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I don't get this whole "teir 1, tier 2, tier 3 b" stuff people are talking about. The US has "the big 3" that are well known internationally, LA, NYC, and Chicago. That's it. All other cities are not as well known from a global perspective. America has always been represented by "the big 3" and will continue to be.
Not really. Miami, SF, and DC might exceed Chicago in international exposure. SF is easily a peer economically. DC is in the news worldwide every day.
I don't get this whole "teir 1, tier 2, tier 3 b" stuff people are talking about. The US has "the big 3" that are well known internationally, LA, NYC, and Chicago. That's it. All other cities are not as well known from a global perspective. America has always been represented by "the big 3" and will continue to be.
Always been known...?
The top cities are always in Flux.
Baltimore
Boston
DC
Philadelphia
San Francisco
Even New Orleans
St Louis
And Charleston have had periods in the top 5 and all have had periods where they were more important than Chicago and LA.
Let's not forget that Boston and Philly used to be bigger and more important than New York.
New York has definitely been a top 3 city for just about all of the country's history, but let's not play like the US of the 70s and 80s is what has always been and always will be.
Chicago and LA has had phenomenal growth in the 1900's but before that there were rapidly growing cities and there are different rapidly growing cities now.
LA is still much bigger than the next group of cities and since it's business is media it's notoriety isn't going to be challenged anytime soon.
But Chicago has definitely lost its foothold on the top 3.
DC and SF is definitely in the same caliber (or higher) than Chicago;
and Boston, Philly, Houston, DFW, Atlanta and Miami are definitely closer to Chicago than Chicago is to being in the same tier as LA.
At best it is a 3-5 city on the way to being a 6-10 city.
Always been known...?
The top cities are always in Flux.
Baltimore
Boston
DC
Philadelphia
San Francisco
Even New Orleans
St Louis
And Charleston have had periods in the top 5 and all have had periods where they were more important than Chicago and LA.
Let's not forget that Boston and Philly used to be bigger and more important than New York.
New York has definitely been a top 3 city for just about all of the country's history, but let's not play like the US of the 70s and 80s is what has always been and always will be.
Chicago and LA has had phenomenal growth in the 1900's but before that there were rapidly growing cities and there are different rapidly growing cities now.
LA is still much bigger than the next group of cities and since it's business is media it's notoriety isn't going to be challenged anytime soon.
But Chicago has definitely lost its foothold on the top 3.
DC and SF is definitely in the same caliber (or higher) than Chicago;
and Boston, Philly, Houston, DFW, Atlanta and Miami are definitely closer to Chicago than Chicago is to being in the same tier as LA.
At best it is a 3-5 city on the way to being a 6-10 city.
And as far as "global/international" reputation, I would definitely put Miami at least equal to Chicago (being generous), but more realistically ahead of it as well. As far as "city" itself, I still think Chicago is solidly a top 5 city overall, but it would fluctuate between 3-5 depending on what criteria you are looking at. I don't think it's on it's way to being a 6-10 city. But I don't think it can claim "Big 3."
And as far as "global/international" reputation, I would definitely put Miami at least equal to Chicago (being generous), but more realistically ahead of it as well. As far as "city" itself, I still think Chicago is solidly a top 5 city overall, but it would fluctuate between 3-5 depending on what criteria you are looking at. I don't think it's on it's way to being a 6-10 city. But I don't think it can claim "Big 3."
You don't think Chicago is on its way to being knocked out of the top 5?
I am not saying that it is out now.
We both agree that it is in that 3-5 range, but it has had tepid growth the last few decades and i definitely see Boston challenging it in a decade or two.
Don't take it as Chicago falling out of the 3-5 range. I don't think Chicago has lost much of its stature. I prefer to look at it as Boston being a contender for that 3-5 range which would make it a 3-6 tier instead. I'm not seeing that Chicago will be 6 in that scenario, I'm just saying that another 10-20 years of this trajectory and Boston and maybe a few others may be expanding the size of that tier.
When I first started reading the comments on city data ( before I joined) Philly, SF and Boston were all in the same tier. Now it seems most generally rank SF a tier above Boston and Philly a tier below.
I think Both Boston and Philly have been moving up in the last 5-10 years and as is always the case, we are sleeping on the sunbelt cities.
DFW domestically is gaining parity with Chicago.
Internationally, I agree with you that Miami is in that 3-6 mix too.
But I don't think there is much consistency in Chicago being in that #3 spot. 3-5 for now, 3-6 I can definitely see coming
There is a lot of talk about Chicago slipping back among most influential US cities.
Per a quick Google search Chicago ranks ahead of every US city (except NYC and LA) in the usual influential city ranking sites (GaWC, Kearney, business insider, etc.)
My questions...
1. Am I misinterpreting the thread topic vs global city rankings?
2. Are people on CD just s***ting on Chicago?
3. Is it me, or do people on CD only reference city ranking sites when it benefits their city, and rankings are trash when their favorite (or least favorite) city doesn't rank where they personally feel it should?
