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Take it from someone from the generation just before yours: there will always be people who are looking for reasons to be offended, or to feel demeaned. They will always find those, because they seek very diligently. I experienced this as early as the 1980s. The struggle of maintaining good manners is in part the struggle to continue to maintain them in spite of insecure churls for whom every casual interaction is a skirmish in a greater war.
And I'll continue to be polite, much to the chagrin of the easily-offended. If someone offering a seat or holding a door open is an insult, I truly feel bad for that person. That person lives a horrible, miserable life with little enjoyment. I can always look at them and know that I am nowhere near as miserable as they are. That knowledge makes me happy; that despite my problems, I'm not that screwed up.
I also find your comment about a skirmish in a greater war to be extremely accurate. I just have to ask, what war is it being fought?
Let us ponder this inequality thing for a moment. Men are expected to go down with a ship, give up 3 months salary for an engagement ring, buy expensive things for Valentine's/Christmas/Birthdays/Mother's Day/etc., mow the grass, fix stuff around the house, defend a woman's honor, be a protector, and so on. I don't think I would say women are unequal so much as the preferred sex.
If a man is chivalrous, he's a womanizer. If he's not, he's an ass. We just can't win.
So many men here seem positively gleeful in their not offering a seat!
I don't recall ever getting a seat offered but I've never been pregnant, obviously disabled, or old enough to qualify...and that's fine by me. But if a man, woman, anyone was obviously in need I would get up - and NOT lord it over them like I'd done them the greatest favor - just to allow them the CHOICE of taking the seat or not.
The point is to be considerate and gracious - both in the offer and the acceptance of it. Nowadays people are more often just looking for any excuse to look out only for #1 - I guess the '80's never ended for them!
And I'll continue to be polite, much to the chagrin of the easily-offended. If someone offering a seat or holding a door open is an insult, I truly feel bad for that person. That person lives a horrible, miserable life with little enjoyment. I can always look at them and know that I am nowhere near as miserable as they are. That knowledge makes me happy; that despite my problems, I'm not that screwed up.
I also find your comment about a skirmish in a greater war to be extremely accurate. I just have to ask, what war is it being fought?
Let us ponder this inequality thing for a moment. Men are expected to go down with a ship, give up 3 months salary for an engagement ring, buy expensive things for Valentine's/Christmas/Birthdays/Mother's Day/etc., mow the grass, fix stuff around the house, defend a woman's honor, be a protector, and so on. I don't think I would say women are unequal so much as the preferred sex.
If a man is chivalrous, he's a womanizer. If he's not, he's an ass. We just can't win.
Yes, a great excuse to just throw up your hands and be a jerk - glad you were able to find a way to justify your rudeness, not just to women but to anyone who might benefit from a small gesture.
...I offer my seat to older women or women with small children. Younger women find that patronizing. If I even address a woman as "ma'am" (like I was raised to) they are offended.
I too was raised this way and it's caused considerable questions in the workplace. Heck I even say "ma'am" and "sir" to the kids behind the counter at Wendy's.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigfoot424
I'm old enough and learned many years ago to offer seats, hold doors open and so on to women. But one thing I really notice now is that women rarely thank you for holding the door open for them anymore. I've taken to saying "you're welcome" loud enough for them to hear. Sometimes they look back like I had 2 heads on my shoulders.
After having had my head handed to me a couple of times, I almost never open a door for women. I've even had women carrying boxes scream at me that holding the door for them was insulting. "No ma'am, just figured you couldn't reach the handle since your hands were full. Here, I'll shut it for you." (Satisfying clatter of boxes hitting the floor as she tried to balance them in one hand and open the door with the other.)
So here's the deal----not giving my seat up for NOOOOOOBODY. Why: 1-I like to relax and be off of my feet just as much as the next person, 2: I truly believe the elderly and those disabled really should have made other arrangements. Why are you on a bus or train with no legs, orrrr....on your last legs. Most areas have special buses or services to accomodate these groups of people if they actually did a some research.
As far as those who are pregnant: well, I ask, why are you taking public transportation??? Most pregnant women I see are in a car driving or being driven, or they were foolish and got knocked up by a bum ass dude that left them, has no car or cab money for them to get around. I'm not being inconvenienced for someone else's reckless mistakes.
And if for whatever reason I'm taking public transportation and these people insist on standing over me..I just close my eyes.
Last edited by jacktravern; 04-16-2015 at 05:22 PM..
Reason: Spelling
I think I agree with the majority opinion. Men should give up their seats for men and women who really need them. These categories include elderly people of all genders, men and women with infants/, pregnant women and any other passengers with obvious health issues. Other than that, women under sixty are perfectly capable of standing. We have equality of genders in this country and women live longer than men. Now if womend can only pay 50% on dates, that would be great...
I do hold the door for women and sometimes men at work who are carrying something and can not easily open the door. So far, I have only been briefly but politely thanked...
And I would not give up my seat to an obese person. Thier health issue is a matter of their choice...
In earlier times, men riding on crowded buses, trains, etc. were expected to give up their seats to ladies. A man who was seated while ladies were standing would be considered ill-mannered and not a proper gentlemen. And I would imagine that a woman who refused the offer would be considered brash and not a proper lady.
But social norms change, and certainly gender roles in the U.S. have undergone significant changes in recent times. So now we have the situation where some men will remain seated, unashamed, while the women standing over them glower at them in sullen annoyance. Meanwhile, elsewhere on the vehicle, a man will rise to offer his seat, only to find that the woman standing nearby refuses to take it.
So what do you feel is the proper etiquette? I'm not talking about offering seats to the elderly, or handicapped, or pregnant women, or someone burdened with packages. What I'm asking is, should an able-bodied, unencumbered man offer his seat to an able-bodied, unencumbered woman? And if so, should she take it?
Always! Unfortunately men are no longer taught chivalry!
Moms are too busy to teach proper manners these days!
I also find your comment about a skirmish in a greater war to be extremely accurate. I just have to ask, what war is it being fought?
It's each individual's war as defined by that person, so it varies. Some people fight their individual wars over bike safety, some over Christmas, some over junk mail. I can't speak to the justice of any/all those wars, but I know none of them can ever be won by the combatant, so it comes down to fighting the war because an armistice is beyond that person's ability to tolerate. I've known people who laid ambushes in their wars against restaurant service they deemed insufficiently fawning and deferential.
In the end, we all decide what to fight about--or not.
I think for whatever reason, I don't trigger the gender courtesy red telephone because I'm so utterly and happily married that I don't give off a vibe of desiring any other female. Not that you do; just that I seem to radiate something that says there's nothing else there, based on what I'm told.
I give up my seat to all the women. Except the hotties they have to sit on my lap
Actually, pregant, older women and women with young kids I always do and they appreciate it
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