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Several months ago our dog was drooling, quite a bit, and seemed in a daze. This lasted for 10 mins or so. Happened again one more time and then two days ago she had her first seizure.
Went to the vet, did full blood work and it's all normal. Really don't see a need for spending thousands on an MRI, pretty much one possibility at this point according to the vet.
Dog is 11.5 years old, lab shepard mix. Our first. We've had her since 6 months old. This is really hitting us hard. We have planned many things to do in the remaining days, which we aren't sure how many there will be. Tomorrow we're going to make paw imprints and go for ice cream. Also ordered a Wisdom panel test kit (I've always been curious).
Anyone been through this? What to expect? How long? She's been through a lot and still looks great for her age, this is really tough. Honestly we've never cried more in our lives.
I have never been through it with a dog. But with a human, it slowly gets worse. Dog may go into a daze for longer periods of time more often. It sucks. I feel for you. At least she is not going through it alone and has you/family. Your dog most likely knows something is really wrong with her, and is at peace with it, ready to face any problems. All you can do is comfort her and she will appreciate it. I hope your dog lives a long time, you never know. God bless her.
Several months ago our dog was drooling, quite a bit, and seemed in a daze. This lasted for 10 mins or so. Happened again one more time and then two days ago she had her first seizure.
Went to the vet, did full blood work and it's all normal. Really don't see a need for spending thousands on an MRI, pretty much one possibility at this point according to the vet.
Dog is 11.5 years old, lab shepard mix. Our first. We've had her since 6 months old. This is really hitting us hard. We have planned many things to do in the remaining days, which we aren't sure how many there will be. Tomorrow we're going to make paw imprints and go for ice cream. Also ordered a Wisdom panel test kit (I've always been curious).
Anyone been through this? What to expect? How long? She's been through a lot and still looks great for her age, this is really tough. Honestly we've never cried more in our lives.
First I want you to know that you are not alone and that you will make it through this. You will love your precious dog beautifully in the time you have left with her and she will feel that. Your heart will wrench apart...that's OK. Let it happen. Rely on your dog-loving family and friends...they will be able to understand your grief whereas others may not. Your heart will mend and you will love a dog again.
Our 13 1/2 year old Aussie was diagnosed with a brain tumor about two months ago. We also passed on the MRI since the diagnosis was fairly clear cut according to our vet. Like your dog, she looks great and her labs were "stellar" according to our vet.
This is what we were told to expect:
1. Her seizures will increase in both duration and frequency depending on what part of the brain the tumor is growing into/pressuring
2. Her symptoms will include some or all of the following depending on what part of the brain the tumor is growing into/pressuring: confusion, personality changes, incontinence
3. Her tumor will grow
4. We have from a few months to one year left to enjoy her
5. Once her seizures increase in duration/frequency we could try one of the anti-seizure meds but they may not work for tumor-related seizures the way they do for epilepsy
6. If her seizures increase to the point of many in any given day and/or become severe or long lasting we should consider letting her go since that is very hard on a dog
I moved some stuff into a spare room and closed the door...stuff that I could envision my dog getting tangled up in and possibly overturning if she seized while we were away from home. I wanted to make our home as safe as possible for her.
Take lots of video/pictures of her with both you and your SO. Capture moments that are especially "her".
I would guess that your dog was actually seizing during that 10 minute daze/drool. Seizures in dogs can wear many costumes so they can be hard to detect...as little as a stand and stare with a blank look can be a seizure. My Karma shivered and could not stand/walk...kept trying but kept dropping...and her tongue hung out the side of her mouth for about five minutes during her first observed seizure. I tried my best to keep her laying down and comforted her with touch and soothing words. She has had several much less intense seizures since then...about one a week. But we likely miss some of them since we both work.
I am so sorry for your pain, Wheelsup. It sucks. Love her and make her the center of your world...like you are doing. She is your angel and you are hers. God bless you.
I should add that there are treatment options (surgery, radiation, chemo) but my vet said that treatment often does not affect prognosis much if at all. She said an MRI is necessary in order to treat since treatment varies based on the type of tumor. We decided not to treat since our dog would not tolerate any of that well and because of her age. But every situation is different.
I've lost a dog to a brain tumor and she didn't have those symptoms.
That's a good question.
The chem panel normally detects poisoning due to most toxins by virtue of abnormal kidney/liver markers. Wheelsup's dog's labs were fine. There are a few toxins that don't affect lab values...like caffeine. Toad toxicity would demonstrate hyperkalemia (abnormally high levels of potassium) which would be detected in the chem panel as well as an abnormal heartbeat which the vet would've easily picked up on. And the dog would've likely been pawing at her mouth and in obvious oral distress.
All that said, I am no doctor. But I am a Medical Technologist so lab results are somewhat my forte.
However, since the OP's dog had her initial incident several months ago there is the possibility of a toxin exposure at that time, the kidney/liver effects of which have since eased, now demonstrating neurological symptoms. Or the seizure may be unrelated. Without an MRI the vet makes their best guess based on the clinical history, owner interview and exam/labs.
In the absence of vestibular disease, poisoning and epilepsy, a brain tumor is the most likely and most common cause of seizure-like activity. Dogs do not recover quickly from vestibular episodes so if the dog recovered after 10-120 minutes that pretty much rules out VD and confirms a seizure. Poisoning should affect the chem panel. The onset of epilepsy typically occurs in much younger dogs. That leaves the brain tumor.
