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Old 06-28-2019, 08:55 AM
 
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Bidens debate performance last night was pretty terrible. Not just that he seemed off his game, but he actively dug his hole deeper on the segregation issue. It's still early and obviously one bad debate doesn't kill a campaign. But will pragmatists who worry the party is going too far left look for a plan B?
His campaign is built around the idea that he isn't the most exciting candidate in the race, but he is a competent liberal pragmatist who can win and govern effectively. Klobachar, Buttigieg and Booker all seem potentially positioned to pick up some of that "pragmatic voter" support.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:03 AM
 
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I think 40 years of co-called pragmatism has been pretty terrible for the typical worker in America and I think most would agree with me on that.

The radicals like JFK, FDR and LBJ actually accomplished something for workers even though they were vilified as crazy socialists.

Pragmatism means amassing huge amounts of campaign cash from the most powerful economic interests in the country and serve them once in office. Thats why they are lauded in the mainstream media as being great "fund raisers" and "viable candidates". They have passed the "wealth primary" and can concentrate on the PR strategy going forward.

The working man and woman deserves better than that. Real democracy where the elected officials actually serve the interests of the ordinary people is always a threat to any system of power, but this is what we should aim for. So-called third way centrism that seeks to balance the interests of a tiny elite with the needs of the people is not a good long term strategy for the health of the nation.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:06 AM
 
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Nope and progressives have a better chance at winning if they address healthcare. If they just stick to the healthcare topic they'll have a good chance, sadly watching the debates they're veering off on other topics people don't care about, certainly, nobody who hates Trump on the right care about, nor many independent voters.

Healthcare is the only topic both Dems and some Republicans care about. If they were smart, they'd stick to it, but it seems they're not. They'll lose bigly with the gun control and the immigration issue. They should just stick to affordable healthcare because EVERYONE needs that and Donny hasn't fixed it yet. If he does, he'll be the best ever so they better hurry.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:31 AM
 
10,513 posts, read 5,171,947 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpdivola View Post
Bidens debate performance last night was pretty terrible.....
His campaign is built around the idea that he isn't the most exciting candidate in the race, but he is a competent liberal pragmatist who can win and govern effectively. Klobachar, Buttigieg and Booker all seem potentially positioned to pick up some of that "pragmatic voter" support.

Harris is adept at finding the balance point between the progressives and the centrists. She's been criticized before by progressives for not being progressive enough. If she's nominated she'll nudge herself more towards the center and will sound more pragmatic. She is politically agile, adept, and as we just saw, she is a killer debater. I've seen it in California, don't underestimate her ability to win elections.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:46 AM
 
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Gabbard

Moulton

Biden

Delaney

Hickenlooper

Bennett

Ryan

Klobouchar

Bullock
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:47 AM
 
Location: Morrison, CO
34,240 posts, read 18,599,254 times
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Maybe Gabbard. MAYBE.
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Old 06-28-2019, 09:58 AM
 
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Gabbard has serious Middle Eastern baggage. Do a little probing. She presents well and is bright and articulate, no question, but I am concerned about her ultimate loyalties to this nation.

Harris looks good - presentable, articulate, bright, well-informed, passionate about her plan, but needs to move towards the moderate middle.

Warren isn't bad at all, but has a weak voice which doesn't help her make her points. Working to address that - strengthening her (physical) voice without becoming shrill or strident (looking straight at you, Bernie) would open many more ears to her message.

Biden: shelf life rapidly expiring, from what we saw last night, and that saddens me. I had hoped he would be a healer for one four-year term. Don't see that after last night.

Buttigieg: bright, articulate, quick-witted - but most are not ready for him in the White House.

Booker: see above.

Gillibrand: Gotta quit interrupting all the time! Irritating and detracted from considering her message.

Yang: let the poor man speak.

Others: not yet ready for prime time. Some getting there faster than others. Others unlikely to ever arrive. Many potential Cabinet members, if we can find an intelligent, likeable, articulate healer to nominate and elect.
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Old 06-28-2019, 10:08 AM
 
12,003 posts, read 11,907,446 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tokinouta View Post
Nope and progressives have a better chance at winning if they address healthcare. If they just stick to the healthcare topic they'll have a good chance, sadly watching the debates they're veering off on other topics people don't care about, certainly, nobody who hates Trump on the right care about, nor many independent voters.

Healthcare is the only topic both Dems and some Republicans care about. If they were smart, they'd stick to it, but it seems they're not. They'll lose bigly with the gun control and the immigration issue. They should just stick to affordable healthcare because EVERYONE needs that and Donny hasn't fixed it yet. If he does, he'll be the best ever so they better hurry.
Good point - and those who think illegals should be refused health care need to look at infectious disease and community health concerns. Even rabies has been reported among the kids in custody at Clint, TX, with little flap or fanfare or seeming concern about it. Can't even tell if the child or children with rabies are hospitalized or just quarantined.

Many Latin American kids are immunized as a matter of course, but that doesn't help lice, typhus, late-season flu - or rabies.

God help us all if we can't take care of those kids and their families, for our own selfish sakes if not theirs.
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Old 06-28-2019, 10:13 AM
 
2,824 posts, read 2,290,358 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elliott_CA View Post
Harris is adept at finding the balance point between the progressives and the centrists. She's been criticized before by progressives for not being progressive enough. If she's nominated she'll nudge herself more towards the center and will sound more pragmatic. She is politically agile, adept, and as we just saw, she is a killer debater. I've seen it in California, don't underestimate her ability to win elections.
Harris showed last night she is a real political talent with both charisma and policy knowledge. She may ultimately be the bridge between centrists and progressives, but so far she has been mostly in the Warren/Sanders lane on policy. It will be interesting to see if she tries to differentiate herself a little from them going forward.
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Old 06-28-2019, 10:23 AM
 
14,221 posts, read 6,969,746 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpdivola View Post
Harris showed last night she is a real political talent with both charisma and policy knowledge. She may ultimately be the bridge between centrists and progressives, but so far she has been mostly in the Warren/Sanders lane on policy. It will be interesting to see if she tries to differentiate herself a little from them going forward.
Her issue is that the overwhelming majority of the Democratic electorate support a federal $15 minimum wage, a ban on for-profit prisons, much higher taxes on the rich, tuition free college, much higher social security benefits and support for the disabled, breaking up the big banks, 3 weeks paid vacation, paid overtime and sick leave for all workers and public funding of elections. Her track record shows she is not in that camp and her big donors will fight tooth and nail to prevent those policies from being enacted.
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