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I guess like many others have pointed out, a possible motivation to keep it illegal is partly financial but also to prevent loved ones and friends from experiencing a lot of grief. I still think it should be completely up to to the individual, but then there are also the mentally ill and the prospect of making a big mistake to factor in. Still, I find it strange that it actually could even be a law in most places under rights/charters that exist.
After they are dead, why would anyone who committed suicide care what other people think or whether or not it's legal? They're dead. I just think people shouldn't suck anyone else into their suicide decisions. In other words, it's the "assisted" part that troubles me in those type of deaths.
Finally, for what it's worth, committing suicide in this country is perfectly legal for an adult. File a formal do-not-resuscitate order, down a bottle of pills, then call 911 and inform them of the pills and order (also print out a copy of the order so the first responder will find it). You will die, and there is nothing they can do about it.
Although the laws differ from state to state, there is usually no formal "filing" of a DNR order. The order is simply presented to healthcare providers. Most states do not require EMS workers to honor a DNR order, although in many states they are allowed to. Also, DNR orders are only valid in cases of cardiac or respiratory arrest. If you took pills and are not yet in respiratory or cardiac arrest, the DNR order does not mean that EMS is going to let you lay there and die. They will take the same steps that they would take in the case of any other overdose, such as stomach pumping or the administration of opiate antagonists in the case of narcotic overdose. Furthermore, considering that there is a potential that the DNR order was signed by a person who has a questionable mental state (since attempted suicide was involved), it's likely that it would be completely ignored even while at the hospital and the patient would be involuntarily committed for mental health evaluation and treatment.
In Florida, the situation that you described would result in any responding law enforcement officer initiating a Baker Act on the person, which places them in protective custody. At that point they no longer have a say in their treatment until a psychiatrist evaluates them and determines that they do not have a mental illness that makes them a danger to themselves. The DNR order would be ignored by everyone.
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Originally Posted by micC
No doubt that it is trouble to the government when someone commits suicide, but death in general is inconvenient for the government (although necessary).
Yes, there's a burden on the government for all types of deaths. Any undetermined or unattended death (suicide or not) is going to be investigated no matter what the circumstances are. That's just the beginning though, and really doesn't represent the entirety of what the government has to do when people die. Coroners, medical examiners, court clerks, and probate courts all handle matters relating to all types of death no matter the circumstances. So honestly, suicide doesn't really put that much more burden on the government than most other types of death.
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Originally Posted by Jesse44
I guess like many others have pointed out, a possible motivation to keep it illegal is partly financial but also to prevent loved ones and friends from experiencing a lot of grief. I still think it should be completely up to to the individual, but then there are also the mentally ill and the prospect of making a big mistake to factor in.
I don't really have an issue with the idea of suicide or even physician assisted suicide for the terminally ill. That's a different situation than the person who just doesn't want to live anymore. Many times that desire arises from a perfectly treatable mental illness.
I imagine that most of the people here who are advocating suicide for everyone have never personally had to deal with the repercussions of suicide. I have seen a teenager try to commit suicide because her boyfriend broke up with her. Should she have been allowed to die because that's what she wanted? In a high profile case in my area earlier this year, a teenager jumped to her death because she was being bullied at school. When I was a detective, I had to deal with the families of countless people who committed suicide. Many of these family members ended up slipping into depression themselves, blaming themselves for the suicide or trying to convince themselves that if they had done something differently, the person would still be alive. I remember one case in particular when a man was caught embezzling money from his employer. His wife at the time had stopped working to care for their toddler. She blamed herself for the family's financial problems, her husband's criminal conduct, and his subsequent suicide. I'm sure she still blames herself to this day, and now she's raising a child alone.
Then there's also the shock of being the person to find a loved one dead. That image and the associated thoughts of having to live with the suicide of a family member is something that will stay with them the rest of their lives. They will go through the rest of their lives thinking "what if…"
If there's any environment where suicide shouldn't be prevented is in our suicide-proof Super-Max prisons and in Guantanamo! And, what a big chunk of change it would save our taxpayers!
In our Super-Max prisons, with those hooks to hang your clothes on, they're designed to break with 25-30 pounds of pressure, making it almost impossible to even hang yourself in these places.
More than likely, with the plunging fertility rates in the world, along with job security, they're going to make it even more difficult to take your own life.
I work in a LTC-Rehab facility, and all you have to say in one of these places is: I wish I could die! I wish I was dead! and? You're Legal 2000'd to a Psych ward, even if you're 85 years old, terminally ill, with no future at stake.
I had a patient, recently, from a foreign country, no family up here, who told the psychiatrist: If I can't return to my home country, I want to die! And? Off to the Psych ward she went! She must have put up quite a struggle, as when she returned her wrists and ankles were bruised! Obviously, they had to tie her to the bed! That's wrong, wrong, wrong, inhuman and cruel!
