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I dont know about that. If you spend time toiling in something, it can be very difficult to get out of that.
Personal example. I graduated with a degree in Finance, and I ended up falling in to the accounting profession because of lack of opportunities. Ive been doing it so long now, that Im pidgeonholed in to accounting, and to do anything else would A. Be a giant step backwards and B. Difficult to do, since the entry level jobs on the tracks Id rather be on are given to people who are much younger.
While I do scoff that he turned his nose up at a relatively ok paying job, I think the argument that going off in a direction simply to have any kind of employment can do irrepairable harm to your career.
I know there are many factors beyond this, but if I were interviewing two candidates for some jr. exec position at an insurance agency, and one of them was a claims adjuster for a year out of college, and the other was a "sandwich artist" for a few months out of college, I'd be more inclined to go with the claims adjuster.
I know there are many factors beyond this, but if I were interviewing two candidates for some jr. exec position at an insurance agency, and one of them was a claims adjuster for a year out of college, and the other was a "sandwich artist" for a few months out of college, I'd be more inclined to go with the claims adjuster.
Remember,the job was in Boston. I don't think 40,000/year is enough to live on in the Boston area. So He may be better off financially not taking the job and staying with his parents awhile longer.
To be sure, one might reasonably argue that not everyone, not even everyone with excellent college credentials, can hold out for a $75K salary. True enough. But not everyone wants to hold out for a high salary. And many of those who do will ultimately change their mind. Maybe even this young man. So?
My question is: Why do the sober-minded, future-oriented career choices of today’s Millennials make so many Boomers and Xers jump up and down in agitated condemnation?
Boomers have had DECADES to get their house in order.
Their recklessness has run millennials and gen y right off the road. Lots of happy thoughts, confidence, "be your best", "aim high" mantras told to this student throughout k-12. If you come off highschool and college with an intellectual pumped up high, then its only natural to want to "hold out" for better prospects.
-Think about the selection and choice you get as a top highschool student. Get to pick your own ap classes, or other advanced classes, pick your college (after 6 or 12 applications), pick when you want to apply, etc. At age 24, this kid is getting vilified.
When these loud complainers were 24, lets see....they probably had little or no debt. Very low cost standard of living. An entirely different employment structure during the 50's to 70's. How many 20 or 30 somethings were declaring bankruptcy in 1965 or 70? Probably none (or very few). Its apples to oranges.
Gen y/millennials have to wade through a minefield. Opps, wrong move and you lose 30-50% on your house in 3 or 5 years. Opps, there is no economic recovery.
Gen y's are optimistic, yet cautious and pragmatic. When you were 24 in the 50's or 70's, you couldn't mess up your life that badly, not like today.
-Late gen x, gen y (millennials) probably got the worst k-12 education of anyone in the 20th century. Wild exaggeration drilled into your head for 12 years. They got a terrible disservice done in this new world, new labor economy.
"Just go to school. You'll be successful".
"Just go to college. Study hard. Opportunities will open up".
Everything was real nebulous and vague for this generation. No hard look at globalization was taught in k-12. No hard analysis was done of the economy. Everything was happy, happy, happy. Pats on the back for being a good student.
There's probably a correlation between pats on the back in school (and false confidence), and false confidence after you leave school into the real world. Certainly it's a lingering factor. If you've been told certain things, your expectations are probably at a certain level. Getting use to a *lower level* that you never anticipated, probably will take some time.
-I bet he was taught in highschool that depressions don't happen anymore. I was taught that in highschool in the 90's (at a large public highschool). Bank runs and bank panics don't happen anymore. Problems happened in the "old days". Funny how everything turned in 10 or 15 years.
-I don't think millennials have been taught the future. They've been taught things that sound nice. The future has been papered over.
That's partly why expectations are so high ($50-$75 k a year or more starting). Millennials got a happy party for 12 or 15 years. Everyone is a winner. Every degree will work out.
There is a lot of merit to your points. This is the problem when schools adopt vague themes of preparing every student for college. Many school systems have eliminated trade and vocational education programs altogether.
Schools themselves have moved from institutions that provided strong fundamental curriculum supplemented by elective courses that expanded knowledge and thinking skills to a test-centered institution designed to make students ready for admission into a post-secondary school. This strategy largely ignores aptitude, motivation, or interest.
You are right that not enough real-world information is given to students as they plan their future. Far too many students are looking at majors that more closely match their current interests and activities they enjoy as opposed to areas that fill societal needs or offer future employment opportunities. Many teachers lack real-world experience beyond their own academically-based one and therefore may be unconsciously biased toward a college track in a field similar to the their own.
