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Old 09-29-2018, 07:26 AM
 
Location: Concord NC
1,863 posts, read 1,657,194 times
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If the test wasn't taken, there was nothing to grade; why should that non-participation "zero" be dropped?
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Old 09-29-2018, 10:02 AM
 
Location: State of Transition
102,235 posts, read 108,093,971 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Statz2k10 View Post
Update:
She is going to allow him to use that test as the one he drops. Apparently she was not aware who he actually was until she did some research. I think she assumed he was somebody else that hardly comes to class.

But he actually said that he's heard rumors that students get to drop the last test in her class & not show at all if there average is good enough for them. Now if that's something that she has to approve or what IDK.
Thanks for the update, OP. This makes sense, especially in view of the fact that he was ill, and emailed her to that effect, in advance of the test. Glad it worked out.
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Old 09-29-2018, 10:25 AM
 
Location: Pacific Northwest
438 posts, read 377,658 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhuff80 View Post
I don't get what the debate is here?

The syllabus states the "lowest test grade will be dropped." Whether the person showed or not is irrelevant. The Prof should have worded her syllabus better. Claiming otherwise by the Prof is disingenuous.
In my experience a syllabus isn't law. The syllabus is simply an outline of the course and the expectations of the professor. They can change or modify the syllabus at any time as they see fit. Not all do, but I've had several professors change tests dates and modify rules as the year goes on. And I've definitely had some who will have similar clauses about tests in their syllabus who seem to "back out" because they forgot they had it written in and simply reuse the syllabus from other classes without making the appropriate changes.

In the end they get to make the rules and as long as the school agrees or backs up the professor (which in most cases is whats going to happen) you really can't argue, just work within the rules set before you.

Is it annoying? Sure....but that's real life and you gotta roll with it. College is already stressful, making it more so by arguing with a professor your going to have to spend an entire semester with at the beginning of the year is a little silly. Treat every class as important as the next, study hard, and go to ALL your classes and tests. If its too hard, talk to your adviser and look at taking a easier load next semester. But don't overuse your emotions on syllabus changes, they happen all the time and your goal should be mastering ALL your classes not arguing on how to boost your grade from not doing as much work.
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Old 09-29-2018, 01:01 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,917 posts, read 24,424,171 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rhuff80 View Post
I don't get what the debate is here?

The syllabus states the "lowest test grade will be dropped." Whether the person showed or not is irrelevant. The Prof should have worded her syllabus better. Claiming otherwise by the Prof is disingenuous.
That's one viewpoint of the situation.
It's not the only way to look at it.
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Old 09-29-2018, 01:02 PM
 
Location: Sun City West, Arizona
50,917 posts, read 24,424,171 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RP2C View Post
If the test wasn't taken, there was nothing to grade; why should that non-participation "zero" be dropped?
Exactly, when I was teaching, I allowed students to make up all work, up until the final week of the semester. I didn't put in a zero for work not completed until final grading. Therefore, for 8 weeks there was no grade in the book.
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Old 09-29-2018, 01:33 PM
 
Location: on the wind
23,356 posts, read 18,956,502 times
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I once missed a practical lab final for a vet medicine course who's professor was notorious for never allowing anything to be made up. If you missed the test you failed it. Not a zero, an F. Of course the students in this particular course had no experience with this prof so had to take his word for his rigid policy. He certainly wouldn't want it whispered around that he was actually a bit of a softie.

I worked at a local wildlife conservation area part time during that term and as fate would have it, spent the morning of the exam searching for a swan that had been illegally shot by a hunter. Showed up an hour late for the exam in a panic....covered in mud head to toe, sopping wet, with the poor bird's blood all over my jacket. I found the prof in his office, told the story (it was pretty good), and waited for whatever mercy he might give. He looked me up and down and commented that he couldn't believe I would actually ruin my clothes deliberately just to get out of an exam. Also that it was a great story and he didn't think I was clever enough to make all of it up.

He gave me permission to take the exam with another group of students, but threatened to flunk me entirely if I ever breathed a word of it.
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Old 10-01-2018, 10:57 AM
 
6,985 posts, read 7,059,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tnff View Post
"While I respect your class it is not a class that has any bearing on my career. It’s a class I chose to take because I have to fulfil graduation requirements. I am taking 2 other classes that are directly related to my major & require me to spend more hours than I have to study & prepare for those tests. I never planned to take your class for granted but I can only put a certain amount of time into studying when you take into consideration the other two classes. I work 40 hours a week & as I explained above commute a total of 1 hour to/from class. I mention this not as an excuse but I remember you saying how you hated taking a certain class in your college days because it had nothing to do with what you planned to do."

You really said that in your email to the professor? When you're in a hole, stop digging.
I agree. Whether rightly or wrongly, professors are going to consider their class to be the most important thing in your life, whether you agree or not. They don't really care about what else is going on in your life, no matter how important it is.
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Old 10-04-2018, 12:05 AM
 
Location: Scottsdale
2,074 posts, read 1,648,427 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Statz2k10 View Post
My friend has a situation that I told him to go up the ladder on because of the teacher not willing to work with him.

