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think about living on a 40k income before taxes and before paying medical insurance paid with after tax dollars . that is what you can expect it's value to be to you.
i can tell you what is left wouldn't cover our rent and food in queens and we live in a rent stabilized building.
the value of 1 million is going depend on a lot of factors ,especially location.
Sure. 40k isn't going far in a expensive COL area. Right now I'm working, investments are working for me, when I retire im not delusional. I mean I don't live a high roller lifestyle but I know that I'll be selling and retiring in a lower col area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SportyandMisty
What you describe is my idea of middle class -- or as you put it, a "comfortable more normal lifestyle... enjoy a vacation and a nice dinner out... not be stressed where the house payment is coming from, etc".
That's middle class to me.
Of course, the income & asset level to achieve that middle class lifestyle varies tremendously across the nation from high cost of living to low cost of living locations. The amount of income & assets needed to have that middle class lifestyle are drammatically higher in Silicon Valley, in NYC, and in San Francisco, along with resort communities.
Invariably, politicians talk of raising taxes on "the rich" but include "the middle class" as if the latter were rich.
Sure. If I moved to a lower COL area I would be considered "rich" if I moved to NY I would be lower middle class at best ( if I tried to buy same type of house live similar lifestyle) . It's all relative.
exactly why location is going to be the big factor.
heck , if we didn't want to be a part of our kids and grand kids daily lives we could live like kings down south. but these are things we can't put a price on.
Yes, this. Many older people are technically millionaires, but they can't have the millionaire lifestyle.
That sounds like us. Our lifestyle is more like middle class. We are not spendthrifts, but we pretty much have what we need and a lot of what we want. We have no pensions, so our retirement income is Social Security, our IRAs and fleshed out by what I make trading stocks. My wife started her Social Security in Feb to give us a bit of a cash stream and I will file a restricted app for spousal benefits in Sept to add to it, while mine keeps growing.
Luckily, we only have a mortgage payment of $632 per month here and no state income taxes in FL. Our plan is to pay cash to build a new home in Tennessee and move there. The low cost of living there is a bonus as we actually really like the area, climate and the people.
So I guess we fit into that slot of feeling comfortable in our retirement lifestyle, but certainly not rich.
Invariably, politicians talk of raising taxes on "the rich" but include "the middle class" as if the latter were rich.
Exactly. Lets say someone starting out (your kid) becomes a doctor or lawyer, he marries someone who also makes good money. You think they made it big right, wrong! They may be high income but did not build wealth. They are HENRY's, "High Income, Not Rich Yet".
But because there is money to be taken politicians convince financial illiterates that HENRY's are rich. There is a big difference between high income and wealth (rich). Because income is taxed, progressive taxes with the phasing out of deductions and the ATM, government takes more of their money. By supporting higher taxes, the "tax the rich" lie, people supported making it harder for the middle class to build wealth.
It is now harder than ever to build $1 million in wealth while the truly rich get richer. It takes money to support oneself yet people put more effort into what they will wear than they do educating themselves on personal financial matters. Financial illiterates are an easy sell for politicians and they took advantage of people who don't understand basic personal finance to take more money from you.
Progressive taxes, the more you make the more they take. Unless you learn the tax code to help reduce your tax burden. The tax code consist of 73,954 pages, why so complicated? If politicians truly wanted to help the American people they would simplify the tax code and reduce taxes.
It's no damn wonder people find it hard to save. You think.. if I get that raise, life will be good but that never turns out to be true. Government takes more with progressive taxes and phasing out deductions, you also think you make more so you spend more... not smart. A simplified example:
You make $12.00 / hour. You are in the 15% tax bracket your $12.00 hourly rate is reduced to $10.80 and don't forget they still need to deduct state and local taxes further reducing your take home pay. That $12.00 becomes less and less per hour.
You get a raise and that puts your income above $36,900.00 in the 25% tax bracket. Your hourly rate above income above $36,900.00 is now $9.00/hr and that's before they take state and local taxes. And people wonder why they struggle.
As I said this is an extremely simplified example, my point being that people people should be demanding less taxes but politicians won't tell you that.
How in the hell are people supposed to build wealth when government is robbing them before they even get the money they worked to earn.
A millionaire isn't a millionaire any more. Because of decades of inflation, to live the lifestyle most people think of when they imagine "a MILLION DOLLARS!" now requires having 8-10 million of liquid assets in the bank. And of course not many ordinary people manage to achieve that. Having only a million or so sets you up for a comfortable retirement, but nothing more.
The above is spot on.
A million isn't what it used to be, but it's still more than what most people have, especially if you're not putting the value of the primary residence into the equation.
Progressive taxes, the more you make the more they take. Unless you learn the tax code to help reduce your tax burden. The tax code consist of 73,954 pages, why so complicated? If politicians truly wanted to help the American people they would simplify the tax code and reduce taxes. Look at this tax table.
As I said this is an extremely simplified example, my point being that people people should be demanding less taxes but politicians won't tell you that.
How in the hell are people supposed to build wealth when government is robbing them before they even get the money they worked to earn.
We can complain about government and politicians until the cows come home, but we (the American voters) are the ones that put them in control. In a way, we deserve what we get
We can complain about government and politicians until the cows come home, but we (the American voters) are the ones that put them in control. In a way, we deserve what we get
Except that sometimes none of the options on the ballot are good.
We can complain about government and politicians until the cows come home, but we (the American voters) are the ones that put them in control. In a way, we deserve what we get
Exactly. If people were more financially educated politicians wouldn't be able to lie to them and take advantage of them like they do. Unfortunately people will continue to allow a snake salesman to sell them a lie then wonder why they are poor or continue to struggle.
The tax code consist of 73,954 pages. The tax code should be easy enough for everyone to understand it. That won't happen though, it's like slavery, the masters didn't' want the slaves to learn how to read, it's the same thing, politicians don't want Americans to understand what they are doing. Many still do not understand the difference between high income and wealth. I'd take wealth over high income any day but politicians convince people that high income is wealth.
Except that sometimes none of the options on the ballot are good.
You've got that right. Being from Florida I know all about that as we seem to have a lot of only dismal choices.
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