Which of these cities is better for me? (condo, high crime)
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I’ve made many posts about relos because I have a hard time narrowing down. I keep jumping between places and I’d like to get down to a couple as I hope to do a quick tour sometime this spring on whatever ends up as #1 and see if it’s my vibe.
Ideals for a new place to live:
- Lively with more “trendy” things popular with millennials and gen Z (I’m millennial/gen Z cusp)
- Booming economically with big name employers and good advancement. My industry is mostly centered on blue collar work (I’m a white collar professional in blue collar industries) so anything from logistics to manufacturing to healthcare to labs is ideal. I’m hoping to move to manufacturing as they tend to have higher pay in what I do. I’m in logistics currently.
- I’m very left-leaning, and would like to live somewhere with more like-minded people. I don’t necessarily need a hive mind, but I don’t want everything I’m voting for falling through or being blocked by city council illegally like here in Phoenix. Some places like Texas are off due to the abortion laws as an example. However some states like Pennsylvania are unappealing due to alcohol and gun control laws. To me the best state politically is Vermont but Vermont doesn’t fit for other reasons. (Vermont had been described as “hippies with guns” and that’s a good surface level description of my alignment. A dem socialist against gun control)
- I want cooler weather that doesn’t enter the “frigid” territory too much. Minnesota shares a climate with Siberia, so that’s not something I want, but I also don’t want Florida either. I want four seasons but if anything, more summer and less winter. But still a winter. Ideally never going above 90 in humid or dry climates, and never going negative or close to 0.
- More rain. I think deserts are beautiful, but I like rain. I also prefer wet summers and dry winters, like what Florida has, versus Seattle where this is reversed. Though rain that’s even all year round is even better.
- Close (ish) to mountains would be superb. Day trip worthy. It would be even better if it was next to the mountains. While it would be nice to also be a day trip to the beach, I’d rather have the mountains.
- Relatively affordable. I understand I’m probably asking for a bigger city, but it doesn’t need to be NYC costs either.
- The bigger the city the better. I don’t like small towns.
- A good airport to get around the country with, ideally with more direct options
Ideas:
Nashville, TN
Pros - Currently a major hub of my company (is there lots of blue collar work in Nashville?), popular amongst people my age, lively city with lots of potential and what seems like good weather, I’m a fan of folk music so it’s a nice place to be as well as other genres.
Cons - Political alignment of Tennessee, Nashville seems pretty pricey, distance to mountains,
Atlanta, GA
Pros - Major city with lots of amenities, popular amongst people my age, lots of work in my industry, closer to family in Florida, ATL airport etc.
Cons - Weather looks warmer than what I’d like, mountain access, high crime in areas where things are more affordable (more than other cities it seems)
Raleigh, NC
Pros- Made a lot of news regarding development and economy, weather seems great, city seems like it has a lot of like-minded people, nice airport
Cons - I’ve heard this metro is very sleepy for 20 somethings, and I’m unsure if the city is too small for my likings, affordability is questionable
Charlotte, NC
Pros - Also a popular city these days, weather seems great, looks affordable for what you’re getting
Cons - Seems to lack work in my industry, I question like Raleigh if it’s sleepy for someone in my age group and has some of the amenities I’d like.
Washington, DC
Pros - Close to family in Baltimore, good public transit, another hub for my employer, always a reliable city with lots to offer, lots of trendy things and interesting amenities
Cons - Affordability, DC summers seem abnormally hot for where it is, DC felt “corporate” to me with people who were too rigid, distance to mountains is questionable, not sure if it’s a good city for my industry
Albuquerque, NM
Pros - Best weather in the western US, more blue leaning, amazing mountains and outdoor recreation, close to family in Phoenix
Cons - Economically poor, higher crime in affordable areas, less rain than what I’d like, doesn’t seem to have a lot of the more interesting amenities I’m looking for in a city
Seattle, WA
Pros - Beautiful massively growing city with lots of opportunities, more like-minded people, popular with people my age and has lots of amenities to show for that, mountain and water access is unmatched, major hub of my company
Cons - Affordability, Seattle winters are a concern, not necessarily popular with blue collar industries like it once was, maybe too much rain in one season and it’s also “cold rain” not “warm rain”
Denver, CO
Pros - A booming city, lots of like-minded people with “trendy” amenities, superb mountain access, Denver airport
Cons - Affordability, work in my industry is questionable, ideally more rain, worried it is “overhyped” for what ot says online
What do you think, or any other ideas? Thanks I’m advance!
