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One of the major problems is that most Teachers have degrees in Education rather than the subject they teach. They know HOW to teach but their knowledge of the subject goes no deeper than the textbook. By the time I got to 8th grade I was sure I knew more about History and geography than any of my teachers. This causes burn out among the students who are interested in the subject
One of the major problems is that most Teachers have degrees in Education rather than the subject they teach. They know HOW to teach but their knowledge of the subject goes no deeper than the textbook. By the time I got to 8th grade I was sure I knew more about History and geography than any of my teachers. This causes burn out among the students who are interested in the subject
(Boompa this tirade I'm about to go on isn't really directed at you. So sorry if it seems that way.)
Therein lies part of the problem.
Do you then hire an overqualified "academic"?
For how much?
Have you ever tried to break down heavy academic material to a high schooler, much less a child in grade school? It's difficult to explain something to one student let alone breaking it down so that (in some cases) you're doing it to 200 students a day.
Ever try to make an analogy to a "coo coo clock" in class, while all of the kids look at you dumbfounded and say, "What's a coo coo clock?"
Ever have to explain what the word "The" means?
A lot of teachers, especially older ones with tenure, don't have their degree in the subject they teach, but some do it well, a lot do it OK and some do it poorly.
In an ideal world, sure I'd like to see teachers teach what they want but it doesn't always work out like that, plus there would be no guarantee that the recent grad would be any better than the experienced teacher. Especially in the realm of classroom management. Techniques that have been learned over the years are invaluable and something that recent grads often do not have.
Off topic (again not directed at Boompa):
In the end teachers are still being scapegoated and it is wrong and unfair. Hence the clarification of why people think 40%+ of teachers are bad.
If you have issues with the unions then fine. But don't take it out on teachers, don't demonize teachers and don't bite the hands of people who are (and it should go without saying) just like you and I; average. Great at best and poor at worst.
One of the major problems is that most Teachers have degrees in Education rather than the subject they teach. They know HOW to teach but their knowledge of the subject goes no deeper than the textbook. By the time I got to 8th grade I was sure I knew more about History and geography than any of my teachers. This causes burn out among the students who are interested in the subject
Maybe in your state this is true but not in our state. In elementary school the teachers do have a degree in Elementary Ed but in middle an high school they have a degree in their subject area and a minor in secondary ed. You might have THOUGHT you knew it all in 8th grade, because most 8th graders aren't smart enough to know better .
I don't think they represent popular opinion. I wouldn't be worried if I thought that. I think they represent a higher segment of the population (higher SES). Just owning a computer puts you in a higher class than most. If 1 in 5 of THIS group thinks most teachers are crappy, I shudder to think what the average person thinks. It is because I realize this is not a representative group that I think this is VERY BAD. If this were a cross section of average Americans, I'd expect any malcontent to pick the worst possible answer just because they want to blame someone else. This crowd should be more enlightened than that because they should represent a higher SES.
I haven't personally found that a higher income necessarily ennobles anyone. YMMV.
Maybe in your state this is true but not in our state. In elementary school the teachers do have a degree in Elementary Ed but in middle an high school they have a degree in their subject area and a minor in secondary ed. You might have THOUGHT you knew it all in 8th grade, because most 8th graders aren't smart enough to know better .
I agree with this ^ and perhaps your information Boompa is just old information. The subject certification has only been more common over the last dozen years. In Pennsylvania, all secondary teachers must be subject certified and from what I understand, that's going to be true for even younger grades.
I haven't personally found that a higher income necessarily ennobles anyone. YMMV.
Opinions should be more enlightened as we can discount sheer ignorance. Not that there aren't ignorant people in higher SES's but there is a weeding affect. You should have less of the "I'm mad at the world" types who will pick the worst possible answer in a poll like this just because they can.
I am taken back by the percentage choosing greater than 45%. It would be truely sad if 50% of teachers are crappy. If I thought that, I'd homeschool. While I'm not qualified to teach all subjects, I can do, at least, as well as a crappy teacher in any subject. Fortunately, I've only met a few crappy teachers in my day. The vast majority were adequate. I can only hope that those choosing the high percentage simply think anyone who isn't fantastic is crappy.
I agree with this ^ and perhaps your information Boompa is just old information. The subject certification has only been more common over the last dozen years. In Pennsylvania, all secondary teachers must be subject certified and from what I understand, that's going to be true for even younger grades.
It has ALWAYS been that way here. In the younger grades we still require an elementary ed degree but good luck getting a job without concentrations in specialized area--basically a minor--in math, reading, special ed, etc.
I had fourth that I would call crappy. In 7th grade, our algebra teacher was just woefully unqualified. The lady could not do more than basic 4th grade arithmetic. I mean, she didn't even know how to graph or read a graph. If you gave her a graph of y=2x, she couldn't tell you what the function was kind of not know how to graph.
Also in 7th grade my core teacher was just a vindictive ***** and control freak. Along with several other students, I was in 0 period band at the high school which meant I came about 10 minutes late. This was fine with the principal as the first ten minutes was spent listening to announcements. Unhappy with the idea that her rigid discipline regiment approach to education was being subverted, she took to giving the day's assignment during announcements. There were two of us coming from band at the HS and we'd get there and have no idea what was going on, of course. After standing in front of the class and reciting the pledge (because that was very important and we weren't to miss it on account of being late) we were to sit quietly, eyes forward, and do nothing for the next forty minutes. This was very strictly enforced. She spent most of her time hovering over the two of us to ensure we did not look at our neighbors (punishment, both sent to the principles for cheating and "allowing others to cheat") to see what we were supposed to be doing or communicate with them in any way. For awhile, I had a friend who would just jot down notes and give them to me. Passing notes was, of course, forbidden and we were both sent to the principles when she caught on. Three of us ended up transferring to the other core class.
