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Old 04-06-2021, 06:59 AM
 
Location: Florida
1,904 posts, read 1,044,143 times
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Hi Friends,

Florida Resident...Re; Coco-plum Hedges

I bought about 8 Coco-plums, 7 gallon plants and recently planted 4. The remaining 4 are still in pots...

I dug up the Florida Sand, and replaced it with Gardening Soil and Potting Soil.

I'm not sure what's going on..but half of them look like they are dying (brown leaves).


I try to keep the soil moist without over-watering...but it looks like i'm failing.


What am i doing wrong?


(pics coming)
Attached Thumbnails
What am i doing wrong...Cocoplums died???-1p.jpg   What am i doing wrong...Cocoplums died???-1p2.jpg   What am i doing wrong...Cocoplums died???-1p3.jpg   What am i doing wrong...Cocoplums died???-1p4.jpg   What am i doing wrong...Cocoplums died???-1p5.jpg  


Last edited by Balkins; 04-06-2021 at 07:21 AM..
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Old 04-06-2021, 11:07 AM
 
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Looks like transplant shock to me. Do you know if they were grown in a shade house? If you bought from a nursery (MUCH smarter in Florida) you can call them or go there and ask questions. If you bought from a big box store, you might be able to return them, but good luck on getting sound advice. Master Gardeners may be of some help.

The fence looks like it could be reflecting sun, and that is a south or southwest exposure, a setup that effectively cooks many plants. You also want to be concerned about nematodes in the soil.
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Old 04-06-2021, 11:29 AM
 
Location: Florida
1,904 posts, read 1,044,143 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harry chickpea View Post
Looks like transplant shock to me. Do you know if they were grown in a shade house? If you bought from a nursery (MUCH smarter in Florida) you can call them or go there and ask questions. If you bought from a big box store, you might be able to return them, but good luck on getting sound advice. Master Gardeners may be of some help.

The fence looks like it could be reflecting sun, and that is a south or southwest exposure, a setup that effectively cooks many plants. You also want to be concerned about nematodes in the soil.

NOT sure where they were grown (i did purchase them from Nursery).


IF you research COCOPLUM HEDGES, you find they thrive in hot Florida Sun and are a great hedge.


I'll check into NEMATODES


THANKS
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Old 04-06-2021, 12:28 PM
 
23,590 posts, read 70,367,145 times
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Mine was orange jasmine. Nice, but it got declared invasive. Reflective surfaces can be a problem unless there is partial shade or an exposure to the north or east. FWIW, I had good luck with hibiscus in a similar sunny spot.
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Old 04-06-2021, 03:27 PM
 
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Cocoplums are a FL native plant, enhancing the soil is not needed. Dig a hole no deeper than the depth of the root ball and twice the width. I like to fill the hole with water, twice and have the water soak in before planting, especially during dry season like now. New trees and shrubs need to be watered daily for a week, every other day for two weeks and then every third day until you get reliable rains. For me in SWFL, that is late June. They will need to be watered during any dry periods for the first year. Once they are established, they take care of themselves.

I have planted > 25 native trees/shrubs (and several non-natives) in the past 9 years, including coco plum, following the above advice from the native nurseries. All are thriving.

My coco plum is in full sun all day with no problem. Your photos show severely dehydrated plants, they needed to be watered daily in the pots like they are at the nurseries and on the schedule above when planted. This time of year you cannot overwater in FL.

Mulch should be kept away from the trunks to prevent fungal problems and while the top of the root ball should ideally be planted even with the hole, too high is better than too low.

This pic was taken for the sunshine mimosa (pink in the pic), but you can see my three year-old cocoplum in the background.

Last edited by jean_ji; 04-06-2021 at 03:58 PM..
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Old 04-06-2021, 05:10 PM
 
Location: Canada
14,735 posts, read 15,016,027 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balkins View Post
Hi Friends,

Florida Resident...Re; Coco-plum Hedges

I bought about 8 Coco-plums, 7 gallon plants and recently planted 4. The remaining 4 are still in pots...

I dug up the Florida Sand, and replaced it with Gardening Soil and Potting Soil.

