Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I don't blame society, movies or his personal choices. I blame his upbringing and lack of consistency from his parents/family to guide him. Otherwise, it's hereditary and his family seeing his behavior as normal.
Well, his half-brother and his sister certainly appear to be normal. There are plenty of families in which one kid strays. That's not the fault of the parent(s).
I have NEVER watched or read Hunger Games based on the mere premise alone. That father that's crying "Gun violence" is stupid. Instead of placing the blame where it belongs, on HOLLYWOOD and their perversion and immorality, he wants to point the finger at the NRA.
How do you figure Hollywood is responsible & not the NRA? You want perversion & immorality look no further than the NRA & their supporters. You only have to hear or read the comments of gun nuts after a tragedy such as children getting murdered to see who are truly the immoral ones. It's disgusting.
Last edited by thefragile; 05-30-2014 at 12:00 PM..
I have NEVER watched or read Hunger Games based on the mere premise alone. That father that's crying "Gun violence" is stupid. Instead of placing the blame where it belongs, on HOLLYWOOD and their perversion and immorality, he wants to point the finger at the NRA.
The issue is Hollywood's "ties" to the death are NOT the Hunger Games but rather Judd Apatow movies. The father's complaints were a part of Washington's failure to act after Sandy Hook, rather than the NRA was the issue.
Movies and what is depicted in them are a big problem, yes, but they are by no means the ONLY problem. To say "well, I watch violent movies and I'm not violent" really isn't a good comparison. It's kind of like evolution. Specific curcumstances don't cause change to happen all at once. but continued exposure to those circumstances can change how we think about things after a long period of exposure. As the author of the article says, the more we are exposed to something, the more conditioned we become to accepting it as normal. An examination of how what humans consider moral has changed and differed throughout history is evident proof of what I'm saying here. The author of the article hit the nail on the head when she said these type of movies "condition" the human brain over time. It's not just the movies though. It's the human environment in general. Someone from 70 years ago { which was a very conservative time } would not all of a sudden be sex crazed if they saw on of the movies from this time period, in fact they would probably be outraged. BUT, as the boundaries were pushed and more people were exposed to it, the more accepting they became of it. You see how exposure to this type of stuff can change how we think about things in general?
If you ask me, I think it's time we as a people reject our primitive addictions to sex and violence as a form of entertainment.
Last edited by WhipperSnapper 88; 06-01-2014 at 01:44 AM..
Here is a lengthy write-up I did over in P&OC addressing what I think are some of the root problems that lead to violence in our society.....
As we delve deeper in to this case, everyone seems to be asking why this tragedy happened..... Everyone is looking around trying to find answers to why these massacres continue to happen as if the answers aren't right in front of them. As deranged as Eliiot Rodger was, he was a very smart, very articulate man, and before he went on his rampage, he left society a diagnosis, some may even say an indictment, and told us everything we needed to know to figure out "why".... He left a "manifesto" of his "twisted world"..... of our twisted world. I've criticized others on here for reading it, but I must admit that I decided to read as well, and I am glad that I did. So, let's talk about some of the things that really jump off the pages of his writings. Below are the reasons this happened, or at least contributed. and the reasons why it will continue to happen so long as no one concerns themselves with fixing the real problems in our broken society.....
Parents Are No Longer Parents: Reading his manifesto, this is clear right from the outset. Here we have a kid who's parents were too busy with their careers and their own personal problems to raise their child. He was a kid that was raised not by responsible adults, but by violent video games, the internet, tv, and movies. His access to these things was so unfettered and so unsupervised, that his world was totally emersed and dedicated to these meaningless things, by his own admission. His parents seperated at an early age, which has everything to do with the degradation of the family unit in todays culture. This scenerio is the new normal, this is the definition of family life in this country. As long as we continue to devalue, to depopularize the family unit, nothing will change.
A Sex Crazed Society: Let's face it, we live in a sex crazed society. Everywhere we look we see sex. We live in a society where if you aren't having sex, there must be something wrong with you. Virginity for young males is treated like a plague that must be quickly cured. We live in a society where the idea that yiou are inadequate if you aren't having sex is prevalent. There is no longer any virtue or morality in abstinence. Women are portrayed as sex objects. Abstinence has been replaced with promiscuity as the new standard of normality. Elliot Rodger was so warped by our sex crazed society that he honestly believed girls should just come up to him and want to have sex. He was so brainwashed by the over sexed world he grew up in, that he believed he had a right to have sex.
A Celebration Of Violence: The celebration of violence is second only to sex in our warped society. We celebrate it, we crave it, whether it is depicted in our movies, video games, or discussed on our news media, we can't seem to get enough. We even impede traffic as we slow our vehicles and risk an accident all for the prospect of possibly getting a better look at the gore on the side of the road. Violence is seen as a way to fix all of our problems, or merely entertain us. We turn killers in to celebraties by reading their words on air, by showing their picture and saying their name, and giving them hours and hours of attention that they would not have had otherwise... " Infamy is better than total obscurity".... Elliot Rodger said that in his manifesto.