In 8th grade I transferred to a gate/self-study school and took geometry and physical science at the high school. Once again, totally incompetent math teacher. Her particular method of teaching was to regurgitate the first few pages of the text and then direct students to answer any questions in front of the class. Answer the question "correctly" (meaning you sounded confident and either got the answer right or the answer wasn't in the teacher's edition) and you got five points, answer the question "wrong" and you lost five. That might have sort of worked except we used the CPM method which instead of presenting proofs like a traditional math text does it relies on the "let the learner, guided by their caring and supportive teachers, discover the principles of math for themselves." I went bought a used geometry book at the JC and taught myself. Most of the rest of the class failed.
The last crappy teacher I had was in 9th grade. She just sat around and flirted with the PE teacher and played cards with the students. Grading was based on the "how much do I like them" standard, brown nosing, bribery (she stuffed her face with Cheetos all day), and playing cards with her during class were good ways to get on her good side. Being quite and not asking anything got you a B. I was sick for two weeks and she just never graded any of the makeup work. Eventually, she gave me a B but only because I ran track and you couldn't have an F and participate in sports.
Honorable mention would be my 12th grade calculus teacher. He was actually a good teacher (one of the best I've had, in truth), but a lousy human being. He had this thing about saying we were young-adults and should be treated accordingly and teaching the class like a college class, and then he'd turn around at behave like a spoiled brat. Homework did not count towards your grades and he assigned a mountain load of it telling us to "do what we needed to to understand the concepts." That, of course, literally meant do it all or I will hate you even though for most of you that's completely unnecessary. One guy in particular basically did nothing and learned the material through lectures and when other students with less aptitude asked questions about the homework. Things went down hill from there... good life lesson though. Adults do not shoot straight, the more preachy they are about honesty/integrity/accountability the more hypocritical they generally are.
I didn't have any crappy professors during college. Some were perhaps disinterested or operated on such a different wave length they were unintelligible, but really the only way a teacher can be crappy is the combination of incompetence combined with complete apathy.
(Boompa this tirade I'm about to go on isn't really directed at you. So sorry if it seems that way.)
Therein lies part of the problem.
Do you then hire an overqualified "academic"?
For how much?
Have you ever tried to break down heavy academic material to a high schooler, much less a child in grade school? It's difficult to explain something to one student let alone breaking it down so that (in some cases) you're doing it to 200 students a day.
Ever try to make an analogy to a "coo coo clock" in class, while all of the kids look at you dumbfounded and say, "What's a coo coo clock?"
Ever have to explain what the word "The" means?
A lot of teachers, especially older ones with tenure, don't have their degree in the subject they teach, but some do it well, a lot do it OK and some do it poorly.
In an ideal world, sure I'd like to see teachers teach what they want but it doesn't always work out like that, plus there would be no guarantee that the recent grad would be any better than the experienced teacher. Especially in the realm of classroom management. Techniques that have been learned over the years are invaluable and something that recent grads often do not have.
Off topic (again not directed at Boompa):
In the end teachers are still being scapegoated and it is wrong and unfair. Hence the clarification of why people think 40%+ of teachers are bad.
If you have issues with the unions then fine. But don't take it out on teachers, don't demonize teachers and don't bite the hands of people who are (and it should go without saying) just like you and I; average. Great at best and poor at worst.
Well, if you're explaining the word "the" to a high school class... that's pretty self-evident of what the problem is. There's way too much emphasis on the school not teaching and not nearly enough on the students not learning. Half my 9th grade class was functionally illiterate. That's basically an impossible class to teach. Those kids needed to be in a remedial class, but segregating on ability might offend some. So you take a class that's half functional illiterates with the rest ranging from 4th to 12th grade reading levels and waste everyone's time.
I think there were more "crappy" teachers back in the day when you could get away with that sort of thing.
For example, I had a high school "life management" teacher who did NOTHING all year except give us word searches. This woman could have done so much more - like teach us how to balance a checkbook.
Then there my high school chemistry teacher who showed the video "Animal House" during class!
As far as my prior co-workers when I taught elementary here in Florida, I was fortunate to work with some really great teachers. Some were less than stellar, but many were top notch. (and yes, I did observe these teachers teaching) Many of the less qualified were "run out" of our school, but landed at other district schools due to tenure I guess. Also, if the Principal didn't like you, she moved you to a different grade (as in you taught K for 20 years and next year were told you were teaching 5th AND you were being moved into a portable classroom way out in the boondocks)
My husband taught at other schools and here are some BAD teachers from his experience (yes, he co-taught with them so he saw them in action):
1. The teacher who locked her own kids in the car in the school parking lot for 45 minutes before school started. In the winter... in the dark... the kids were an infant and a 2 year old.
2. The teacher who leaves her class UNATTENDED for long periods of time (like 10-15 minutes!) while she goes across the school to make copies, or sells fundraisers out front of the school
3. The teacher who locks kids in a makeshift 'jail' that she created by pushing two study desks together
4. This past year, the teacher who refused to teach the state curriculum (standards), & rushed through 2 math lessons per day so she could spend time cutting out snowflakes and other projects (5th grade)
What burns me up is she was re-hired for next year, but my husband was not. He had the highest test scores on his grade level team of 8 teachers AND 4 kids were moved INTO his class after parents complained about other teachers!
So good teachers who go the extra mile, have great judgement, get along well with parents and students, and show strong student learning gains get let go while totally incompetent teachers are retained because they laugh and joke around a lot. (meanwhile the school's overall grade slipped this year from A to B, and that teacher had very low test scores!)
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