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Old 09-20-2017, 10:29 PM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
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Going to the school tomorrow is fine, but I would suggest starting with the teacher and asking what happened. You do only have your daughter's account of this, and as others including a veteran teacher have said, it's possible your daughter had something to do with this situation.
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Old 09-21-2017, 12:20 AM
 
10,225 posts, read 7,587,698 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by compSciGuy View Post
My daughter just got detention today and a "0" because some other girl was trying to copy off her. The teacher accused my daughter of intentional trying to help her. The thing is, my daughter doesn't even know the name of the girl, etc. My daughter is just starting middle school and is taking math at the next grade level (she's probably the youngest person taking 7th-grade math out of ~350-400 students). She's small, and will obviously stick out. Anybody have any suggestions on what to do? Obviously, the age factor, etc. will potentially be problematic in the future.
Judge Judy would tell you...learn the facts. You can't necessarily believe your daughter's version. Judge Judy says there is a way to tell if kids are lying: their lips are moving.

Everything you know about this you were told, since you weren't there. If your daughter is the type to fess up when she cheats or lies, then she is likely being truthful when she says she didn't cheat on the test. But keep an open mind for the tiny possibility that she did. She's new at the school, maybe wanted to be liked...I mean, if she doesn't know the girl, how would the girl know that your daughter's answers would be right or better than her own?

I'd speak to the teacher to find out why your daughter was included in the punishment, why they thought she had helped in cheating. Then talk it out. See if what the teacher says makes sense. If it doesn't, then reiterate that your daughter had done nothing wrong, had diligently studied for the test, etc., and see if she'll at least give up with giving her zero on the test. Let her take another test or something.

But I'd keep an open mind about why the teacher included your daughter. That does seem odd, so I'm wondering what the reason was.
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Old 09-21-2017, 06:48 AM
 
13,284 posts, read 8,458,170 times
Reputation: 31512
Even a teacher can assume things.
As a parent it was wise to listen and be a sounding board. Glad your child entrusted you!
The teacher should not have rushed it... a look at the final test answers would have given some indication if cheating was involved. But that's just me as a lay person who doesn't jump so quickly without seeing how it comes together or falls apart.

Tbh most principals will side with the teachers...it shows a United effort. Good for the teachers 'morale',not so good for the student who may well have been innocent. Hard to overcome labeling by a teacher...

Take the step to discuss it with the principal. Let the principal deal with the teacher...so you can be a source of support for your child.
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Old 09-21-2017, 06:49 AM
 
Location: My beloved Bluegrass
20,126 posts, read 16,163,816 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
You're making the same assumption those teachers did -- that the kid being copied from is guilty of helping the cheaters. That's like saying that the driver being tailgated is guilty of letting another driver tailgate them. I have no problem with punishing the guilty, but have big problems with punishing both guilty and innocent just to send a message.
Did you miss the part where I said in an earlier post "if I saw..."? You can tell. No, they don't come right out and hand them their test to the other kid but they adjust their paper, do eye exchanges, lick their lips a lot, and my favorite, they look guilty or just uncomfortable - and you can tell it isn't ordinary test stress. The students sharing their answers generally don't actually like doing it, for a variety of reasons, and their body reacts as such.
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Old 09-21-2017, 07:13 AM
 
16,825 posts, read 17,736,880 times
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Only time I have ever seen any teacher accuse someone of assisting cheating was when it was obvious. One kid leans way back and angles paper more directly at the cheater, drops their pencils and takes a solid minute on the ground to recover it leaving the test slid to the side of the cheater, etc.

As for those who base their opinions off their own experiences in the 60s,70s, or whatever. You have no idea how litigious education has become. The vast majority of teachers won't even accuse someone of cheating without it being egregious and indisputable.
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Old 09-21-2017, 07:28 AM
 
12,848 posts, read 9,060,155 times
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If it is more litigious now, it might be good to ask why. As someone who was falsely accused and punished for "letting X cheat off my paper" while kids I knew cheated everyday got away with it, I have very little trust in the ability of teachers to detect cheating.
A favorite tactic of Miss I (2nd grade) was if a boy scored higher than the girls in the class was to punish the boys because "they must have cheated."

There is a reason why so many parents today believe their kids over the teacher and that is because we experienced it ourselves as kids and vowed not to let it happen to ours.
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Old 09-21-2017, 07:34 AM
 
Location: South Carolina
14,784 posts, read 24,090,712 times
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I think you should start with the teacher fist and ask why she assumed that your daughter was helping someone cheat ? and if you don't like her answers then go to the principal and state you have a problem with your childs teacher and go from there . I used to hate when teachers just assume something like cheating is going on and accusing the wrong child of cheating . If the principal does not want to be co -operative then I would suggest finding my child another teacher because this one obviously thinks your child helps people cheat and she does not need that hanging over her head and she will not do well with this teacher . I had such a situation and the principal made the teacher apologize to my child and when my child went back to her class she had it out for him and I had to get involved and removed him from this school completely and put him in catholic school and never had another problem with his schooling .
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Old 09-21-2017, 07:49 AM
 
6,129 posts, read 6,812,053 times
Reputation: 10821
Take a deep breath. Remember.. this is the 6th grade. Her transcript doesn't matter. The stakes are not as high as it would be if this was 10th grade (or even 7th... magnet high schools tend to look at 7th and 8th grade transcripts, not 6th).

Then go talk to the teacher. Your daughter may be guilty.

In a good middle school 6th grade is when they start trying to teach these lessons to kids while the stakes are relatively low, as someone else said upthread. Not because teachers are mean. The whole zero thing may be coming from that mindset. Just hear what the teacher has to say.
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Old 09-21-2017, 07:52 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,297 posts, read 120,779,853 times
Reputation: 35920
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nov3 View Post
Even a teacher can assume things.
As a parent it was wise to listen and be a sounding board. Glad your child entrusted you!
The teacher should not have rushed it... a look at the final test answers would have given some indication if cheating was involved. But that's just me as a lay person who doesn't jump so quickly without seeing how it comes together or falls apart.

Tbh most principals will side with the teachers...it shows a United effort. Good for the teachers 'morale',not so good for the student who may well have been innocent. Hard to overcome labeling by a teacher...

Take the step to discuss it with the principal. Let the principal deal with the teacher...so you can be a source of support for your child.
How do you know the teacher rushed in? How do you know she didn't look at the final test answers? Going over the teacher's head to the principal is a bad idea. The OP should talk to the teacher first. And yeah, the principal's inclination is going to be to support the teacher. Would you like to work for someone who did differently?
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Old 09-21-2017, 08:32 AM
 
1,644 posts, read 1,664,677 times
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Before you go to the school, please make absolutely sure that she is as innocent as you think she is.
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