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Fair question. I would give him about 10% credit (or blame).
So after 3 and half years of economic policy he gets 10% of the responsibility . So you are saying the president has no control on economic policy but president Bush who has been out of office for 3 and half years gets 90% of the responsibility. So after 3 years Obama economic policy has had 10% effect on the economy so his policies would have to me incompetent of ineffective to have so Little responsibility
I don't want to say it but I just don't think Mitt is going to win. I will go vote and do my part but I just have a bad feeling about it.
That being said, should the GOP look at a reboot? Most informed people who get their news from anywhere but the daily show equate the GOP with fiscal sanity ideologically but lately we are consistently being equated with fringle politics. Should we moderate on the social issues to get what we want (and what is best for America) on the economic policies? By that I mean move moderate on gay marriage, abortion, and interventionist foreign policy while holding a hard line on decreasing the regulatory burden, making the corporate and marginal income tax rates lower and flatter, and rolling back environmental regulations that put people out of work.
I was politically apathetic for a long time but I've always had a very significant interest in economics. It wasn't until I began to listen to how utterly incorrect the democrats economic proposals were that I decided to follow politics more closely. I am always floored at how little Obama seems to understand about finance and macroeconomics in general. I feel like we could get more people to follow the GOP if we just moderated on the moot issues like gay marriage. These social/domestic policies aren't a net benefit for us...they just alienate would-be voters.
So...do we reboot or hold onto the religious right stuff?
How can you say with a straight face that the GOP is the "face of fiscal sanity?" The GOP pushed through the unfunded provisions of the Medicare Modernization ACt (Part D and risk adjustment for Med Advantage) and two unfunded wars in Iraq and Afghan with no increase in income taxes to fund them. That is a huge reason why our national debt now increases by $1 trillion annually. Repubs used to be the party of fiscal sanity, but you haven't been that since the 1970s. Repubs catered to every whim of the southern dixiecrats for years to win the elections. Now that your party has to actually compete, you want to abandon all of what they hold dear to their hearts?
equate the GOP with fiscal sanity ideologically but lately we are consistently being equated with fringle politics.
The GOP has moved to the right with talk radio rhetoric and no longer stands for 'fiscal sanity'. Their solution is just more trickle down and YoYo (you are on your own) economics. Ronald Reagan would be too moderate for today's GOP. If 47% pay no taxes it's largely due to Reagan and Bush polices to help the poor and working classes. Paying down debt and reducing deficits isn't just a conservative ideology - Clinton got the deficits down. But yes, the GOP could do better if they went back to their roots, before the hijack, and let real conservatives like David Frum back on the bus.
Quote:
So Obama has no responsibilty for the current economy , there is the problem of finger pointing and scapegoating
So after 3 and half years of economic policy he gets 10% of the responsibility . So you are saying the president has no control on economic policy but president Bush who has been out of office for 3 and half years gets 90% of the responsibility. So after 3 years Obama economic policy has had 10% effect on the economy so his policies would have to me incompetent of ineffective to have so Little responsibility
No, I did not blame it all on Bush. But the GOP congress has been abysmal. They have opposed every logical step forward. And I am not really sure which president is to be blamed for the outright criminality that ruled Wall Street and led to all this, or the outsourcing of jobs that slowed the recovery,etc.,etc.,etc. Obama has acted with good sense and in line with most top tier economists. This economy is just a very big problem, and the GOP does not want to do anything to help. But let's debate this on another thread.
Republicans need to do some soul searching and first they need to admit they have a problem. If you look at the democratic party it looks like America (black, white, hispanic, Asian, gay, straight, rich, poor, christian, ect). The republican party is not attracting minorities and Latinos are the fastest growing minority group. By 2040, there will be more minorities in the United States than white people and Latinos are moving heavily into red states like Texas and North Carolina. The explosive Latino growth in North Carolina along with the influx of New York transplants is a reason NC is transitioning into a purple state, The GOP is in big trouble.
Another problem with the GOP is that it is a split party. You have the extremist Tea Party right, the traditional Reagan economics conservatives and lastly the evangelical republicans who care about social issues like gay marriage and abortion. This is why Romney's strategy changes from week to week and a big reason he isn't connecting with the average voter. The GOP needs to figure out which direction its going and unite. They need an inspirational leader and they need to figure out what Ronald Reagan did to attract so many democratic voters in 1980 and 1984. Almost every blue state went red those two election cycles and Reagan almost had a clean sweep of all 50 states in 1984. Only Minnesota and Washington, DC went blue that year. There needs to be a positive message. Blaming the president of the opposite party in power won't work.
Republicans also need to side with the American voters. For example, poll after poll shows the VAST majority of Americans believe wealthy people should pay more in taxes. (which means a lot of republicans agree with Obama on this.)