I've thought for several years now that I would take my own life on a schedule. Socially responsible suicide ceremony. I think we should embrace death, meet it head on, grab it by the balls. Instead of it finding us with a cancerous, confused, agonizing, drawn-out whimper, we should face it resolutely, confidently, and at the time and in the manner of our designation.
Recently I started to think a little more intently about this as part of a life and retirement planning initiative. When do I want to retire, how much money do I want to have available, what do I want to do, when do I want to draw my life to a close? With potentially no burdensome wife or children, I could pretty well plan out my retirement from beginning to end.
I think the difference here is I'm looking at retirement as a defined, finite period, with not just a beginning but an end. It's ingrained and established that we are to attempt to live as long as possible. To what end? Death, of course. But how can one financially, emotionally, and physically plan for retirement based on an indefinite period of time that may vary in length by as much as a couple of decades?
I find it far more meaningful to clearly define life's boundaries ahead of time, rather than succumb slowly to dwindling resources, health, and mental faculties, becoming slightly less than human and a significant burden in the process. Imagine a live funeral, with friends and family gathered to celebrate life before passing on.
I also believe we need an overall paradigm shift in how we as a society approach old age and death. In fact I think it's a big part of one of the few viable scenarios that doesn't lead to the collapse of the United States. In the decades ahead, as we move inevitably toward single payer healthcare, as medical science learns how to artificially extend life even more, as we face dwindling / costly energy resources, and as our demographics shift even further toward the elderly, it will become apparent that we have no choice but to approach death and aging in a very different way than what has been the norm in Western society.
I haven't yet determined the specifics – the how and when – and I suspect they will change a few times. But what WILL NOT change is my desire and will to DEFINE the how and when. And I suspect I won’t be the only one pursuing this line of thinking.
Last edited by Oldhag1; 08-12-2014 at 01:46 PM..
Reason: Removed copyrighted material
I use to frown upon suicide til 10 years later I tried to commit suicide I was very close to death I was told it wasn't my time, people think that suicides burn in hell. Well their wrong. They believe God has favorites so not true.
There is no god and the Bible is trash, written by old men before any advancement of science. It's apparent they were on drugs, hallucinating, and hearing voices.
If there was a god he deseves disdain for gross incompetence. Just boggles my mind why so many have fallen for that lie.
Your body is yours but as someone mentioned the government does have a part in it.
I can't do suicide due to the few people that care about me. But if that's what one wants...
Completely understand why, especially when it comes to people living in extreme pain.
Several months ago my best friend tried to commit suicide. After he swallowed pills that was supposed to do the trick he had second thoughts and called 911.
Howard Storm didn't believe in a God either until he nearly died
In the US, the government does own us. We generate money and work 'for' them. They have a speculated $ amount attached to us based on the average life-span. They want to keep us alive.
While many reasons for suicide are just an 'easy way out', there are just as many that are valid or could be seen as honorable. What ever reason, right or wrong in the perspective of an individual, I am one who stands by having personal liberties. If someone feels the need to end thier life, that should be their decision.
What a strange post. Since you feel the government owns us, it naturally follows that you would also think the person doesn't have the right to end his her life, since the government should be the one to make that decision, not the individual. I believe a person has the right to commit suicide whether he/she is terminally ill or not. After all, it's his/her own life, and the most important thing that the person owns, unless the person is legally a minor. However, if the person's loved ones detect depression or other signs of mental illness, they should intervene and try to stop the person from doing that, since life is precious and worth saving.
I am not 100% on this, but I have a close friend whose grandfather committed suicide and they had a lot of financial problems after that because his insurance would not pay since he chose to die.
I think we all own our own lives and I could certainly understand someone who found out they have a terminal illness that will involve a slow and painful death wanting to end their lives. I would be supportive of assisted suicide in those situations. However, should we have a facility where anyone can walk in and say they want to die and be able to do so? I don't think so. I can't imagine any rational mentally healthy person choosing to die especially if they are under 50.
Although I wouldn't support that, I try not to be judgmental. It must be a horrible mental place to be in that you can't see any way your life will ever get better or be worth living again. Most of the people that I know of who committed suicide were people no one would have expected. People who were good looking, had money, lots of friends, wonderful significant others. You really never know what someone else is going through on the inside. They are free to make that decision, but I wouldn't support making it easy for them.
What a strange post. Since you feel the government owns us, it naturally follows that you would also think the person doesn't have the right to end his her life, since the government should be the one to make that decision, not the individual. I believe a person has the right to commit suicide whether he/she is terminally ill or not. After all, it's his/her own life, and the most important thing that the person owns, unless the person is legally a minor. However, if the person's loved ones detect depression or other signs of mental illness, they should intervene and try to stop the person from doing that, since life is precious and worth saving.
I think that what this poster is conveying (and with which I agree) is that we do not have the legal right to commit suicide, and therefore we are government property.
I believe that the human body should not be government property and we should have the right to commit suicide. However, the deplorable fact of the matter is that we DO NOT have such a right, and therefore cannot be said to own our life.
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