Reading down your list of criteria, Seattle hit everything nearly perfectly, with the only caveat that it's expensive and the weather that you're looking for isn't quite a match. Portland is a more affordable alternative to Seattle, but the economy isn't nearly as good and it also feels quite a bit smaller, though it does feel bigger than some of the cities you listed.
Your weather preferences will be hard to find in the US. What you're looking for is a tropical monsoon climate, which is mostly found at lower latitudes in the tropics. Miami has this type of climate, but no other city in the US does.
Denver seems like your next best fit. It's very sunny but otherwise, it's pretty in line with what you're looking for.
My first thought is Berkeley CA, which would seem tick tick off all your boxes, for weather, politicial leanings, outdoor life, access to tech jobs, and plenty of young people and entertainment options. Plus easy mass transit to San Francisco. As to afforability, how much space are you looking for? Just a quick Google earch shows several apparently solid studio and one-bedrooms there and in the bordering N. Oakland area in the 1500-2000 range. Aside from price considerations, the only downside might be the gun thing. I'd assume that laws are strict in Cali. But I'd also assume that more people there have (legal) firearms than folks think.
I live in Atlanta. You listed "Mountain access" as a con? Mountains are only like 45 minutes from the north metro area.
It's large, has great 4 season weather, awesome airport, and huge logistics industry. We are now a purple state, and like you may have guessed, how right or left it is depends on city vs. suburb living.
Reading down your list of criteria, Seattle hit everything nearly perfectly, with the only caveat that it's expensive and the weather that you're looking for isn't quite a match. Portland is a more affordable alternative to Seattle, but the economy isn't nearly as good and it also feels quite a bit smaller, though it does feel bigger than some of the cities you listed.
Your weather preferences will be hard to find in the US. What you're looking for is a tropical monsoon climate, which is mostly found at lower latitudes in the tropics. Miami has this type of climate, but no other city in the US does.
Denver seems like your next best fit. It's very sunny but otherwise, it's pretty in line with what you're looking for.
I really question the affordability of Seattle. Can I have a good and comfortable life there. I’m unsure if I’m constantly worried about money and needing roommates. I want to not have roommates anymore.
As far as weather goes, it’s called a “subtropical highland” climate which exists in the higher elevations of the Appalachians and some parts of Hawaii. However 60s and sunny and humid is not what I want all year round, hence why I asked for four seasons.
Seattle always intrigued me because it resembles more of my favorite natural environments in the world (Alaska, Glacier Park, fjords of Norway, Alps) but as I’ve matured over time it’s less about beauty and what the place can provide me. Seattle is not only the furthest possible place I’d consider from my family, it also has questionable winter weather and bad gun control laws, some of the worst in the country (#48 out of 50).
Quote:
Originally Posted by citylove101
My first thought is Berkeley CA, which would seem tick tick off all your boxes, for weather, politicial leanings, outdoor life, access to tech jobs, and plenty of young people and entertainment options. Plus easy mass transit to San Francisco. As to afforability, how much space are you looking for? Just a quick Google earch shows several apparently solid studio and one-bedrooms there and in the bordering N. Oakland area in the 1500-2000 range. Aside from price considerations, the only downside might be the gun thing. I'd assume that laws are strict in Cali. But I'd also assume that more people there have (legal) firearms than folks think.
