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Since you provide no justifcation, tell me this, then: who were the Scotch Irish, ethnically/ancestrally speaking, and what region did they come from?
The Scotch-Irish are those whose ancestry, in large part or completely, came from the Scottish lowlands and the Protestant parts of Ireland. Hence the name, it refers to the largely Presbyterian regions of the British isles that include Scottish and Irish counties. I thought this was pretty standard and accepted. (That Wikipedia may disagree is not per-se meaningful)
Now "Appalachians" include Germans, French, American Indians, and English. However not all Appalachians are Scotch-Irish and probably not all Scots-Irish are Appalachian. (Although GF seems to say that if they're Scottish they're not Scotch-Irish and that's somewhat incorrect. Some Scottish are not Scotch-Irish, but some are. Also a Scotch-Irish person may have some German or French ancestry, but their predominant ancestry or the one they identify with most is Ulster/Lowland-Scottish)
The Scotch-Irish are those whose ancestry, in large part or completely, came from the Scottish lowlands and the Protestant parts of Ireland. Hence the name, it refers to the largely Presbyterian regions of the British isles that include Scottish and Irish counties. I thought this was pretty standard and accepted. (That Wikipedia may disagree is not per-se meaningful)
i agree with that definition.
My point is more that these ulster protestants living in the northeast of Ireland included significant numbers of palatines, huguenots, and people expelled from various parts of catholic europe (mostly from France, and the kingdoms of southern Germany).
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Now "Appalachians" include Germans, French, American Indians, and English. However not all Appalachians are Scotch-Irish and probably not all Scots-Irish are Appalachian. (Although GF seems to say that if they're Scottish they're not Scotch-Irish and that's somewhat incorrect. Some Scottish are not Scotch-Irish, but some are. Also a Scotch-Irish person may have some German or French ancestry, but their predominant ancestry or the one they identify with most is Ulster/Lowland-Scottish)
I agree with you, over your girlfriend... for example there were a reasonable number of Scottish people who settled in Charleston in the very, very early days, alongside the people from southern England. I recall reading that some of the English people of that day were mildly upset that their children were learning scottish dialects in school.
These would've been different than the Scotch-Irish (who may have also had significant numbers of Scottish people) who mostly arrived after 1700.
Before reading the map posted by rubber_factory on the first page, I would of said Louisiana. I remember hearing about the loose liquor laws they have there, with drive thru cocktail places and 15 year old kids that get served in bars.
I think this is a very educational thread, in that all the states with the heavy drinkers are mostly northern states, and my home state of Iowa is in the top 4. I do not drink much at all, but when I do it's always in the dead of winter, new years eve gets me started with the brandy. It gets so cold here in January and Feburary, kind of a depressing time of year.
I saw the movie "White Lightning" the other day, can't imagine alot of people down there drinking that stuff in the heat of summer. Never saw so much sweat in one movie, lol.
Before reading the map posted by rubber_factory on the first page, I would of said Louisiana. I remember hearing about the loose liquor laws they have there, with drive thru cocktail places and 15 year old kids that get served in bars.
I think this is a very educational thread, in that all the states with the heavy drinkers are mostly northern states, and my home state of Iowa is in the top 4. I do not drink much at all, but when I do it's always in the dead of winter, new years eve gets me started with the brandy. It gets so cold here in January and Feburary, kind of a depressing time of year.
I saw the movie "White Lightning" the other day, can't imagine alot of people down there drinking that stuff in the heat of summer. Never saw so much sweat in one movie, lol.
There were bars in my neighborhood serving us when we were 14-15 years old up north just as in Louisiana. I am sure there are bars like that everywhere.
There is heavy drinking everywhere but I do know that my friends from Tennessee and Virginia all bring back a couple of bottles of shine when they come back from visiting family.
Before reading the map posted by rubber_factory on the first page, I would of said Louisiana. I remember hearing about the loose liquor laws they have there, with drive thru cocktail places and 15 year old kids that get served in bars.
Loose state laws are mostly irrelevant. It's the feds who do most of the cracking down on bootleggers. The Treasury Department gets a mite cranky when they don't get their cut of the pie.
Loose state laws are mostly irrelevant. It's the feds who do most of the cracking down on bootleggers. The Treasury Department gets a mite cranky when they don't get their cut of the pie.
Can't be too harsh on the bootleggers. Where would the Kennedy clan be now if ole Joe wasn't running booze during prohibition?
Arkansas, Louisiana, and Tennessee are in the top ten for "alcohol related traffic deaths per capita." Although maybe that's a sign of poor roads. (Wyoming, Montana, South Dakota, and New Mexico are also above those three)
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Montana is also above those three in heavy drinkers. Wisconsin is top in heavy-drinkers as well as binge-drinkers. Rhode Island is also very high for binge drinkers and heavy drinkers. Although it is low on alcohol related traffic fatalities. Wisconsin isn't too high in alcohol related traffic fatalities, but it is above average for them by this source.
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Arkansas, Louisiana, and Tennessee are in the top ten for "alcohol related traffic deaths per capita." Although maybe that's a sign of poor roads. (Wyoming, Montana, South Dakota, and New Mexico are also above those three)
I suspect it has a lot to do with the percentage of rural population. If you live out in the sticks, there's not a lot of alternatives for getting home if you think you've had a couple too many but to climb into the pickup and take your chances. Fewer options for nearby drinking establishments too, so they're likely to be driving several miles instead of just "right around the corner."
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