Background. In the syllabus the teacher says that the "lowest test grade will be dropped". Nothing else just that in terms of tests/grades.

Fast forward to last week. He was struggling with the material and did not feel comfortable about going into the test. Studied for it but it's material that he'll never need to know again because of the type of class it is. Meaning, the material not going to be the building blocks of something else he has to take. But he needs the class to graduate.

The day of the test he over slept & woke up sick. He was going to still go into take the test but honestly he said the hell with it when he had to sit on the toilet 3 times in a 15 minute time span. You all get the picture I'm sure. The reason he decided not to was because of the reason above but also he knew that he this test would likely be the one that gets dropped & what's the point of taking a test and getting a 60 vs a 0 if both can be dropped?

Well,
He finds out the teacher is now saying you have to be present for a test you want to drop. So now he's got a ZERO that will factor into a class that is already difficult for him. Not because he's stupid but because he's taking classes that actually go towards his major and this is simply a requirement class.

He's worried that he could go all semester and still fail because he's only able to put so much time into this class. He's got some pretty tough classes that actually are the beginning of much difficult classes.

I told him if the teacher is not going to let him drop that lowest test grade he should go above her & show the syllabus stating "lowest test grade will be dropped". I know it sounds like a court room by specifically interpreting what is read but if she failed to put that in the literature I think he might have some room to argue.

Thoughts?
When I was an undergraduate there was a perfectionism that was not healthy in situations like this.
The best thing is just to have the friend calm down and analyze the options.

(1) See if the course can be saved. It really sounds like your friend had a medical situation the day of the test and was not physically ready for the test. This is something that can be used for an appeal.
(2) If the 0 stands, can extra credit be made in some other way to give the hopes of at least a passing grade or maybe even a B?
(3) If (1) and (2) fail then can the course be changed to "Pass/Fail" or audited?
(4) If there is just no way to save the course beyond repair, then just drop it and take it later. Or perhaps there is an online alternative in the "winter" session locally at a community college. A lot of students do that to graduate on time.

The "perfectionism" I recall was not healthy. It's best not to make a big deal out of it and blow it out of proportion in anger, bitterness, or disappointment. I would recommend the friend just exercise, mellow out, use the extra time to relax. But make sure the other courses are ok.

I was in turmoil as an undergraduate from burnout and really bad advising. I had a chip on my shoulder for years from my late teens to early 20s. But I eventually matured and mellowed out by my mid 20s. Years later, I studied the Vietnam War and saw many cases of friendly fire. Missing an exam is not as bad as accidentally calling artillery or air strikes on your own men and killing many. Your friend just needs to put it in perspective. I studied Agent Orange in graduate school.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1r7YHR1Yscc

In 1967 a US Marine Pilot accidentally dropped two 500 lb bombs on the perimeter of the 173rd Airborne of the US Army. It killed many men including the battalion chaplain.
Dak To - The Significance of Hills in the Vietnam War

This soldier who survived the battle described the turmoil and lost his arm.
John L. Steer's Story
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Old 10-04-2018, 10:18 AM
 
6,985 posts, read 7,059,428 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by grad_student200 View Post
When I was an undergraduate there was a perfectionism that was not healthy in situations like this.
The best thing is just to have the friend calm down and analyze the options.

(1) See if the course can be saved. It really sounds like your friend had a medical situation the day of the test and was not physically ready for the test. This is something that can be used for an appeal.
(2) If the 0 stands, can extra credit be made in some other way to give the hopes of at least a passing grade or maybe even a B?
(3) If (1) and (2) fail then can the course be changed to "Pass/Fail" or audited?
(4) If there is just no way to save the course beyond repair, then just drop it and take it later. Or perhaps there is an online alternative in the "winter" session locally at a community college. A lot of students do that to graduate on time.

The "perfectionism" I recall was not healthy. It's best not to make a big deal out of it and blow it out of proportion in anger, bitterness, or disappointment. I would recommend the friend just exercise, mellow out, use the extra time to relax. But make sure the other courses are ok.
It seems that the OP's situation has been resolved, but you listed a bunch of good compromise solutions that can help others in this situation.


In any case, it seems that there were 2 issues: the OP getting sick the day of the exam, and the OP misunderstanding the professor's policy. It depends on the professor's policy as to which issue to focus on.


Many people will be sympathetic toward people when they are sick. But, if the professor has the "the world doesn't stop because you are sick" attitude, then focusing on being sick may not work.


On the other hand, many people will try to give the benefit of the doubt in the case of a legitimate misunderstanding. But, if the professor has the "ignorance of the law is no excuse for not following it" attitude, then arguing about the misunderstanding may not work.


For what it's worth, any teacher or professor I ever had who dropped the lowest grade would always drop a 0 for a test you did not take or an assignment that you did not do. In fact, I feel that their primary reason for having the drop the lowest grade policy was to avoid giving makeup exams or assignments, while not punishing a student who was sick or had a legitimate reason not to take the exam or do the assignment.
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