I’m not in tech, I’m in manufacturing and logistics. In fact my employment has basically an inverse relationship with tech jobs in terms of locations. Like Tesla, who is based in California but manufactures in Nevada, as an example. It’s inverse because tech has detrimentally increased COL where they are located, pushing anyone who doesn’t make a software developer salary (like myself) out for a comfortable life. The Bay Area is proof of this. The city is beautiful though, and the only parts of California I would honestly consider would be the IE or Sac, but both resemble Phoenix in a lot of ways and I’m not happy with how California handles certain rules and regulations. So as a whole I’ve sort of crossed off California like I have with Texas, albeit for different reasons.
I have two AR-15s I’m not gonna give up because of family reasons. I personally don’t use them a lot but I am strongly against the government banning them outright. To me there’s a better way to deal with the mass shooting crisis. I’m not going to get into it because it’s not the politics channel but I’m not interested in California. I appreciate the suggestion!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Citykid3785
I live in Atlanta. You listed "Mountain access" as a con? Mountains are only like 45 minutes from the north metro area.
It's large, has great 4 season weather, awesome airport, and huge logistics industry. We are now a purple state, and like you may have guessed, how right or left it is depends on city vs. suburb living.
Is Georgia’s purpleness reliable now that Trump is out of the picture? Or will it revert to red again?
Arizona is another state that flipped purple but I’m unsure if Georgia has a similar picture. Arizona has been purple for many years, but has severe voter disenfranchisement and disengagement (49 out of 50), resulting in what I’d like to politely refer to as conservative loons getting into elected positions here. I was always tired of people voting for things twice over and then getting ran over by city council and their lobbyists. I don’t want to be in another place where politicians are so bought that they disregard their constituents like Sinema who lied to me and got my vote. Is Georgia better about this? I really hope so because Arizona is corrupt and I don’t want anyone to have corrupt politicians.
I was unaware how close Atlanta was, I’ll definitely move that up my list. Though are winters and falls good in Atlanta or is there little color change, etc.
City wise Denver has sports and bars and the best airport in the nation for domestic options (once they actually finish remodeling it), but has QOL issues with being dirty and smelly, lots of homeless, concrete jungle feeling, expensive... I never could click with city of Denver for a place to buy a house / condo, for what you could afford, it was always grungy and really lacked greenery. You can get the same energy / nightlife Denver has in most big cities. Politically it should align right up your alley though.
Weather wise it might not be the best fit. It is wetter - marginally - than Phoenix, but Denver is the plains, it's not the foothills which are a little more moist. It gets both hot and cold, it'll bust 100F 10 or so days a year. Winter isn't brutal, but it is LONG, longer than your summer is. Snow season is Oct - May in Denver, with snow in the mountains all the way to sometime in the month of June. Your car will probably get hail damage at some point if its not garaged.
Your weekend options for outdoor rec are phenomenal, but weekday options are limited. All the good stuff 35 -60 minutes away, the immediate area around city of Denver is not sexy. You'd have to love being in the mountains and above treeline and into fitness, dogs, or beer for this to be the one I think.
Atlanta has pretty good outdoor access, part of that sprawl is lots and lots of greenspace within the metro, and it's a hilly metro with cool stuff littered throughout. There's lots of weekday and weekend options. The mountains are indeed real mountains within a 2 hr drive, you just don't get out of the trees often. It feels like a jungle here, especially when you get up in the mountains where it rains more. I don't make it up there super often because I like the scenery in the piedmont - the city parks are really good and not that crowded.
Atlanta has better weather - it's one of the better cities in the US weatherwise due to the sheer amount of hours of temps in the 70s and year round consistent rain as long as you don't have allergies or problems with humidity. There was frost on my bike ride in this morning and I did see it snow once in Jan last year lol, but springs and falls are golden while summers are not bad. It'll get into the 90s, but doesn't often go over 100F even with the feels like temp. Tree shade makes a world of difference vs the sun exposure out in AZ. There's still a lot of 70s temps throughout the summer though. Charlotte and Raleigh and Nashville should be roughly similar. I'd prefer more snow and to be a further north, but it doesn't bother me.
Falls are pretty good here. They last a long time, and you don't get the changes all at once, the reds and purples and variety of colors are what make them.
