Couples that do not want children. Are they doing the right thing? (dollars, abuse)
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I don't think is ok for population to become extinct, but it had happened in the past, so as expected it will happen again.
If the Germans disappear because they don't reproduce, well... Nothing really we can do about since I assume they are well aware of this but do to X or Y reasons don't feel like making babies. Myself I have so many issues that even if I'd the means, I won't be bringing anymore kids to this uncertain world.
I don't think is ok for population to become extinct, but it had happened in the past, so as expected it will happen again.
If the Germans disappear because they don't reproduce, well... Nothing really we can do about since I assume they are well aware of this but do to X or Y reasons don't feel like making babies. Myself I have so many issues that even if I'd the means, I won't be bringing anymore kids to this uncertain world.
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Stunning as it may seem, a steep decline in the German population since 1972 and fears the trend will gain pace have led demographers to warn of unsettling consequences.
The number of Germans has declined by 3.2 million — the population of Berlin — over the last 30 years but demographers’ concerns have mostly been ignored until now in a country scarred by the Nazis’ nefarious procreation pressures.
German leaders have now lifted the birth rate to the top of the political agenda for the first time since the Nazi era, and the two ruling parties are trying to outdo each other with pro-family measures.
“Germans are at risk of dying out if the trend continues,” said Harald Michel, managing director of the Institute for Applied Demography. He fears the German population could shrink from 75 million to 50 million by 2050 and further after that.
“The birth rates have been below the replacement rate for 35 years — a lethal development,” he added. “Germans could become an ‘endangered people.’ It’s hypothetical now but we may have to think about ‘the last German’ at some point. The problem is compounded each generation. Children not born 30 years ago obviously aren’t there to have children now.”
Imagine a country that knows it is shrinking. A country that knows it is ageing more rapidly than any other major industrialised nation on earth. Which has the highest proportion in the world of people over the age of 65, and the lowest ratio of under 15s. That country is Japan.
As I reported on Wednesday, on current trends, the population of Japan will have halved by the end of the century.
I don't think anyone should feel obligated to have children for the sake of society.
You are correct, but there is a butterfly effect. If most couples decide to go childless over time the population becomes smaller and older. It has been said that within 200 years Europe will be Islamic and the remaining small number of European women may have to cover the head whether they like it or not.
Those that do not reproduce will become extinct. And that includes their way of life, culture, or their own history. The the south of Spain was Islamized Christian Churches were converted into Mosques.
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The world has too many people in it, especially in terms off environmental degradation and resource depletion. So I say a few generations of one child per woman per lifetime might get the population down to sustainable levels. Whatever short run pain would occur due to this is compensated for by a chance for the planet to return to reasonable sustainability.
On top of this is the fact that, in short, I disagree too strongly with too much of prevailing human behavior and attitudes to find it reasonable to bring a child into this kind of world, environmental problems or not. Human selfishness and indifference toward the well-being of others simply runs so deeply in our psyches that we can't come even close to reducing it to an acceptable level. Sure, we can probably do somewhat more to reduce our bad or indifferent tendencies toward others, but not reduce it to an acceptable level. So if humans are going to continue to behave in their current ways, they're just gonna have to do so without my sperm contribution.
The world has too many people in it, especially in terms off environmental degradation and resource depletion. So I say a few generations of one child per woman per lifetime might get the population down to sustainable levels. Whatever short run pain would occur due to this is compensated for by a chance for the planet to return to reasonable sustainability.
On top of this is the fact that, in short, I disagree too strongly with too much of prevailing human behavior and attitudes to find it reasonable to bring a child into this kind of world, environmental problems or not. Human selfishness and indifference toward the well-being of others simply runs so deeply in our psyches that we can't come even close to reducing it to an acceptable level. Sure, we can probably do somewhat more to reduce our bad or indifferent tendencies toward others, but not reduce it to an acceptable level. So if humans are going to continue to behave in their current ways, they're just gonna have to do so without my sperm contribution.
The issue is that those that decided to avoid children come from developed parts of the world where children are scarce. OTOH, those that decide to have many children come from the 3rd world where children are abundant.
I can see the ideal of having generations where the population is predominantly OLD and not-productive to reach another steady state, but we have been doing this in the developed world for a long time. Europe and Japan are predicted to disappear from the face of the Earth due to low reproduction.
The ones that need to reduce having kids continue to have kids and those that should have a kid or two are childless.
BTW, most of the world has been reducing the rate of birth (other than Sub Sahara Africa).
You are correct, but there is a butterfly effect. If most couples decide to go childless over time the population becomes smaller and older. It has been said that within 200 years Europe will be Islamic and the remaining small number of European women may have to cover the head whether they like it or not.
Those that do not reproduce will become extinct. And that includes their way of life, culture, or their own history. The the south of Spain was Islamized Christian Churches were converted into Mosques.
But that's the issue with your hypothesis. Most couples will not go childless. For all of the focus on the couples that aren't having kids many still are.
It is simple evolution 101. Those that do not leave DNA behind will become extinct. In the not so distant future Europeans will only be seen in natural history museums as wax figures. Don't call me racist, this is just a statement with no agenda.
BTW, the birth rate has been declining all over the world. The only exception is sub-Sahara Africa.
So really, you aren't concerned with HUMANS becoming extinct, you are concerned with Europeans, or maybe white Americans becoming extinct. If that isn't racist, I don't know what it.
And still, even if the world population decreases, that is not a bad thing.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658
Nevertheless, I don't allow my personal bias to color my opinion and I admire several friends that elected to be childless. HOwever, I know of at least one couple that have stated they made a mistake by going childless. They are now older and basically have no family.
I'll see your anecdote and raise you one. I know at least 3 couple who regret their choice to have kids. Not because their kids are terrible or seem like they will be a drain on society...they just regret it for their own reasons.
Europe is a dying continent. I say this not as a criticism, but rather as a statement of fact. In Europe, an acute failure to produce the next generation has created a looming demographic crisis.
This has nothing to do with racism, it is just a fact.
No, it is not a fact. EUROPE is not a dying CONTINENT. White EUROPEANS are a dying species.
Why are you so fixated on the population that you most admire/identify with/envy/etc. continuing at the same percentages as today? As more europeans interbreed with other races/mixed backgrounds there will be no such thing as a "white european" in the future anyway.
This seems to have moved beyond "we need smart people to take care of all the dumbies" (and yes, I meant that as dumb-bees) and into the realm of "all the white people are being outnumbered!!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by Julian658
The extinction of any group is always a sad story and this includes animals and many other groups that disappeared from the face of the Earth. The fact that the Neanderthal and Tasmanians disappeared is a sad event.
As for Europe it is important in those of us who grew up with Western values. I used them as example because they have extremely low fertility rates and are destined to disappeared from the face of the planet. It is what it is.
We aren't different species. Africans, europeans, american, indians...all are homo sapiens. It isn't quite the same as when a particular species of bird dies out.
...And you still don't seem to have an answer for how to stop the "undesirables" from reproducing. Is this supposed to just be a race to see who can produce more? To what end? So we kill off EVERYONE faster?
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