No, I did not blame it all on Bush. But the GOP congress has been abysmal. They have opposed every logical step forward. And I am not really sure which president is to be blamed for the outright criminality that ruled Wall Street and led to all this, or the outsourcing of jobs that slowed the recovery,etc.,etc.,etc. Obama has acted with good sense and in line with most top tier economists. This economy is just a very big problem, and the GOP does not want to do anything to help. But let's debate this on another thread.
There has been a GOP budget pass the house every year the obstructionist is harry Reid who will not even offer a budget. And with the Dem's in control of the house form 2007-2010 do they share any responsibility. So Obama has had 10% effect on the economy after 3 and half years, tells me he is incompetent or ineffective
I say keep doing what you guys have been doing, Don't change a thing well maybe show just how extreme you guys can really go, just incase there are some undecided voters that you guys missed
Maybe, introduce a platform plank in '16 calling for restoration of witch-burning?
How can you say with a straight face that the GOP is the "face of fiscal sanity?" The GOP pushed through the unfunded provisions of the Medicare Modernization ACt (Part D and risk adjustment for Med Advantage) and two unfunded wars in Iraq and Afghan with no increase in income taxes to fund them. That is a huge reason why our national debt now increases by $1 trillion annually. Repubs used to be the party of fiscal sanity, but you haven't been that since the 1970s. Repubs catered to every whim of the southern dixiecrats for years to win the elections. Now that your party has to actually compete, you want to abandon all of what they hold dear to their hearts?
I won't deny that Bush ran up the debt. He made terrible mistakes with the war and Medicare expansion. However, the GOP's fiscal policy is decidely pro-business and pro-private sector growth. The Democrats just aren't. On top of that I find the rhetoric espoused by Democrats that George Bush is the culprit for Obama's inability to manage his way out of this economy to be nauseating. Especially when the sub prime mortgage crisis was largely concoted by democratic housing policies fueled by easy lending at the hands of Fannie, Freddie, and the FHA. Do you know that as many as 20 million mortgages were alt-a the peak of the bubble? Is this Bush's fault as well? Why not go to Bush's predecessor to lay blame a bit.
The GOP espouses a lower regulatory burden and a tax structure that benefits all. Lower flatter taxes hurt no one except those who stand to benefit from redistribution. What is fundamentally wrong with a flat tax? 20% of my income is 20% of yours and so forth. I'm not wealthy by any stretch of the imagination but it doesn't seem fair to me that someone who IS should have to pay more. They already likely pay more by virtue of the fact that 20% of 200k is more than 20% of 100k. On top of that those with an AGI of 112k or above already should 70 cents on every dollar. How is that fair?
Last edited by wnewberry22; 09-24-2012 at 02:55 PM..
Sitting back, grabbing the popcorn, ready for the ensuing posts!
PS - Yes, I agree. Completely alienate all the social conservatives while continuing to delude yourselves that, after 2008, the public hears "GOP" and instantly thinks "fiscal sanity". Really. I'm begging you. Please do that!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wnewberry22
I don't want to say it but I just don't think Mitt is going to win. I will go vote and do my part but I just have a bad feeling about it.
That being said, should the GOP look at a reboot? Most informed people who get their news from anywhere but the daily show equate the GOP with fiscal sanity ideologically but lately we are consistently being equated with fringle politics. Should we moderate on the social issues to get what we want (and what is best for America) on the economic policies? By that I mean move moderate on gay marriage, abortion, and interventionist foreign policy while holding a hard line on decreasing the regulatory burden, making the corporate and marginal income tax rates lower and flatter, and rolling back environmental regulations that put people out of work.
I was politically apathetic for a long time but I've always had a very significant interest in economics. It wasn't until I began to listen to how utterly incorrect the democrats economic proposals were that I decided to follow politics more closely. I am always floored at how little Obama seems to understand about finance and macroeconomics in general. I feel like we could get more people to follow the GOP if we just moderated on the moot issues like gay marriage. These social/domestic policies aren't a net benefit for us...they just alienate would-be voters.
So...do we reboot or hold onto the religious right stuff?
We conservatives can say that we're not conservative enough, but the important thing is that we must rally around each other now. We have to rally behind the candidate we have. I think Romney has picked a great running mate that is going to be a rising star in the GOP. We must rally around our fellow conservatives today. ... Now. ... If we don't, then we will be letting Darth Barry and his band of demons destroy our country by taking away all of our rights, including, quite possibly, our rights to vote. Forget about social issues now; too many people are out of work, and too many have given up. We can't blow this. We must beat Obama in November or we're toast. I can't stress enough how big-time crucial this election is.
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