I'm not sure what's going on..but half of them look like they are dying (brown leaves).


I try to keep the soil moist without over-watering...but it looks like i'm failing.


What am i doing wrong?


(pics coming)
I agree with jean_ji's diagnosis of dehydration and suggested watering schedule.

OP, if you can please answer these questions I might be able to tell you how to save some of them:

- It's important to establish exactly when did you buy the plants - as in exactly how long have you had them.

- After you brought them home how many days did they all sit outside in the pots before you planted the first 4 plants in the ground?

- Exactly how long have the first 4 transplanted ones been in the ground now?

- Regarding the roots, what did the roots look like when you took the 4 transplanted plants out of the pots?

- What colour were the roots?

- Were there long roots wrapped in a circle around the bottom inside of the pots?

- Were the roots flexible and bendable or were they stiff or brittle?

- Did you spread all the roots out when you put the 4 plants into the holes in the ground?

- After you put the plants in the holes did you fill the holes with water and then let them drain a bit before back-filling the holes with soil and then watering again?


It isn't just half of them that are stricken. All 8 of those plants look like they are totally dehydrated and dying (a couple look already dead now) from heat shock and dehydration to the roots, including the ones that are still in the pots - so you know those 4 still in the pots do not have transplant shock because they haven't been transplanted yet.

I think what has happened is the pots all got left sitting outside in direct sun for too many days (or was it weeks?) after you brought them home and the roots all got baked and dehydrated from getting too hot. And you didn't keep the soil in the pots wet and cool enough every day. When they're sitting outside in direct sun in medium-small pots like that the roots need to be saturated at least once a day every day until you can get them into the ground. In your climate conditions they should be put into the ground immediately after bringing them home, or at least the next day after bringing them home.

It doesn't really matter how well some heat tolerant evergreen plants growing above the surface can tolerate direct sun and high heat - that does not mean the roots can tolerate the heat from direct sun above ground. The roots are supposed to be in the ground where they are covered up, kept evenly moist, cool, insulated and protected from the heat above ground. Those plant pots shown offer no protection - they are just heat attracting containers and they do not hold moisture in the soil and root balls.

.
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Old 04-06-2021, 07:17 PM
 
Location: Florida
1,904 posts, read 1,044,143 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
I agree with jean_ji's diagnosis of dehydration and suggested watering schedule.

OP, if you can please answer these questions I might be able to tell you how to save some of them:

- It's important to establish exactly when did you buy the plants - as in exactly how long have you had them.

- After you brought them home how many days did they all sit outside in the pots before you planted the first 4 plants in the ground?

- Exactly how long have the first 4 transplanted ones been in the ground now?

- Regarding the roots, what did the roots look like when you took the 4 transplanted plants out of the pots?

- What colour were the roots?

Hi,

I purchased the plants about 3 weeks ago.

I left them in their pots for about 10-12 days before i planted them.

I only planted 4, the other 4 are still in pots,

The roots looked light color beige to light brown.

The roots were wrapped in a circular pattern inside the pots

Roots were flexible

NO i did not spread the roots out when i took them out of the Pots.

YES, after putting the plants in the holes, I filled the holes with Water before moving dirt/soil into holes.
____________________________________________




THANKS VERY MUCH...Read what you wrote!







.
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Old 04-06-2021, 11:29 PM
 
Location: Canada
14,735 posts, read 15,016,027 times
Reputation: 34866
Quote:
Originally Posted by Balkins View Post
Hi,

I purchased the plants about 3 weeks ago.

I left them in their pots for about 10-12 days before i planted them.

I only planted 4, the other 4 are still in pots,

The roots looked light color beige to light brown.

The roots were wrapped in a circular pattern inside the pots

Roots were flexible

NO i did not spread the roots out when i took them out of the Pots.

YES, after putting the plants in the holes, I filled the holes with Water before moving dirt/soil into holes.

.
Okay. In examining the photos I see 5 planted in the ground and 3 still in the pots. The bark on the stems still looks alive and not cracked or shriveled up yet (except at the tips) so hopefully they will recover but you won't know for sure for a few more weeks.

