Are environmentalism and humanism opposed to each other? (activist, radical, environmentalists)
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I'm not talking about mainstream environmentalism like recycling and electric cars, but I mean deep ecology. The idea that humanity is a "Planet Killing" species seems to be the common trope in deep ecology and even in the mainstream.
The way I see it it's unrealistic to not expect a species as complex and full of desires as our own not to have a significant impact on the biosphere. While we should definitely strive to be less wasteful and more efficient I'd much rather live in the 20th or 21st century than in previous centuries when the world was still "wild". I think the biosphere is not nearly as fragile as people think and while our industrial civilization is certainly changing it I highly doubt the doomsayers are right. Europe has lost most of its biodiversity yet it's still very functional as an ecosystem and supports many people and animals.
I think it's no coincidence that deep ecologists and animal rights activists have a strong relationship with fascism and the pornography industry as most of them have extremely misanthropic viewpoints. I would generally consider myself pro-environment rather than pro-business but I think the idea that humanity is a plague or that all species are equal is a severe threat to human rights and all the progress we have made in being more peaceful than we used to be in the past.
I think it's no coincidence that deep ecologists and animal rights activists have a strong relationship with fascism and the pornography industry as most of them have extremely misanthropic viewpoints.
It's statements like this that keeps me coming back to this forum.
Aside from taking extreme positions mentioned in your posts, I do think that the world is way over populated. I am a conservative in most cases, but am also very much a conservationist and environmentalist. People need to stop having so many children, especially poor people.
And no, I am not saying that we should start killing off people so that rare species of insects can live, so please don't put words in my mouth.
Environmentalism and humanism are not opposites because they are different topics (much like creationism and evolution are not opposites for the same reason).
Not all humanists are environmentalists either. There are many schools of thought within humanism.
stepping back, here is the defintion:
hu·man·ism. noun.
1.
an outlook or system of thought attaching prime importance to human rather than divine or supernatural matters. Humanist beliefs stress the potential value and goodness of human beings, emphasize common human needs, and seek solely rational ways of solving human problems.
They are not opposites because humanists acknowledge that humans have a dark side; they just like to emphesize the goodness.
I think it's no coincidence that deep ecologists and animal rights activists have a strong relationship with fascism and the pornography industry as most of them have extremely misanthropic viewpoints.
Not to sidetrack the thread, but I'd really like to know your source for these alleged "connections." I'm not saying they don't exist, mind you, but such a startling statement really needs a bit of support.
This is all just your personal opinion that has no basis in fact .. i.e. you have made all this up!
Quote:
Originally Posted by belmont22
I'm not talking about mainstream environmentalism like recycling and electric cars, but I mean deep ecology. The idea that humanity is a "Planet Killing" species seems to be the common trope in deep ecology and even in the mainstream.
The way I see it it's unrealistic to not expect a species as complex and full of desires as our own not to have a significant impact on the biosphere. While we should definitely strive to be less wasteful and more efficient I'd much rather live in the 20th or 21st century than in previous centuries when the world was still "wild". I think the biosphere is not nearly as fragile as people think and while our industrial civilization is certainly changing it I highly doubt the doomsayers are right. Europe has lost most of its biodiversity yet it's still very functional as an ecosystem and supports many people and animals.
I think it's no coincidence that deep ecologists and animal rights activists have a strong relationship with fascism and the pornography industry as most of them have extremely misanthropic viewpoints. I would generally consider myself pro-environment rather than pro-business but I think the idea that humanity is a plague or that all species are equal is a severe threat to human rights and all the progress we have made in being more peaceful than we used to be in the past.
Radical environmentalism, much like radical anything tends to conflict with humanism. A belief that humans are a plague on the world and must be stopped is very dangerous. The most radical environmentalists seem to have more in common with religious zealots than anything else. A Mullah stoning a woman for infidelity, a Christian centuries ago being burned at the stake for thinking the world was round, and a radical environmentalist condemning millions to die of malaria due to nonsensical hatred of DDT are all committing crimes against humanity. Each would see the other as heathen.
Radical environmentalism, much like radical anything tends to conflict with humanism.
There is also radical humanism, which conflicts with non-radical humanism... just like radical environmentalism conflicts with non-radical environmentalism. Radical anything conflicts with non-radical anything.
Humanism is the belief that humans are the ones responsible for fixing the world's problems. This does not conflict with environmentalism because environmentalism is also about humans fixing the world's problems (at least at the environmental level).
I think it's no coincidence that deep ecologists and animal rights activists have a strong relationship with fascism and the pornography industry as most of them have extremely misanthropic viewpoints.
I laughed way too long at that. If you're going to make such a provocative claim like that, you really ought to elaborate.
Anyway, you've made a lot of generalizations here. I think we can all agree that habitats, the environment, and animals will naturally change for the better or worse over time (after all, they say something like 95-99% of all species that have lived on the Earth are extinct). The problem that people who study animals, geology, environmental science, epidemiology, biological anthropology, etc have with how humans are presently treating the environment has to do with both its unnaturalness and its overwhelming cons. By unnaturalness, I mean that species and habitats are being destroyed at rates that far exceed how those species and habitats might naturally cease to exist. And by overwhelming cons, I'll use the example of epidemiological transitions over human history: sure, we have great technology and have made huge scientific advancements these days, but our generally sedentary lifestyles, overpopulation, environmental degradation, and overprescription of medication has led to formidable disease patterns that we're struggling to beat.
So, even if you don't care about the environment, you'd be silly to ignore the very real consequences that our degradation of the environment will have on humanity as a whole. Another example for you to consider: water. Western nations especially waste drinkable water like crazy. What are we going to do when it's not so readily available?
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