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America (by world standards) has a very weird work culture which is magnified by our weird zoning laws & obsession of car/suburban orientated living which inherently draws people out of the central cities when they are not at work hours. Outside of NYC, Lb-lb our cities are substantially less geared for night-life than their Latin American/European/Asian equivalent.
Hell, I just came back from Puerto Rico yesterday and a regular Friday night in Las Placita's pretty much blew anything that wasn't Mardi Gras out the water in terms of vibrancy and street life.
I agree completely. Most all cities I've been to since the pandemic are really bad with nightlife--like, really bad.
Here in New York, the pandemic really shuffled things around for nightlife. As in, partying only happened underground late at night, and you had to know someone who knew someone, where a there was a low key spot where ton of ppl "who mostly just knew each other" were hanging until 7-8am.
It's still a lot like that here in New York. BUT, I will have to say, over the course of the past few months now in the spring, there is a lot more people out late here in many neighborhoods (the "going out" late hoods), like Williamsburg, Bushwick, Lower East Side, East Village, West Village, Hell's Kitchen, NoLita, etc.
I think the pandemic just really caused people to be much more homebody, than they were before the pandemic.
Outside of NYC, since the pandemic, I've been to Nashville, Atlanta, LA, Dallas, Austin, Phoenix, San Fran, Chicago, Miami and San Juan, Puerto Rico. I've gone out in every one of those cities except San Juan (we were at an all inclusive resort).
The only cities that had lame people/not many people out/kind of lousy bar nights/etc, were Dallas and Phoenix (Scottsdale).
I had a decent time in all the other cities, and the nights were pretty interesting but not so unique.
Although I did go to a dive gay bar in Dallas that was really fun, but super sketchy too, and a lousy crowd.
I also think once you get outside of the major cosmopolitan and more global cities in the US like NY, Chicago, Miami, San Fran, LA, etc, nightlife in most "mid sized" metros is very small and grouped into categories of college age folks, 20/30 something hetero bar singles and couples, LGBTQ+ bars/nightlife, and bad country, rock or karoke bars that cater to everyone in-between.
Not hit upon is the premise that Americans tend to find their homes a sanctuary and plan a lot of social experiences around entertaining there, versus the dress up and go out dynamic so popular elsewhere. In much of Europe and Asia home is often seen as a basic place to flop at night, versus a center for one's social life.
Nobody is saying the obvious. Americans typically eat dinner around 5:30 not 8:30. By 9:30 their “night” is in full swing . While in Spain it hasn’t started.
You can say what you want about Suburbanization or Crime or whatever but the UK had Ireland kind of lacks all of that and is fundamentally similar to America in terms of nightlife
But also the fact that Americans do live in effectively mansions (over twice the size of an average Spanish house) most Americans can host a bunch of people at their house in a way Japanese people can’t.
I was in Cahersiveen Ireland 6 years ago to the day, and was in a pub that just started to get very intimate with music around midnight. I realized I was in a very rare, special moment, when local talent started playing string instruments with percussion. The setting was where tourists don't spend an evening and the busses pass these small places by. Anyway, I just sat back and observed, watching improvisational performances continue until about 3:00 am when everyone there was tired enough to walk back to their local homes. That's not happening in larger cities. I was totally in my element as I saw my fifth generation roots right in front of me.
I agree completely. Most all cities I've been to since the pandemic are really bad with nightlife--like, really bad.
Here in New York, the pandemic really shuffled things around for nightlife. As in, partying only happened underground late at night, and you had to know someone who knew someone, where a there was a low key spot where ton of ppl "who mostly just knew each other" were hanging until 7-8am.
It's still a lot like that here in New York. BUT, I will have to say, over the course of the past few months now in the spring, there is a lot more people out late here in many neighborhoods (the "going out" late hoods), like Williamsburg, Bushwick, Lower East Side, East Village, West Village, Hell's Kitchen, NoLita, etc.
I think the pandemic just really caused people to be much more homebody, than they were before the pandemic.
Outside of NYC, since the pandemic, I've been to Nashville, Atlanta, LA, Dallas, Austin, Phoenix, San Fran, Chicago, Miami and San Juan, Puerto Rico. I've gone out in every one of those cities except San Juan (we were at an all inclusive resort).