So before you do anything else, immediately dig the new holes for the remaining 3 in pots so the holes are ready and waiting to receive the root balls. The sizes of the holes should be to the specifications that Jean_ji indicated above. You need to get those last 3 plants into the ground as quickly as possible. With these plants, because they have all become so badly dehydrated it's the roots that need to be babied the most now and given some special treatment while being transplanted.

So next remove the plants from the pots. The soil in the root balls has baked and gone bad so you need to get rid of some of the dirt around the outsides of the root balls and from around the outer roots. Bang and shake the root balls of each one to knock off some of the dirt from around the outsides of the roots.

Next dig your fingers as deep as you can get them into the dirt of each root ball and wiggle your fingers vigorously and tug a little bit to loosen up the dirt a bit around the roots. Do that all the way around on the sides and on the bottom of each one and then shake and bang them a bit more to knock off some more dirt.

Next very gently tug and separate as many as possible of the visible roots away from each other, paying special attention to loosening and separating the roots that have grown together in circles around the bottom of the ball. Be very careful not to break those bottom ones off. When you have the majority of the circled roots loosened as much as you can, when they're stretched out you will see that those ones will be longer and thicker than the roots that are higher up on the sides.

Gently use your fingers to scrape a bit more soil away from each root ball and then spread out all the loosened roots so the ends of them are sticking straight out horizontally into the air. Now they are as ready as you can get them to put them into their holes.

Next, doing one hole and one plant at a time fill each hole up with water about 2/3rds of the way up and before it gets a chance to all drain away immediately plunk the root ball directly into the middle of that water filled hole. The root ball will raise the water level and you must quickly but gently swish and pump the root ball up and down, up and down 3 or 4 times so the water will wash away a bit more of the loosened dirt around the roots and settle at the bottom of the hole. That will help to free up the roots a bit more and allow the roots to spread out more so they aren't as compacted so tightly as they were when they came out of the pots.

Next - while holding the plant steady with one hand, start partially filling the hole with fresh soil all the way around the sides then one more time while adding some more water gently pump the root ball up and down only 2 or 3 times again. That will cause the fresh soil you just added to wash INTO the bottom of the root ball and fill in the empty spaces between the spread out roots that you loosened at the bottom of the ball.

Now still holding it steady in place add some more fresh soil and some more water so the soil sinks through the water to surround the root ball but do not pump the plant up and down again. Repeat adding bits of more soil and more water alternately around the sides until you can feel some resistance and the root ball is firmly settling and being gripped by the fresh muddy soil, standing upright on its own and the soil has gone a bit mushy. Finish topping off the soil around the sides up to the top of the ball and a bit on the top, gently pat it all down in place then slowly, slowly dribble some more water all around and over the top to settle the soil. Add a wee bit more fresh dry soil and pat it all down again. And you are done.

Now don't add any more water to the 3 new transplants until the next day because the soil is presently saturated and mushy. If it is still mushy the next day then don't give them any water then either. It would be helpful if you were to pick up a moisture meter at the nursery so you can check the moisture levels of the soil for each plant each day, but once they have all new leaves on them again you will likely have to add more water to all the plants every day according to the schedule that Jean_ji mentioned above. Definitely the ones that were previously planted in the ground need to be kept quite moist as well if they are going to revive.

It would be helpful if you could add some plant electrolytes to the water because they have become so dehydrated.

It's best if you don't remove the dead leaves on the branches, let them all fall off on their own so the stems and branches will seal off naturally.

Now if the roots and branches are still alive you will have to wait and watch to see if the surface of the bark on all the stems greens up a little bit, and if it does then in another 2 or 3 weeks after that you should start seeing tiny little bumps forming on the surface of the bark and at the tips of the branches. If you see little bumps forming then those are where new leaves will start growing. Check them daily.

If the leafless plants don't start producing new leaf buds on the stems by the time another 6 to 8 weeks goes by then the plants are dead, but I hope that won't be the case. Good luck, I hope your new watering routine will revive all of your plants.

.
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Old 04-07-2021, 05:38 AM
 
Location: Florida
1,904 posts, read 1,044,143 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoisite View Post
Okay. In examining the photos I see 5 planted in the ground and 3 still in the pots. The bark on the stems still looks alive and not cracked or shriveled up yet (except at the tips) so hopefully they will recover but you won't know for sure for a few more weeks.

