Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I voted 70K-100K. I live in Chicago and even when I was making 56K I still had a hard time living a "middle class" lifestyle on that money. I was able to live comfortably, but if I had a kid and wife to support. I would have been broke. Now I am making middle class money for sure.
In his book titled Class Paul Fussell noted that financial status isn't always the determining factor in deciding the class of any particular person. Many people figure they are now "middle class" simply because they earn more dollars than they did a few years ago. Not true, middle class people often are those who own an auto dealership, or a mid size contracting business. Social standing is usually not something that is afforded to those who may think their status is being measured by the size of their wallet, more often it's going to rest upon your ability to hold your own in a conversation with educated people regardless of your wealth. Breeding and knowledge automatically trump money.
"A middle class lifestyle", here's another term meant to raise the angst of many out there who seem to be socially insecure. Sociologists have identified American socioeconomic classes as being a multi tiered construct made up of several layers not the usual three we have come to accept. Low prole, Middle prole, High prole, these are some of the terms used by Fussel in his observations of American society, he has more but it doesn't really matter, the point is that there are more than three classes in America. If an uneducated man wins the lottery he can never rise to the upper class despite the fact he has millions in the bank. A down on his luck highly educated man, well schooled in high finance, from the "right" parentage, will never be part of the socially downtrodden, someone would notice the difference and he'd likely make a comeback. That's class for ya..........
Are we differentiating between lower and upper middle-class, or just all one middle-class?
Middle-class (lower) starts around the 60-65% percentile by most measures and goes up to the 95% percentile. Which would be $55,000-$60,000 a year up to around $200k. But it's also not just about income. It's as much about education and job autonomy. For example, public interest lawyers are generally flirting at the boundary between middle-class (lower) and working-class, even with years of experience. I wouldn't consider a public interest lawyer to be middle-class simply because he doesn't hit the $55,000 mark. A lot of them come from money, are highly educated, and have the family and professional connections that they could easily double their earnings.
For those of you who voted "less than 40K a year" being middle class - have you never heard of working class!
Money is not the whole story.
Consider the following fictional character, who might well be making $40,000 per year: He teaches Classics at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill as an assistant professor. The family came over on the Mayflower or shortly thereafter. His undergrad is from the University of Pennsylvania, and his PhD is from Princeton. He knows modern Greek, Attic Greek, Latin, Italian, and French. Spends the summers in Italy on a fellowship. Uncle Simon is Ambassador to Germany. Dad is a retired surgeon, was Chief of Staff at Duke.
To me, working class, middle class, and upper class are more about the lifestyle than the $$$. If you try to put a $$ on it, you have to figure in area of the country and family size, and it gets too complicated.
Here are my classifications:
Working class live paycheck to paycheck...they probably pay some bills late or use lending services to get by, they have a lot of debt and they never save any money. In their 30s and 40s, this class dreams about getting out of debt someday.
Middle class people work normal jobs, but have some savings, some retirement funds through IRAs and 401k programs, and maybe a rental property or two, they pay their bills on time, and buy what they need when they need it, and budget for things they want, like a vacation. They have little to no non-mortgage debt. In their 30s and 40s, this class dreams about retiring early.
Upper class buy whatever they want, whenever they want it. Unless both spouses want to work, one of them probably stays home. They take extended vacations on a whim, and have more toys. They invest in larger enterprises, like real estate projects and businesses. They have investment debt (that is, debt that will make them more money than it costs). In their 30s and 40s, this class could retire today. I have no idea what they dream about.
Of course each of these are splittable into "lower, middle, and upper", but that is a matter of degree, and the overall theme holds true. For example, in middle class: If you have 2 months expenses saved up, and are putting a couple % into a 401k, and your vacations involve a roadtrip to the Grand Canyon, you are lower middle class. Whereas if you have 2 years expenses saved up, are maxing your IRA and 401k each year and own 3 rental properties, and are going to spend 2 weeks in Europe this summer, you are probably upper middle class.
I put myself firmly into the middle middle class category. However, I have no kids. If I had 2 kids, on the same income, I would definitely be lower middle class.
given the way things currently stand here in Southern California, if I would have to categorize, in my opinion it would be the follows: (all gross incomes and assuming household size is 4, i.e. 2 kids)
Key assumptions are that a middle class family should be able to afford an average home i.e. 3bd/2ba SFR 1800sqft ($600,000), good education (this means private school or living in a very selective neighborhood since most public schools in LA are among the worst in the country) and a few extras like a vacation a year.
By this definition, most people in L.A. would be poor.
I would say that to define middle class is bassed upon the ability to live the american dream.
Typical 3-4 bedroom home
2.3 children
A family pet.
One Car and one larger vehicle (truck mini van or SUV)
One family toy (boat, sand rail, quad etc.)
The ability to have emergency surplus funds ($2500 savings or credit line)
The ability to keep up on current basic luxury (one computer, a high def TV, a gamming system etc.)
If a family can meet up to these standards I would say they are middle class. Now mostly in America these goals are only atainable through common cerdit debt which requires one good salary of $75,000 or a two income household with each income in the $35-40,000 dollar range.
That is my perspective
"The Bull"
The problem with this whole "American Dream" thing is it's very generic. IMO, it's mostly a marketing job designed to keep people living at or just above the level they can actually afford so that they will be enslaved to a small elite their entire lives.
I have never wanted to own a home, boat, or kids or have a dog or cat.
The only thing I really care about (besides food, a basic car for transportation, & a roof over my head in a safe neighborhood within a reasonable commute to work) is having money in savings. I also sort of agree on the "basic luxury" thing, but not completely. I do have a high def TV and a computer. I would say computers are no longer a luxury at all, but that a basic computer is a necessity.
I would rather travel than own a house. I'd rather have a fat retirement account so that I can leave the rat race at a relatively young age than own a house, etc.
Last edited by mysticaltyger; 12-29-2012 at 01:05 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