The only cities that had lame people/not many people out/kind of lousy bar nights/etc, were Dallas and Phoenix (Scottsdale).
I had a decent time in all the other cities, and the nights were pretty interesting but not so unique.
Although I did go to a dive gay bar in Dallas that was really fun, but super sketchy too, and a lousy crowd.
I also think once you get outside of the major cosmopolitan and more global cities in the US like NY, Chicago, Miami, San Fran, LA, etc, nightlife in most "mid sized" metros is very small and grouped into categories of college age folks, 20/30 something hetero bar singles and couples, LGBTQ+ bars/nightlife, and bad country, rock or karoke bars that cater to everyone in-between.
So which one is it - first you said nightlife is really bad in most places after the pandemic but then you say it’s actually pretty good everywhere you’ve been but Phoenix and Dallas.
The only city of the ones you’ve listed that I’ve been to since the pandemic is San Francisco, and I gotta say it was pretty bad. SFs nightlife in general has been going downhill for a while now. In the early-mid 2000s it had one of the best nightlife scenes in the country hands down. I was there in 2018 and it was notably worse but still decent. I went back last December and it was super dead both nights we were there. Sketchy and relatively quiet, even in the main nightlife districts.
Not hit upon is the premise that Americans tend to find their homes a sanctuary and plan a lot of social experiences around entertaining there, versus the dress up and go out dynamic so popular elsewhere. In much of Europe and Asia home is often seen as a basic place to flop at night, versus a center for one's social life.
I think you're onto something here. There's not really an equivalent to the HGTV home improvement shows in Asia or Europe, at least not at the same level of fanaticism.
I'm glad you said "fear" of crime, because in most major cities crime has been on a relatively stead downward trend for 30 years. But people are more fearful.
The apps too. I look at that relationship forum here, and young people instead of throwing parties and hitting the town to see a show or dance are using apps to meet people? Eesh.
And yes, we work longer and earlier. Before retirement, especially in my 20s-40s, I was almost never in bed past 6am. Maybe 7 on a weekend. Too much to do. So If I was out to party, then after party, I was running on fumes the next day or so. Sure I did it when younger, but not so much when older.
And yes, we have a puritanical streak and honestly, it seems to be getting worse.
The online dating scene was once half-way respectable back around 2005-2010 or so. Now you have the proliferation of fake profiles, bots and plenty of wasted time caught up in algos guaranteed to successfully get more money from you.
Public transit is a great luxury to have for a weekend adventure around. There's no designated driver to worry about. And it's much cheaper than flocking down an Uber to get from place to place.
Poor nightlife is often found in places that lack any major pro sports teams or have poor weather for many months out of the year. A lack of sizeable concert venues is also going to hurt nightlife. In contrast, living in a regional hub or being a tourist epicenter is going to sway things in favor of more nightlife.
I've never been to Europe but I'd have to guess it a mix of a lot of things. Because a lot of cities are so car-centric the nightlife gets spread out. For example in San Antonio if someone were to visit and just go the riverwalk you wouldn't even be scratching the surface of the nightlife. You have a ton of spots (arguably way more popping than anything downtown) 15 miles outside of the city by UTSA/La Cantera/Stone Oak. If you were in town for a convention you'd never know those places existed. Same story in Dallas/Houston/Florida cities/Phoenix/LA, etc.
Chicago and NYC would probably be the only 2 cities that have anything like a European feel at night. Restaurants open late, 24 hour subway lines, bars close late, walkable nightlife areas, etc.
Idk how much of an effect covid still has on nightlife these days. I guess it depends where you are and the mindset of the area. Texas has been 100% open for like 2 years now, even before that it was only operating at a capacity limit with the exception of like a month or so when everything was closed.
Nobody is saying the obvious. Americans typically eat dinner around 5:30 not 8:30. By 9:30 their “night” is in full swing . While in Spain it hasn’t started.
You can say what you want about Suburbanization or Crime or whatever but the UK had Ireland kind of lacks all of that and is fundamentally similar to America in terms of nightlife
But also the fact that Americans do live in effectively mansions (over twice the size of an average Spanish house) most Americans can host a bunch of people at their house in a way Japanese people can’t.
i literally did say this lol
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