Citywise it's pricey for decent stuff downtown, probably about the same as Denver or Nashville, it's getting expensive here quick. Part of that is a reflection of the booming economy. But the city is bigger and fuller, like I could handle not having a car in ATL where Denver would feel small. It's cleaner where it's new but grungier where it's old (same for Nashville btw).
That being said, it's fractured. ATL is the metro of 100 towns. You'll get pulled into one of the other 6-9 downtowns for events. Crime is most certainly an issue, and that's at the heart of a lot of that fracturing. In the burbs you're fine and it's more affordable and comfy, but I don't know if you want to be out there with the age and political scene. It's a solid option given your criteria.
Logistics is huge here as it's the centerpoint between east coast, gulf, and interior with a bazillion railroads and semis passing through
You're not going to find a heck of a lot of large, trendy, left-leaning cities that will happily let you walk around with your two AR15. Denver has a ban. It has banned open carry for decades.
I really question the affordability of Seattle. Can I have a good and comfortable life there. I’m unsure if I’m constantly worried about money and needing roommates. I want to not have roommates anymore.
As far as weather goes, it’s called a “subtropical highland” climate which exists in the higher elevations of the Appalachians and some parts of Hawaii. However 60s and sunny and humid is not what I want all year round, hence why I asked for four seasons.
Seattle always intrigued me because it resembles more of my favorite natural environments in the world (Alaska, Glacier Park, fjords of Norway, Alps) but as I’ve matured over time it’s less about beauty and what the place can provide me. Seattle is not only the furthest possible place I’d consider from my family, it also has questionable winter weather and bad gun control laws, some of the worst in the country (#48 out of 50).
I missed the four seasons bullet point, my mistake. Subtropical highland climate is unfortunately very rare in the US; the best example of that climate is Mexico City. If you are willing to relocate outside of the US without leaving North America, Mexico City could actually be a great option. There's a large number of US expats there. Though the gun laws there (not familiar with what they are) are probably very different from the US and may be a nonstarter.
Seattle is expensive, but a lot of the high col is wrapped into the housing prices. Looking at Zillow, if you live outside of the core neighborhoods, you could probably find a 1 bed, 1 bath for around 1.5k. Assuming you don't have car payments, student loans, or other debts, you could be comfortable on 70k+ income. Washington doesn't have any state income tax which helps a bit with tax burden, though I'm not sure the tax situation in Seattle itself. The winter weather is much more moderate than one would think, it's cool, but not cold. The constant overcast might be a turnoff for some people.
You're not going to find a heck of a lot of large, trendy, left-leaning cities that will happily let you walk around with your two AR15. Denver has a ban. It has banned open carry for decades.
I’m not asking for open carry. I’m asking for reasonable gun control. You can try to interpret that as meaning no gun control at all but that’s not what I mean. I didn’t emphasize it for a reason in my first post. Most of this country has sensible gun control. I plan on keeping my family heirlooms even though I never use them. I’m against restrictive bans of certain types of weapons. We need some gun control, but some places go too far. Like Colorado apparently. California just ruled their ban as unconstitutional. To me they treat a symptom and not the cure. If you want my opinions on the matter we can take it to the political channel but to sum it up it means free affordable healthcare, improving social conditions for women (lots of mass shooters have been incels), removing the stigma against mental health and improving mental health access. We need to address *why* people are doing these mass killings, rather than *how* they are doing it. Then when people’s lives are better with improved living conditions and we still have problems, I’ll be more open to change my thoughts. But I do believe what I just said aligns with democrats and I think these things are a much more important thing to address. I truly believe improving living conditions will take care of about 95% of this issue, as well as knowing when people need mental health help and getting that help without a huge burden to them.
I’m trying to be open minded here with places. Arizona has basically zero gun control and I don’t think that’s acceptable. Arizona needs more, but it needs to be reasonable. Things like waiting periods, restrictions on magazine types, are things I support. Again I don’t want to deep dive into politics. If the state doesn’t have weird outright weapon bans for certain guns I’m generally ok with it.
Last edited by Prickly Pear; 12-13-2021 at 11:15 AM..
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