A Sense Of Entitlement: It's clear throughout Rodger's manifesto that he believed he was entitled to his idea of a happy life, not because he worked for it, not because he earned it, but because he believed he deserved it by default. He was raised to think this way, he was a priviledged kid who got all the advantages without ever having to work for them. Many young people who belong to my generation have this sense of entitlement. They believe that they deserve the maximun reward for doing a minimum amount of work, for putting in a minimum amount of effort, and showing a minimum amount of ambition.. They believe they are entitled to be on top, without having to start out on the bottom. We currently live in a society that promotes these ideals, so is it any wonder that someone who has been raised to believe he is entitled to the life he wants, that he has an inherent right to it, would be severely devasted when he doesn't automaticaly get it?
Instant Gratification: Much like the sense of entitlement that young people have today, along with it comes the belief that they have a right to attain whatever it is they want instantly. Elliot Rodger wanted a fancy glamorous life, and he wanted it instantly. He wanted a real relationship with a woman, but didn't want to work towards it. Instead, he thought one should just manifest itself. He wanted to be a rich young man, a millionaire so that he could buy the life he wanted, but he didn't want to put in any effort, he didn't want to work towards his goal of being wealthy. He spent hundreds if not thousands of dollars on lottery tickets, with the sincere belief that he would win, and was genuinely devastated when he didn't. People don't want to put in the time to be in the top office, they want to start out there. People don't want to earn promotions or pay raises, they want them at the outset. People no longer earn and save their money to buy what they want, now they use a charge card and pay for it later. There is no doubt that we live in a society that promotes and even encourages instant gratification.
The problem isn't guns, and it isn't even mental health. Those are just symptoms of the diseased web that we have spun for ourselves. We can go on and keep trying to blame guns or any number of other factors, it's alot easier to do that than to admit the problem is much more complex, but until we address the real problems in our broken society, it amounts to nothing more than twidling our thumbs. If you haven't read the manifesto yet, I would encourage you to do so. It's very informative and sheds a lot of light on the real weaknesses in our culture. Thanks for reading if you've made it this far, please share your thoughts....
Pop culture, whether it be musical, literary, or theatrical has always influenced society. It doesn't matter what the subject was, or the time. Poor Richards Almanac, Uncle Toms Cabin, the music of the 1960's, during prohibition, you name it, it has had an influence on our society, and our collective thought process.
That said.......
How can you say this ^^^^^^
Quote:
Most humans have this remarkable guard rail called "sanity". So when we see Bluto go home with a half naked hot blonde from the parade, we don't all think we deserve, or are going to get that.
We did not blame Jodi Foster for Reagans assassination attempt, why try and blame male movie roles for this one?
And then go on to say this^^^^^^^????
In effect, you are contradicfting yourself. You are basically saying, """"yeah, pop culture influences society and our collective thought process...... but it really doesn't""""
I don't think the more people is the problem, it is that wee have 24 hour news cycles that allow for this news to come out. Plus, there is also the celebrity effect that comes from wen a person kills several people now. We broadcast the Sandy Hooks, Auroras, Columbines, and all of the other murders for days on end.
You are exactly right..... Have you read the "manifesto" the killer left behind? In it, he talks about how no one ever noticed him in school, and so he started doing "weird" things to get attention. He finished the thought by saying """ even infamy is better than total obscurity """"
Telling words from the killer himself.
So then what happened after he did what he did? News media posted his picture, repeated his name, and read his words for hours on end, giving him the infamy he obviosly craved.
I think if you're a stable person, violence will not influence you to commit violent acts. .
The problem with your analysis, is that you are thinking about the situation on too small a scale. You are thinking about the effects of violence-as-entertainment in the individual sense, when you should be thinking about them in the collective sense. Sure, someone who grew up in an environment where viiolence is thought to be a bad thing, an abnormal thing, will not be swayed by watching a couple violent movies. BUT, when we grow up in an environment where things like violence and casual sex are viewed as entertainment as we do today, over time that effects how a generation percieve violence in the real world.
Movies and what is depicted in them are a big problem, yes, but they are by no means the ONLY problem. To say "well, I watch violent movies and I'm not violent" really isn't a good comparison. It's kind of like evolution. Specific curcumstances don't cause change to happen all at once. but continued exposure to those circumstances can change how we think about things after a long period of exposure. As the author of the article says, the more we are exposed to something, the more conditioned we become to accepting it as normal. An examination of how what humans consider moral has changed and differed throughout history is evident proof of what I'm saying here. The author of the article hit the nail on the head when she said these type of movies "condition" the human brain over time. It's not just the movies though. It's the human environment in general. Someone from 70 years ago { which was a very conservative time } would not all of a sudden be sex crazed if they saw on of the movies from this time period, in fact they would probably be outraged. BUT, as the boundaries were pushed and more people were exposed to it, the more accepting they became of it. You see how exposure to this type of stuff can change how we think about things in general?
