CAREFULLY read what they said. Word by word, phrase by phrase, sentence by sentence.
People who have put on weight recently in adult life probably can take it off without surgery. ALWAYS one must have tried diet and exercise several times - that's a requirement except perhaps for the sleaziest of clinics. To avoid getting into a sleazy private clinic, ask your family doctor for a referral.
Supposedly Einstein (multiple attributions for this) once said "Insanity is when you keep doing the same things expecting different results". That's why bariatric surgery is used when the other methods have failed again and again.
If a doctor recommended a treatment for something like, say, cancer ....... and that treatment only worked 5% of the time (as with diet and exercise), and if there were another option that worked over 50% of the time, then the doctor would be rightfully considered to be a quack and should lose his license if he keeps doing it.
Well there are plenty of people who end up regaining the weight after surgery too...they start eating and stretch their stomachs out again, not that uncommon. Because the point is, if the person has repeatedly tried and failed to diet, regaining the weight each time, chances are it's going to happen with the surgery too. If you lose weight through surgery, that means its not medical or metabolism issues that are preventing you from losing - it's lack of willpower. And the surgery won't help with that. What those people would really need in that case is counselling, some kind of psychological assistance with motivation and follow-through...surgery then just becomes a very dangerous temporary quick fix.
Location: where you sip the tea of the breasts of the spinsters of Utica
8,297 posts, read 14,198,444 times
Reputation: 8105
So you're saying that statistics don't matter, that if one person failed at bariatric surgery they all will fail?
It means nothing to you that less than 5% of the morbidly obese succeed with diet and exercise, while more than 50% of bariatric surgery patients MAINTAIN their weightloss and improved health for the rest of their longer lives?
That means nothing to you? You just discard that on a whim, while refusing to carefully read what RD and AnonChick wrote?
What does that say about the depth of your opinions?
Keep forgetting to mention this.. if anyone is considering weight loss surgery, don't even think about the lap-band. Roux-en-Y (gastric bypass) is called the gold standard for a reason. You can cheat with the lap-band and it requires constant adjustments; six in the first year alone according to the initial presentation they gave us when we decided which route to go. I would say about 90% of the room went with the ReY. Not sure if my clinic keeps track of which one is most successful, but it would be interesting. I'm sure you can cheat at least a little with each method, but I know for a fact the ReY will seriously mess you up if you go overboard. I still do it every once in a while and it's pure misery for at least an hour afterwards. Things like that really help you stay focused and also change your perception towards a lot of foods. Fried things always make me sick, so they're now disgusting to even think about. Sweets are supposed to make me sick, but I tolerate a moderate amount with no problems. However, there is that limit and bad memories of what happens when I cross that line usually keep me from doing it in the first place. I would say I screw up maybe once every couple months now.
I do understand what you are saying re the two surgeries. If you remember when you compared them, both surgeries are restrictive (in that they reduce the stomach to the tiny pouch). However, the enhancement in weight loss with the Roux-en-Y is magnified due to the malabsorptive component of this surgery as well. I need to look up the stats to refresh my memory, but DH's surgery showed us graphs where the weight loss with the Roux-en-Y was quicker and more substantial than that with the Lap-Band.
Whether or not you have "consequences" for going overboard with each surgery is highly individual. My best friend had the surgery a long time ago, an open procedure. She reacts to junk foods by having classic "dumping" and avoids these foods. My husband does not react in this way and regularly eats "junk" even now, just four months out. Sure it is teeny tiny quantities of potato chips and chocolate and uber-sweet coffee drinks, but that is junk nonetheless. But he thinks all is well because he is still dropping numbers on the scale
I don't want to offend anyone, but it's really difficult for me to understand why someone would to choose to undergo a procedure that's not only risky, but makes your life hell afterwards, and most importantly, doesn't do anything that couldn't be achieved by dietary choices without it.
Their lives are already hell. When your life is hell, you'll do anything short of ending it - and some even do that -to alleviate the pain. It's obvious that if these people had been able to lose weight and keep it off via dietary choices, they would have done so.
Quote:
I understand it's hard for someone used to eating large amounts of food to drastically cut back; but is it really easier to go through massive physical pain, extreme digestive disturbances, and to have each meal be a torturous process accompanied by pain, vomiting, etc.?
Most people who have bariatric surgery don't have consequences this extreme.
Quote:
Wouldn't it be easier to exercise willpower and maybe suffer through some - gasp! - hunger, than suffer through all of this?? And believe me, I hate to sound judgmental as I'm one of the most weak-willed people ever...but the idea of going through so much physical discomfort would scare the living hell out of me into doing whatever else it takes... Also, I find it puzzling how in other threads people always refer to health problems that make it impossible to lose weight through diet - hormone imbalance, thyroid, diabetes, etc., in which case the surgery technically shouldn't help either...and yet people claiming they can't lose weight by dieting end up losing weight with the surgery, even though it's still technically "dieting" since bypass doesn't change one's hormones or metabolism...so why not just diet in the first place? I just don't really understand...
You're right - you don't understand.
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What were they doing when they were only 5-7 dress sizes too big? I think its a perfect storm of lazyness, stupidity, ignorance, and more lazyness.