Interesting that this young man's choices cause such agitation amongst Xers and Boomers. I don't see him asking anybody to feel sorry for him, and his parents seem content to allow him to continue living at home. His time will come.
-Late gen x, gen y (millennials) probably got the worst k-12 education of anyone in the 20th century. Wild exaggeration drilled into your head for 12 years. They got a terrible disservice done in this new world, new labor economy.
"Just go to school. You'll be successful".
"Just go to college. Study hard. Opportunities will open up".
I agree that this nonsense was fed to your generation....and apparently you failed to question it. NEVER accept ANY authority without questioning it.
Last edited by CosmicWizard; 07-22-2010 at 12:40 PM..
Reason: correct another typo
Probably because boomers and xers are also going to be the similarly (or more) educated hiring managers who have a pile of resumes from experienced people willing to work for less money than millenials who want more money but have no experience. It may be sober minded to a fresh graduate. Personally, it is irksome that I'm forced to look through a bunch of resumes and listen to someone explain that they had an internship 3 hours a week in college, when I have experienced people with enterprise level experience, ready to start tomorrow. Experience means more money.
Also, nobody is the same. One person's good decision is another person's bad decision. This is only one story in a million, and should be taken as that. If a person believes they can hold out for however many months or years that it takes to get the right position, and they are flexible enough and/or are willing to relocate, then they may actually get their target salary. If they can do it, and are willing to wait, nobody can--or should--fault the decision. In my opinion, if the family is able to support a young graduate who is still in the job search process, and is willing to do so, that is strictly a personal and family decision, with which nobody should interfere.
Finally, the responses have nothing to do with America being a better place if millenials did anything or didn't do anything. If a person wants to live at home until age 40, and it works for them, good for them. However, as an x-er myself, I have no patience for people crying about not being able to find a job, when the translation is, not being able to find a job that pays much more than they are worth. However, I don't need to point that out, because where an expectation vs. experience disparity exists, the reality usually hits home after a year or two.
-Late gen x, gen y (millennials) probably got the worst k-12 education of anyone in the 20th century. Wild exaggeration drilled into your head for 12 years. They got a terrible disservice done in this new world, new labor economy.
"Just go to school. You'll be successful".
"Just go to college. Study hard. Opportunities will open up".
I agree that this nonsense was fed to your generation....and apparently you failed to question it. NEVER accept ANY authority without questioning it.
Now I question it. But take your average 15 or 17 year old in highschool in the middle 1990's (when I graduated highschool).
-True information that made you question anything was walled off. Either in school, from government mandated school books. Or outside of school in the media (basically government mandated programming). Very few highschoolers penetrate both of those walls. How many highschoolers in the 90's could have told you...
-The economic "prosperity" we were having is an illusion.
-Safeguards in the economy (and for capitalism) are being eliminated. I.e. glass steagall being repealed in 1999. Or Fannie Mae accounting shenanigans.
None of the problems in the 2000's...derivatives, subprime lending, credit meltdown, us dollar/currency problems, *none of them* were really highlighted at all in the 90's for a typical highschool student to learn about. None. I dont think thats a coicidence. They wanted this generation very naive, very vulnerable, very dependent on others. Very much with an umbilical cord still tied to you at 24 or 26. Even with a nice degree, or a masters, you still need help from mom and dad.
None of the textbooks in highschool mention things like....collusion, greed, ego, power, stupidity, irrationality, etc. Everyone is rational, acting in the best interest of themselves or their country (or corporate interest). Highschool books don't want you to question anything, because everyone is acting in their own best interest (and ultimately for your interest).
Its funny that now people in 2008 or 2010 question capitalism, but no one questioned capitalism in the 90's. I dont remember one debate about capitalism in highschool (or if it could work). Its very interesting that 10 or 15 years later, everything changes. Before the rug is pulled out beneath you, maybe it'd be wise to debate the highs and lows of the economy.
In a lot of these jobs articles (like in the ny times) they show graphs of employment....by 18-29, or 55 and older. Employment wasnt broken down at all in highschool. k-12, is the like going through basic training, preparing to do certain things after that training. But the reality is skydiving, or surfing, and you "trained" for 12 years to be a runner. Its so far off course. Its not even the same physical activity. Let alone the specific skill sets needed to succeed in that activity.