So before you do anything else, immediately dig the new holes for the remaining 3 in pots so the holes are ready and waiting to receive the root balls. The sizes of the holes should be to the specifications that Jean_ji indicated above. You need to get those last 3 plants into the ground as quickly as possible. With these plants, because they have all become so badly dehydrated it's the roots that need to be babied the most now and given some special treatment while being transplanted.

So next remove the plants from the pots. The soil in the root balls has baked and gone bad so you need to get rid of some of the dirt around the outsides of the root balls and from around the outer roots. Bang and shake the root balls of each one to knock off some of the dirt from around the outsides of the roots.

Next dig your fingers as deep as you can get them into the dirt of each root ball and wiggle your fingers vigorously and tug a little bit to loosen up the dirt a bit around the roots. Do that all the way around on the sides and on the bottom of each one and then shake and bang them a bit more to knock off some more dirt.

WOW...fantastic work.
Thanks for the help!
(Newby to Gardening)


PS. What should i do to the Existing plants in the ground....should i dig them up and do something similar?



~B

Last edited by Balkins; 04-07-2021 at 05:49 AM..
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Old 04-07-2021, 12:57 PM
 
Location: Canada
14,735 posts, read 15,016,027 times
Reputation: 34866
Quote:
Originally Posted by Balkins View Post
WOW...fantastic work.
Thanks for the help!
(Newby to Gardening)


PS. What should i do to the Existing plants in the ground....should i dig them up and do something similar?



~B
You're welcome.

Well .... you could dig them up and do that with them if you want to put yourself to all the extra work but I'm inclined to say no, do NOT dig them up because they've already been in the ground for awhile and to take them up now might do far more harm than good to the roots since the entire plants are in severe shock.

You have unknowingly already done something good for them in this regard anyway when you planted them. You said earlier "I dug up the Florida Sand, and replaced it with Gardening Soil and Potting Soil." I know you were advised that it wasn't necessary to use the gardening and potting soil for transplanting cocoplums, which under normal circumstances for healthy cocoplums that would be true.

But these are not normal circumstances now and in this particular instance it was a good thing that you did use gardening/potting soil because the cocoplums were already stricken, dehydrated and sickening before you transplanted them. That soil you put in there with them will help them in this exception, it will have helped provide them with some of the nutrients and a minimal amount of the electrolytes they needed. So if you still have more of that garden/potting soil then you should use it to transplant the remaining 3 potted plants too. They need all the help they can get.

But I would strongly recommend that you give them more water than you've been giving all of them, and most importantly go to your nursery or any other garden supply places and get some properly prepared electrolytes for plants that you can feed to all of those plants in their water. That will do more good than anything else to help them overcome the extreme shock that they are in now.

I'm recommending this American brand of electrolytes for plants - I believe it's manufactured in Colorado but it should be found available in Florida and other states - https://ecands.bio/pg/mineral-electrolyte.html - and you should read all the information that's posted on that website. If you can't find it at a nursery/plant supply place then ask them if they can order it in, or ask what they have that can be used as a substitute. Also, do a bit of research about electrolyte formulas for plants, so it you can't find a formula available at your location then try to make your own formula. Electrolytes are good to use for all plants and other living things that are in shock or are growing under stressful conditions. Just, if you make your own do NOT put any salt in it because that's no good for plants and there is already too much salt in all Florida soil anyway.

Here is an emergency suggestion if you can't acquire properly prepared plant electrolytes at your location and can't make your own - real COCONUT WATER that is found inside coconuts has loads of electrolytes in it. One cup of coconut water added to one gallon of tap water. You can't use the bottled coconut water that's manufactured as a beverage because that stuff for human consumption has preservatives in it, but if you use real, unadulterated coconut water straight from the coconut that will help. Once a week until you see the plants have revived and are growing new foliage.

One other emergency suggestion is a mixture of unadulterated lemon juice and sugar water (like sugar water that is made at home for hummingbird feeders). Twice a month. No more than that because sugar water also attracts insects.

.
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