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I'm a Nurse and this is *******s. Your basic premise of nursing salaries being the "main driver" is flawed though part of your educational argument is correct. English and Math requirements are silly. One has to be a HS grad and thus having had basic classes. Teaching algebra in a vacuum is silly and wastes time better spent on clinical skills. If a nursing student can pass clinical pharm then that's all the math they need.
And nurses being overpaid is crap. Spend 12 hours on your feet, so busy you can't use the bathroom or grab a bite, do it every night, as I have, for far less then $60, and call us overpaid.
Healthcare costs are one of the leading topics of discussion, riddled with all kinds of suggestions and proposals, none of which address the root of the problem which is high labor costs, particularly RN salaries. I know I'm stepping on toes with this topic, given the high number of RNs who probably visit this site.
However, the fact is Nursing salaries have been artificially propped up by this man-made shortage perpetuated by the silly entrance requirements and waiting lists in community college programs. I'm not talking about basic standards (those are needed). I'm talking about silly prerequisites like English classes or math even for those with bachelor’s degrees in other fields. Also, community colleges need to create more slots to accommodate the big waiting lists. That alone would basically end the so-called nursing shortage which has driven up nursing salaries to unsustainable levels. Yes, some will argue they're worth it but the salaries are just as unsustainable to hospitals as assembly line workers making over $60/hr was unsustainable to the auto sector which had to be bailed out.
If anyone really wants a thorough analysis of what's driving healthcare costs read:
We could make our health care costs drop by at least 50% just by eating healthy, not smoking, not drinking to excess, and getting some regular exercise.
To me, the highest contributing factor is our sue happy society. Doctors aren't allowed to just run what they believe to be the necessary tests, they must run those as well as a myriad of completely unnecessary tests, just to be sure they don't miss something and get sued over it. In addition, the number of malpractice suits drives up the cost of their insurance to an unsustainable level, forcing them to charge an unreasonable amount for their services, just to make a living.
Given what they have to put up with, I think most doctors and especially nurses are actually underpaid.
And no, I'm not a nurse/doctor, nor are any of my immediate family.
*Edit* Actually, going back and rereading, I will agree that high salaries (doctors and nurses both) are a cause of high health care costs, but they are just a proximal cause, not the ultimate cause. They are high because of other factors, which was my point. Your post implied that they are overpaid, and I totally disagree with that.
actually most doctors usually win because you have to show that most doctors wouldn't do the same or similar in the same circumstances it mainly makes the lawyers rich and makes the doctors insurance go up awhile which is passed on to us...i wish more people knew that people would be less sue happy...it's one of the least won classes of suits...because most of the time it can't be shown that they should have known to run the test or w/e unless they're a quack in which case they do deserve to be sued.
We could make our health care costs drop by at least 50% just by eating healthy, not smoking, not drinking to excess, and getting some regular exercise.
the thing about that is most people want to eat macdonalds, and pasta not whole wheat, can you honestly say you eat brown rice instead of white rice, etc. plus in this country it's apparently god awful to make companies not be able to put pure poison that has been shown to cause cancer because of "personal freedom". In europe, they have it to where a lot of stuff they can sell here has to be healthier there, but the result is health care costs aren't as much. I'm a free thinking moderate, to me the problem is people get into 100% ideologies, and don't want to give an inch which is one of the bad things about the 2 party system and meeting a few libertarians along the way you start thinking there's only 3 ways to think and there's not there's dozens and dozens and dozens of ways to think.
If I worked 70 hours a week (not including working holidays) I would earn somewhere around 145k a year, and I'm not in the health care industry. In fact my eduction level isn't half of what nurses are required to have.
Nurses salaries in the US are about $180-billion a year, out of the $2.3-trillion health care budget. That is about 8%. So if we cut every nurse's salary in half, we could save 4% of our total cost of health care. Although it is significant, it is hardly what I would call the "main driver" of healthcare costs.
Ever notice how many doctors offices are in luxurious suites in high-rent buildings at the medical plaza?
We could make our health care costs drop by at least 50% just by eating healthy, not smoking, not drinking to excess, and getting some regular exercise.
You and Professor Herzlinger make the assumption that improving the health of the general population will automatically reduce healthcare expenditures. Improving health may have some minimal impact but this assumes that health insurers drop their rates and providers take less reimbursement. Eliminating one cause of death simply means you die of something else. In fact, many of the diseases listed above kill people when they are fairly young. If these people live longer lives, they will likely have other illnesses and surgeries. Think two hip replacements, two knee replacements and a few cataract surgeries to start with.
As the famous economist John Maynard Keynes said, "In the long run, we are all dead."
Nurses salaries in the US are about $180-billion a year, out of the $2.3-trillion health care budget. That is about 8%. So if we cut every nurse's salary in half, we could save 4% of our total cost of health care. Although it is significant, it is hardly what I would call the "main driver" of healthcare costs.
Ever notice how many doctors offices are in luxurious suites in high-rent buildings at the medical plaza?
Thank you. Healthcare costs are a complex issue and taking any one thing and calling that the "main driver", especially nursing salaries, is plain stupid.
When I worked in a corporation (Corporate Accounting) with $5 billion in yearly sales, which shrunk from 60,000 employees to 25,000 employees, out the door went many 4-year degree Accountants, and up the ranks went the Senior Accounting Clerks, which I was, and before long I was doing the work of 2 4-year Accountants for a fraction of their wages!
In the medical field, push a number of the RN's out the door, and fill those positions with equally competent LPN's, and there's many LPN duties which could be delegated to the low-paid Nursing Assitants! Yes, I believe in one or two states, they allow CNA's to pass medications! And you don't need no nurse to give someone a suppository or enema!
There's other factors at work. Now working in a LTC/Rehab facility, Medicare allows patients to stay in these facilities for 100 days of Rehab. That's gotta go! Any number of these Rehab facilities will take on a patient for 100 days of Rehab, and they knew from the start, there's no way this person could ever be rehabbed! And then, there's those who should have been released after 30 days, but because Medicare pays for 100 days, they'll find reasons to keep them there for 100 days! IMO, that's Medicare fraud! Why oh why isn't this being monitored better?
Last edited by tijlover; 09-26-2012 at 12:48 AM..
Reason: Add lines
If I worked 70 hours a week (not including working holidays) I would earn somewhere around 145k a year, and I'm not in the health care industry. In fact my eduction level isn't half of what nurses are required to have.
Not I don't think they are overpaid.
Wow,make me feel even more depressed!
(Just kidding)
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