-I think for this generation (gen y, millennials), authority is very blurred. Parents were probably more of an authority figure during the 50's to 70's, since they were home more, there was more uninterrupted time to discuss things, had clearer thought, weren't as bombarded by the media etc. Not so today. Authority is now the media. The media wants closeness (and your wallet). They want you to think of them as family members, or friends. Or authority is blinding marketing (like US News and World Report) ranking every college as great.
When was the last time you saw newsweek or us news, world report rank welding schools, or tech vocational? Its more practical for the average person, but they don't. Its part of this collusion and blindness in society. I think the stated goal of highschool now, they want everyone half way blind when they graduate. And they don't want anyone deviating an inch from that.
Now I question it. But take your average 15 or 17 year old in highschool in the middle 1990's (when I graduated highschool).
Unfortunately this is true for any timeframe.We have always been taught to be OBEDIENT and not to question authority.
-True information that made you question anything was walled off. Either in school, from government mandated school books. Or outside of school in the media (basically government mandated programming). Very few highschoolers penetrate both of those walls. How many highschoolers in the 90's could have told you...
I agree that there were more government mandates that you had to deal with, and even more interference today.
-The economic "prosperity" we were having is an illusion. -Safeguards in the economy (and for capitalism) are being eliminated. I.e. glass steagall being repealed in 1999. Or Fannie Mae accounting shenanigans.
Yeah the game is more rigged in favor of the really BIG guy today
None of the problems in the 2000's...derivatives, subprime lending, credit meltdown, us dollar/currency problems, *none of them* were really highlighted at all in the 90's for a typical highschool student to learn about. None. I dont think thats a coicidence. They wanted this generation very naive, very vulnerable, very dependent on others. Very much with an umbilical cord still tied to you at 24 or 26. Even with a nice degree, or a masters, you still need help from mom and dad.
Nor were these problems highlighted for the public at large. And yes I think you were fed a load of crap about getting a degree and you'll be set for life...but then again how seriously did you question this nonsense?
None of the textbooks in highschool mention things like....collusion, greed, ego, power, stupidity, irrationality, etc. Everyone is rational, acting in the best interest of themselves or their country (or corporate interest). Highschool books don't want you to question anything, because everyone is acting in their own best interest (and ultimately for your interest).
You nailed this right on the head!
Its funny that now people in 2008 or 2010 question capitalism, but no one questioned capitalism in the 90's. I dont remember one debate about capitalism in highschool (or if it could work). Its very interesting that 10 or 15 years later, everything changes. Before the rug is pulled out beneath you, maybe it'd be wise to debate the highs and lows of the economy.
I don't remember having any HS debates on capitalism in the 60s either, butwe-the-students questioned capitalism big time in the late 60s. Then 10 years down the road we got tired of being hippies and became more capitilistic than the generation before us. It's a real challenge to live in a capitilistic society and NOT become a dedictaed practitioner of it. Good luck to you!
In a lot of these jobs articles (like in the ny times) they show graphs of employment....by 18-29, or 55 and older. Employment wasnt broken down at all in highschool. k-12, is the like going through basic training, preparing to do certain things after that training. But the reality is skydiving, or surfing, and you "trained" for 12 years to be a runner. Its so far off course. Its not even the same physical activity. Let alone the specific skill sets needed to succeed in that activity. no comment
-I think for this generation (gen y, millennials), authority is very blurred. Parents were probably more of an authority figure during the 50's to 70's, since they were home more, there was more uninterrupted time to discuss things, had clearer thought, weren't as bombarded by the media etc. Not so today. Authority is now the media. The media wants closeness (and your wallet). They want you to think of them as family members, or friends. Or authority is blinding marketing (like US News and World Report) ranking every college as great.
Right again!
When was the last time you saw newsweek or us news, world report rank welding schools, or tech vocational? Its more practical for the average person, but they don't. Its part of this collusion and blindness in society. I think the stated goal of highschool now, they want everyone half way blind when they graduate. And they don't want anyone deviating an inch from that.
If you go to welding school for example you won't accumulate as big of a debt, so you will be harder to manipulate and control. When you're in debt you are easier to manipulate! What better way to get someone in debt from the get-go than to get them *ss deep in debt for that all-important piece of paper from a university. And you're right about having that piece of paper sold to you for 12 years prior to coming of college age. It's hard not to be affected by a 12 year barrage of manipulation...yet it is still your responsibility to think for yourself, to think outside the box that you are manipulated into.
Great post John!
Last edited by CosmicWizard; 07-23-2010 at 09:06 AM..
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