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I am from the south, I think that many elderly white southerners (and, unfortunately some younger folks) were indoctrinated with the "one drop" rule--if you have one drop of black blood then you are black. Seems to apply to American Indian as well, with some.
There was a recent story on NPR about a group of folks in West Va. who had black ancestors a very long time ago; even though their skin and features were "white," they and the community considered them "black" and treated them differently. They even treated themselves differently.
I also have worked with archives, libraries, and historians and I have seen that it is very common for white southerners to have mixed ancestry way back--many families have been in the US for a long time and lived in areas where blacks, Indians, and whites were together. For example, Obama may be related to slave ancestors through his white mothers side of the family, which comes from the same general area part of my family does.
I plan to get a DNA test at some point in my life--I would love for my Dad to get one, but I know he would be enraged (or give himself a stroke) if his test came back any other way than 100% European. And, honestly, I am 99% certain that it will come back mixed--so would never encourage him to get one or tell him if I did. He even jokes about the fact that in his extended family he knew in the 1930's--one side was "darker" than the other--but he thinks he is on the "right" side, lol.
Your Dad sounds much more liberal, but he may have a lot of attitudes or beliefs that his parents or grandparents passed on to him. He may consider it a scandal or know that other older relatives would. Or maybe he wants to be an aristocratic southerner turned liberal, instead of a common southerner? I've met plenty of those folks, lol. Maybe you triggered some bad memories from his past...I have no idea, but it is up to you to pursue it or not.
I think it is helpful to understand the past; not understanding does not necessarily mean you repeat it but it can leave you delusional or living in a fantasy world. In this case, not understanding that one may be of "mixed" heritage and not even wanting to know at all does indicate a closed mind-set that definitely can lead to repetition of mistakes and denigrating others.
Last edited by bonnielisabeth; 03-06-2013 at 11:23 AM..
Reason: to add
I think you shouldn't judge your father. You have no idea where he's coming from. For example - perhaps he half-remembers some slights or derogatory remarks from playmates in childhood or something similar which from that time forth made him feel ashamed his background. I still remember a negative comment by one playmate, a slight from the mother of another playmate and the father of third playmate I faced as a 5-year-old simply because my father was an immigrant. I was lucky I was too young to really understand, although my playmate's comment did upset me for a day or so.
Respect your father's wish not to discuss his family background and continue to enjoy your hobby.
Excellent post and brought back some memories for me that I had thought were buried.....and I always try and put my fathers animoisity and reluctance to discuss the rumor in his line of "Indian blood", somewhere in the that line, into his time and place....he was born in 1900 and was very much into the stories told by his much, much older relatives. Interesting.
sounds like your father just doesnt want to know. its like finding out you were adopted when you where 75. whats the point? is he racist or prejudice - maybe... most racist and prejudice people are unaware of their deep rooted beliefs until put in certain situations or around certain people...
plus in the grand scheme of things there are many american whites (not recent immigrants) with small percents of black blood and most blacks americans who descended from slaves (not recent immigrants) have at least 1/8 white blood. both blacks and whites know this fact but in white black society its not acknowledge. only recently within the last decade or so has many people began to embrace the mixed category. before it was strictly black or white and your father prefers the purity notion of the later. just let him be...
I think it's likely that a lot of blacks in the Americas have some white ancestry, for the unfortunately obvious reasons. It's far less likely that whites have black ancestry, since if any white woman gave birth to a baby with negroid features, they'd probably both have "died in childbirth".
But what about white men (owners) and black women (slaves)? Some of those babies fathered by slave owners possibly passed as white and went on to marry white and have kids, grandkids, and great-grandkids that looked white with blond hair and blue eyes.
Perhaps he is embarrassed to think he has black ancestors because he assumes they were products of the evils of slavery (white guy rapes his black slave girl---> half black/half white kids result and they marry people like them and so on and eventually the "black" is "diluted" to the point that their progeny end up "white" looking).
I am Black and according to some of the older relatives on both my mother's and father's side their are members of the family who chose to "pass", move to cities in the North and disappear into the White world. It happened all of the time. They married White partners and raised White families.
Yep. That happened a lot, and it's still happening. Many blacks passed as white, married white, had children/grandchildren who looked white and didn't know that their relative was actually black, hence they, themselves, would have black/african ancestry. But they probably think it's Italian or Indian ancestry instead of what it actually is.......which is black/african.
But what about white men (owners) and black women (slaves)? Some of those babies fathered by slave owners possibly passed as white and went on to marry white and have kids, grandkids, and great-grandkids that looked white with blond hair and blue eyes.
A child born to a slave woman was a slave as well, even if the father was white and free. It's true some could possible pass for white but until they were freed or escaped from slavery, they could not live their lives as white or marry a free white person.
But yes, there are plenty of examples of free blacks - both during and post-slavery years, who could and did pass for white. Belle da Costa Greene was a good example - she claimed her darker skin was from a Portuguese heritage and used the name da Costa to support this claim: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belle_da_Costa_Greene
A child born to a slave woman was a slave as well, even if the father was white and free. It's true some could possible pass for white but until they were freed or escaped from slavery, they could not live their lives as white or marry a free white person.
But yes, there are plenty of examples of free blacks - both during and post-slavery years, who could and did pass for white. Belle da Costa Greene was a good example - she claimed her darker skin was from a Portuguese heritage and used the name da Costa to support this claim: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belle_da_Costa_Greene
I have learned that the older members of the family often just don't want to know.
I discovered that my grandparents were third cousins. My grandmother hit the roof because she "didn't want to be related to those people" and I was no longer allowed to talk to her about genealogy. My grandfather was good enough to marry, but she thought his family was a lower class than hers.
Last year I joined a genealogy site and began doing some research about my family ancestry. I didn't really have any preconceived notions about my "stock" so I kept an open mind. ...During my research I ran across an article that posited evidence that a large percentage of white southerners have traces of black and native American ancestry. I innocently asked my father if he thought there might be any black ancestry on his side of the family. His s**t hit the fan. He said absolutely not and I shouldn't assume that or tell people anything of the sort. I showed him the article and the genetic evidence and he just got angrier. We finally just dropped the subject. A few weeks later I mentioned that you can buy a DNA kit that tests your ethnic and racial makeup. He said I shouldn't buy it, because he'd prefer not to know if his side of the family has any black ancestry- so he clearly doesn't completely refute the idea.
Basically the whole experience uncovered some prejudices that my dad holds and has made me question his values. My dad is a self professed liberal, loves Barack Obama and has always taught me not to discriminate, so his anger doesn't line up. ...So do you guys think my father is being overly prejudiced and elitist?
Well, the main thing I detect is his disdain for the idea of any connection to Africa. As a black person, this appears racist by his negative recation no matter how many Obamas, especially black ones, he may claim to love. Being uninformed about people of a certain race with preconceived notions about them may not always be negative.
But if that same lack of enlightenment convolutes into bad imressions or unkind behavior, then I define it as racist.
But then many times, non ethnic people are so out of touch with we darker people, that they have no knowlege or sometimes no interest in what may be offensive to us. In a one dimensional environment, we concern ourselves only with issues that relate to people within that environment who resemble ourselves most. This is how white America has operated for many centuries. All 'others' were/are irrelevant.
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