Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Some things I agree here but the odd statement is Pgh is more aligned with the great lakes because of some trade in a certain short era (I think from about 1920-1950 only 30 years), this is a very weird idea.
Pittsburgh was a colonial settlement and has a long history connected to the other midatlantic areas, way before the auto industry connections to the great lakes ( and it still exists today with other business and familial ties).
the eastern euro statement is also odd though - all big northeastern cities have a significant eastern european component. for example, Philadelphia has several large neighborhoods of them, including Port Richmond (old school Polish hood). NYC has many eastern euros and slavs in many various areas all over the region. Pittsburgh is also the most Italian major metro in the US, another big midatlantic trait. and the large number of historic brick rowhouses in many neighborhoods.
I wasn't referring to the auto industry. I was referring to raw iron/steel materials that began to be transported from the Mesabi in Minnesota through the Great Lakes into Cleveland/NE Ohio and then down to steel country from there. That was more like late 1800s to 1980s (maybe beyond but 80s was about when Pittsburgh started becoming less steel dependant). That's the same general time frame whare Pittsburgh (and Cleveland/Great Lakes areas) also saw their population booms.
So yes, Pittsburgh has Colonial history (that is evident
by the old row neighborhoods), but the Steel City moniker has more to do with being tied into the Great Lakes than it does points east.
As for Eastern European influence, of course the big cities to the East have Polish/Slavic neighborhoods, but not to the extent (on a percentage basis) as the Great Lakes area (Buffalo/Cleveland/Detroit/Chicago) specifically. Pittsburgh is right in that mix of being around 20-25 percent claiming that heritage.
Pittsburgh does have a huge Italian ancestry, but is that really a Mid-Atlantic thing? Northeast Ohio is about twice as Italian (percent wise) as say Baltimore or DC (about as Mid-Atlantic as it gets). The most Italian part of Pennsylvania is indeed in Western Pa., but it's Lawrence County (30-plus percent claim it). Lawrence is smack between Pittsburgh and Youngstown... Youngstown, fwiw, is probably the most renowned Italian mob city outside of Vegas that didn't have its own family, and that's because of the Cleveland-Pittsburgh mob wars that took place there in the 60s/70s to control the rackets in what was (again outside of Vegas) was the most corrupt Italian-American politically held area in the country. Pittsburgh won that mob war, btw, mainly because the Cleveland mafia got sidetracked in warring with Irish union dock leader/gangster Danny Green in the 70s and Pittsburgh took control of Youngstown, which was the last truly Italian mob area into the late 90s/early 2000s.
As far as the Appalachian aspect, at least to me, it's not a knock, it just is what it is. Pittsburgh is right in the Appalachian Mountains that stretches for 1,000 miles from what, NY to Alabama?? Yeah, there are differences within that. There are also differences between Watertown, NY and Duluth, Minnesota (also 1,000 miles apart) but they are both Great Lakes cities.
That map makes it look like a "New York City" thing primarily, which it really is.
Just New York City? I see the Northeast, look at Boston and Philly, even to a lesser extent Baltimore and the state of Delaware.
Basically, its a map of the Northeast and part of the Midwest where it was ok for Catholics (who used to face discrimination) to settle in the 1800s. Later, populations were able to move to other areas, notably California, Florida and Nevada.
Just New York City? I see the Northeast, look at Boston and Philly, even to a lesser extent Baltimore and the state of Delaware.
Basically, its a map of the Northeast and part of the Midwest where it was ok for Catholics (who used to face discrimination) to settle in the 1800s. Later, populations were able to move to other areas, notably California, Florida and Nevada.
For sure. Italian-Americans are clearly one of the most condensed "white ethnic" populations in the US, up there with Jewish Americans, and it's obviously more consistently pronounced throughout the Northeast compared to the rest of the US. Like not even debatable.
Just New York City? I see the Northeast, look at Boston and Philly, even to a lesser extent Baltimore and the state of Delaware.
Basically, its a map of the Northeast and part of the Midwest where it was ok for Catholics (who used to face discrimination) to settle in the 1800s. Later, populations were able to move to other areas, notably California, Florida and Nevada.
NYC metro is easily the hot spot with some secondary clusters like Boston, Philly or even New Orleans, but nothing else getting close really. NYC is without a doubt the capital of Italian America.
I don't think the clusters in the Midwest have anything to do with 'where it was OK for catholics to settle' as many other areas have strong clusters of other Catholic groups like Irish, Germans and Polish.
There's often a degree of randomness to it in the sense that individual families can start a community which then draws in further migrants etc. but a common pattern with Italian immigrants is that they were going for industrial jobs and usually not going to settle in primarily agricultural areas in any numbers. So that put them mostly into bigger towns, cities and areas with heavy industrial activity.
The little cluster of Italians for instance in and around the UP of Michigan (which is known for producing guys like Tom Izzo and Steve Mariucci) is directly and strongly linked to the mining industry in that area. Same with that little cluster in Colorado.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