Brain tumors are unfortunately somewhat common in older dogs.
Cancer is very common in dogs...their feet, tongues and noses naturally encounter lawn chemicals (many known carcinogens) with great regularity over many years.
Apologies if my post feels clinical. It's hard to talk any other way about disease when you talk clinical medicine all day long.
The chem panel normally detects poisoning due to most toxins by virtue of abnormal kidney/liver markers. Wheelsup's dog's labs were fine. There are a few toxins that don't affect lab values...like caffeine. Toad toxicity would demonstrate hyperkalemia (abnormally high levels of potassium) which would be detected in the chem panel as well as an abnormal heartbeat which the vet would've easily picked up on. And the dog would've likely been pawing at her mouth and in obvious oral distress.
All that said, I am no doctor. But I am a Medical Technologist so lab results are somewhat my forte.
However, since the OP's dog had her initial incident several months ago there is the possibility of a toxin exposure at that time, the kidney/liver effects of which have since eased, now demonstrating neurological symptoms. Or the seizure may be unrelated. Without an MRI the vet makes their best guess based on the clinical history, owner interview and exam/labs.
In the absence of vestibular disease, poisoning and epilepsy, a brain tumor is the most likely and most common cause of seizure-like activity. Dogs do not recover quickly from vestibular episodes so if the dog recovered after 10-120 minutes that pretty much rules out VD and confirms a seizure. Poisoning should affect the chem panel. The onset of epilepsy typically occurs in much younger dogs. That leaves the brain tumor.
Brain tumors are unfortunately somewhat common in older dogs.
Cancer is very common in dogs...their feet, tongues and noses naturally encounter lawn chemicals (many known carcinogens) with great regularity over many years.
Apologies if my post feels clinical. It's hard to talk any other way about disease when you talk clinical medicine all day long.
Thanks for the posts. It hurts to hear but would be worse to put our heads in the sand. My wife has been on me about lawn chemicals for years, I do use them once a year and we do keep our dog off the lawn but you never know. Also many other people use them in our neighborhood, she likes to eat grass a lot so I'm sure it has stemmed from that. Chances are this was avoidable, which makes me sick. Hopefully I'm not at risk for cancer myself from using them! Although I have begun to read some very bad studies in my research.
This is a huge wake up call for me.
We have an appointment at a fairly big state vet school but have to wait a month to even get in. Frustrating. It seems cancer of this type is treatable but not curable and will extend life but not much. This is so overwhelming. It's really hard to see this unfold. Our entire lives have been turned upside down over the past few days.
Thanks for the posts. It hurts to hear but would be worse to put our heads in the sand. My wife has been on me about lawn chemicals for years, I do use them once a year and we do keep our dog off the lawn but you never know. Also many other people use them in our neighborhood, she likes to eat grass a lot so I'm sure it has stemmed from that. Chances are this was avoidable, which makes me sick. Hopefully I'm not at risk for cancer myself from using them! Although I have begun to read some very bad studies in my research.
This is a huge wake up call for me.
We have an appointment at a fairly big state vet school but have to wait a month to even get in. Frustrating. It seems cancer of this type is treatable but not curable and will extend life but not much. This is so overwhelming. It's really hard to see this unfold. Our entire lives have been turned upside down over the past few days.
Wheelsup...this is not your fault. It's impossible to keep a dog off treated grass throughout it's entire life unless you never take your dog off your property and that's no life for a dog besides denying them the socialization they require to be confident and well adjusted.
I've known about the link between cancer and lawn chemicals for many, many years and we have been extremely proactive/cautious about it and our dog has a brain tumor.
You are wise to listen to the wake up call but please do not blame yourself. Dogs are dogs.
You will most likely have to get an MRI on her in order to treat the cancer since the type of cancer dictates the type of treatment and, as far as I know, the cancer type can only be identified on MRI. Please carefully consider how much you are willing to put your dog through for the possibility of a few additional months with her. Just put your dog's welfare and peace of mind first and you will make the right decision.
Wheelsup...this is not your fault. It's impossible to keep a dog off treated grass throughout it's entire life unless you never take your dog off your property and that's no life for a dog besides denying them the socialization they require to be confident and well adjusted.
I've known about the link between cancer and lawn chemicals for many, many years and we have been extremely proactive/cautious about it and our dog has a brain tumor.
You are wise to listen to the wake up call but please do not blame yourself. Dogs are dogs.
You will most likely have to get an MRI on her in order to treat the cancer since the type of cancer dictates the type of treatment and, as far as I know, the cancer type can only be identified on MRI. Please carefully consider how much you are willing to put your dog through for the possibility of a few additional months with her. Just put your dog's welfare and peace of mind first and you will make the right decision.
God bless you and your sweet canine companion.
Forgot to add this...
I didn't mean to suggest that your vet school appt. is unwarranted. If you doubt your vet's diagnostic abilities at all then a visit to the vet school is a very good idea. Some vets are excellent diagnosticians. Others not so much. Like in any field. And the vet school can likely give you a better idea of diagnostic/treatment options and their ramifications.
There are lots of things for you to consider. It's tough when emotions are running so tender. I'd suggest making a list of the pros and cons, for both you and for your dog, to help with the process. When we did that the cons far outweighed the pros which made our decision not to identify/treat the cancer much easier to make and live with.
Older dogs may not handle sedation well so that is always an important consideration. For us, we knew we would feel horrific if our dog did not survive the sedation process since we'd have had much more quality time with her otherwise. YMMV.
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