I see good points on both sides of the argument regarding where Chicago ranks. While SF, Miami, DC, even Boston & Philadelphia closed the gap, I still think Chicago has a solid argument for #3. Could that change in 10+ years? Likely yes. But as always, personal predictions are just that, especially CD predictions.
It's more that is the same city it was 20 years ago while SF, DC and Boston has increased their cache.
Not once did you see me say that Chicago is not #3.
In every post I say it is 3 to 5.
I don't disagree with any link you post with Chicago as #3. But it's more along like 3-5 range than the 1-3 range as SF and DC are more it's peers than LA and NY
You don't think Chicago is on its way to being knocked out of the top 5?
I am not saying that it is out now.
We both agree that it is in that 3-5 range, but it has had tepid growth the last few decades and i definitely see Boston challenging it in a decade or two.
Don't take it as Chicago falling out of the 3-5 range. I don't think Chicago has lost much of its stature. I prefer to look at it as Boston being a contender for that 3-5 range which would make it a 3-6 tier instead. I'm not seeing that Chicago will be 6 in that scenario, I'm just saying that another 10-20 years of this trajectory and Boston and maybe a few others may be expanding the size of that tier.
When I first started reading the comments on city data ( before I joined) Philly, SF and Boston were all in the same tier. Now it seems most generally rank SF a tier above Boston and Philly a tier below.
I think Both Boston and Philly have been moving up in the last 5-10 years and as is always the case, we are sleeping on the sunbelt cities.
DFW domestically is gaining parity with Chicago.
Internationally, I agree with you that Miami is in that 3-6 mix too.
But I don't think there is much consistency in Chicago being in that #3 spot. 3-5 for now, 3-6 I can definitely see coming
Oh yeah, I definitely can see it dropping to 6. I was more so reacting to the 6-10 range. I don't see it dropping that far. I personally see it hovering in the 5-6 range. Although, I think it's relatively affordable midwest location, and its strong bones give it potential to have a strong comeback at some point.
Recently landing Google downtown was a nice start. I think if it can gain some momentum in the tech space, and can maintain its relatively strong financial stature, AND hopefully get a real mayor, the city has potential to regain some ground.
But yes, Boston has impressively continued to rise up the ranks. In certain metrics, I think Boston surpasses Chicago now. I think Boston's smaller size is the only think that holds in back in some of the major metrics in terms of ranking all cities.
There is a lot of talk about Chicago slipping back among most influential US cities.
Per a quick Google search Chicago ranks ahead of every US city (except NYC and LA) in the usual influential city ranking sites (GaWC, Kearney, business insider, etc.)
My questions...
1. Am I misinterpreting the thread topic vs global city rankings?
2. Are people on CD just s***ting on Chicago?
3. Is it me, or do people on CD only reference city ranking sites when it benefits their city, and rankings are trash when their favorite (or least favorite) city doesn't rank where they personally feel it should?
I see good points on both sides of the argument regarding where Chicago ranks. While SF, Miami, DC, even Boston & Philadelphia closed the gap, I still think Chicago has a solid argument for #3. Could that change in 10+ years? Likely yes. But as always, personal predictions are just that, especially CD predictions.
Sure it argues for #3, and it wins by some metrics. Just not on international notoriety.
There is a lot of talk about Chicago slipping back among most influential US cities.
Per a quick Google search Chicago ranks ahead of every US city (except NYC and LA) in the usual influential city ranking sites (GaWC, Kearney, business insider, etc.)
My questions...
1. Am I misinterpreting the thread topic vs global city rankings?
2. Are people on CD just s***ting on Chicago?
3. Is it me, or do people on CD only reference city ranking sites when it benefits their city, and rankings are trash when their favorite (or least favorite) city doesn't rank where they personally feel it should?
I see good points on both sides of the argument regarding where Chicago ranks. While SF, Miami, DC, even Boston & Philadelphia closed the gap, I still think Chicago has a solid argument for #3. Could that change in 10+ years? Likely yes. But as always, personal predictions are just that, especially CD predictions.
Chicago is still number 3 in my opinion. I don’t see it falling back too much. It still has great museums, strong performing arts organizations that are world-class, among many other top notch qualities.
Economically, and population-wise, other cities may surpass it, but those two factors don’t make a city “great.”
This is nonsense. San Francisco has much more international notoriety than Chicago. DC also edges out Chicago as well since it’s the Nation’s Capital. Boston and Miami can make claims for having as much of an international reputation as Chicago as well.
I agree that NYC and LA are at the top, but Chicago is not part of “the big 3.” Chicago is somewhere in the 4-6 range from a global perspective. You must still be living in the 90’s if you think otherwise…..
I'm going to have to heavily disagree with that. What are we use as a metric for international notoriety?
IG likes/tags? Global business climate? Number music festivals? tourism numbers? flight arrivals?
DC, SF, Boston & Miami excel in their niches. Chicago is never going to match those niches (at parity) but those niches don't exist in a void. Chicago is the epitome of "Jack of all trades" and has the most diversified economy in the country which is why it outside of NYC & LA it still consistently ranked higher than DC, SF, Boston or Miami on virtually every global ranking index in 2021.
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