If you ask me, I think it's time we as a people reject our primitive addictions to sex and violence as a form of entertainment.
Something you said the author said stuck with me. "The more we are exposed to something, the more conditioned we become to accepting it as normal." I know it's a little off topic but I am a metalhead and there is a great 11 one-hour episodic documentary called Metal Evolution done by Sam Dunn who did Metal: A Headbanger's Journey and one is on shock rock. One of the points brought up with it is how nobody bats an eye when things happen like they would when Alice Cooper would decapitate himself on stage or dancers would nearly have sex on stage during a Motley Crue show anymore because everything has been seen. You google search things and you can find just about anything including sex, execution, suicide, so nothing as a society phases us like it use to.
As for if we need to change the "addictions" to sex and violence, I honestly don't know. We are talking about TV-14, PG-13, R rated entertainment. I watched that kind of entertainment as a kid and I turned out fine, why because my parents knew when to say you shouldn't be watching this. I saw Animal House at age 15 WITH my parents. They knew I was mature enough to watch it. Most parents aren't and will just allow kids to play Grand Theft Auto. FYI, I had the FIRST GTA (very NES like even on Playstation if you ask me) because my brother was 16 at the time (I was just 13 then.) Was it inappropriate for me, perhaps but it was in NO WAY as bad as the later GTAs that would come out like Vice City, San Andreas and GTA V.
Something you said the author said stuck with me. "The more we are exposed to something, the more conditioned we become to accepting it as normal." I know it's a little off topic but I am a metalhead and there is a great 11 one-hour episodic documentary called Metal Evolution done by Sam Dunn who did Metal: A Headbanger's Journey and one is on shock rock. One of the points brought up with it is how nobody bats an eye when things happen like they would when Alice Cooper would decapitate himself on stage or dancers would nearly have sex on stage during a Motley Crue show anymore because everything has been seen. You google search things and you can find just about anything including sex, execution, suicide, so nothing as a society phases us like it use to.
Speaking of music..... take Elvis for example. The sexualised songs he sang and the movements he made on stage were often times considered very controversial. Today, no one would even bat an eye because they would be considered tame by todays standards. Compare him to someone like Beyonce, who is often very sexually provocative in her songs and music videos.... In Elvis' time someone like Beyonce would have sent the masses through the roof. Clear cut example of how pop culture changes the way we think about certain issues like sex and violence, and desensitizes us to more extreme depictions of it.
Quote:
As for if we need to change the "addictions" to sex and violence, I honestly don't know. We are talking about TV-14, PG-13, R rated entertainment. I watched that kind of entertainment as a kid and I turned out fine,
Except there is one big problem with your analysis here; the criteria for what gets rated PG13, TV14, or R changes. It isn't a static set of standards, and it changes and evolves according to what we as a society consider "acceptable" over time. Something that was rated R thirty years ago might be rated PG13 by todays standards of rating. Yet more proof of how more and more exposure to obscene material influences us as a society to be more socially accpeting of it as normal.
A new study from the Harvard School of Public Health has found that a decade of ''ratings creep'' has allowed more violent and sexually explicit content into films, suggesting that movie raters have grown more lenient in their standards
The study, which was issued on Tuesday, quantified what children's advocates and critics of the ratings system have said anecdotally for years: that a movie rated PG or PG-13 today has more sexual or violent content than a similarly rated movie in the past
''The M.P.A.A. appears to tolerate increasingly more extreme content in any given age-based rating category over time,''
But he and others pointed out that the standards for judging acceptable depictions of sex and violence in American society were constantly changing, and that it would not be surprising if that changed for movie ratings as well
The study of 1,906 feature films between 1992 and 2003 found more violence and sex in PG movies (''Parental guidance suggested'') and more of those elements and profanity in PG-13 movies (''Parents strongly cautioned''). It also found more sex and profanity in R-rated movies (''Under 17 requires accompanying parent or adult guardian'') than a decade ago
''When you look at the average, today's PG-13 movies are approaching what the R movies looked like in 1992,'' said Kimberly Thompson, associate professor of risk analysis and decision science at Harvard's School of Public Health, who was a co-author of the study. ''Today's PG is approaching what PG-13 looked like a decade ago.''
I'd suggest reading the entire article, but these snippets convey the gist of it.....
Quote:
Was it inappropriate for me, perhaps but it was in NO WAY as bad as the later GTAs that would come out like Vice City, San Andreas and GTA V.
Exactly..... With each release, the enveloope was pushed further and further, and each one got worse and worse. GTA isn't fit for any decent person to play imo { and yes, I've played it and now my younger broother plays it constantly so I know what I'm talking about }
The fact that we can not seperate ourselves from what we consider entertainment is an undeniable fact.
Last edited by WhipperSnapper 88; 06-01-2014 at 03:26 PM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
