Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Excellent example of the compromises needed for a marriage to work. The wife wants a cleaner house, the husband wants to be intimate more often. Both halves of the relationship must compromise in order for it to work. In a relationship where both spouses work equally, this means the husband must take responsibility for half of the cleaning (not just "help out"; take full responsibility), and the wife should respond to her husband's advances, sometimes even if she isn't "in the mood".
The wife is obviously doing it all and too damn tired while DH is taking a nap or relaxing right after work
It also comes back to bite women in the butt when it comes to retirement as well. SS counts 35 years of highest earning quarter year periods to determine SS benefits. If you don't have 140 quarters of work, then they count 0s. If you work part-time, they count those quarters. A woman who takes off 5 or 10 years to have/raise her children has lots of 0s to make up when she does go back to work ... and even if she had a career before her time off, she's likely going to re-start that career at a significantly lower salary than she would have if she stayed, so that all plays into pension/retirement savings calculations as well. Of course, when both parents are working FT, child care expenses can seriously cut into the amount of money they can put away for the future. It's really a darned if you do, darned if you don't scenario for most women since most husbands aren't earning six figure salaries with cushy pensions and stock options and lots of other creature comforts.
This is happening to woman of the 50's. Hillary mentioned how this group of women are in poverty in an earlier debate. A lot of women who take time off to raise the family are going to have the same problem.
But in the case where the wife has a full time job too?
Let me emphasize again: We're discussing two scenarios. One, where one spouse works (traditionally the male) while the other spouse stays home to keep house, raise kids, etc (traditionally the female). I addressed both scenarios, but you only quoted one. In the case where both spouses have full times jobs then both spouses are equally responsible for keeping house, child raising, etc. Situations where the male sits back and "allows" the female to do most of the work are inherently unfair and unjust.
Quote:
Originally Posted by reneeh63
Oh, because a lot of what women buy isn't "for the house"? For the mutual benefit of the entire family? As in groceries, housewares, school supplies and clothes for the kids, etc? Women just loooooooove going out and spending "someone else's" money on grub for the family...
Again, we're switching back scenario where only one spouse is working outside the home. Seriously? Of course money spent on groceries, housewares, schools supplies would not be considered the in-house spouse's "pay". What kind of world do you live in where you would even consider such a thing? Is that really what you think of men? Either you have some really ***hole males in your life or something else is really wrong.
The "pay" in this scenario would be half ownership of all possessions (house, vehicles, furniture, etc.), half of retirement funds, half of any discretionary income, etc. Plus, the home spouse gets free rent, utilities, car, cell phone, etc.
Think of is as a symbiotic relationship. Spouse A (typically male, but not always) works outside the home to bring money into the household. Spouse B (typically female, but not always) works inside the home. Note that both spouses are working in this relationship. Spouse B does not bring money directly into the home, but does bring money in indirectly. By doing the housework and running errands allowing the Spouse A to work longer hours and earn more money, and by keeping the kids instead of spending money on daycare.
A friend is in this exact situation. He is an engineer with a decent salary. She is a full-time stay-at-home mom. They have five kids. Daycare would kill them if she worked full-time, so she stays at home. Does she work? You better believe she does. Does she earn a salary? Of course not. But by default and by law she "earns" half of everything her husband earns.
Last edited by An Einnseanair; 02-29-2016 at 03:07 PM..
A friend is in this exact situation. He is an engineer with a decent salary. She is a full-time stay-at-home mom. They have five kids. Daycare would kill them if she worked full-time, so she stays at home. Does she work? You better believe she does. Does she earn a salary? Of course not. But by default and by law she "earns" half of everything her husband earns.
I agree completely with this.
I also just want to make the observation that there are often still women willing to step in and take on a lot of the grunt work of housekeeping even when there are no children. I would bet that this is far less of a problem among Millennials. But with older generations--even with a lot of Gen Xers I've known--it's not uncommon.
I've also seen a divorced Dad lucky enough to get a girlfriend who's willing to run endless errands for him. Including chauffeuring his child around when it's more convenient for him. They're just dating, not even living together. Hey, if it works for them and everyone's happy, then so be it. Lots of women seem to feel more useful and fulfilled when they're doing these things for their guy.
I think there was a study out not long ago, that showed that couples that share housework have happier sex lives. Just saying...
But it turns out, using more recent data from 2006, couples who split the housework fairly are the happiest between the sheets. They have the most sex, are the most satisfied with their sex lives, and express the highest level of sexual intimacy.
But it turns out, using more recent data from 2006, couples who split the housework fairly are the happiest between the sheets. They have the most sex, are the most satisfied with their sex lives, and express the highest level of sexual intimacy.
A lot of millennial woman may not have as big a problem like the boomer or the Jones generation did. Men in those era's were born when woman stayed home. I'll never forget the commercial..
I can bring home the bacon,
Fry it up in a pan,
And never, never, never let you forget your a man because I am woman.
That commercial said I can go to work, come home and do it all. With one leg stuck in the old days and one in the new, women too who did try to do it all. A lot of men were not about to give that up.
I've noticed that my neighbor in her 40's, her daughter help around the house, the son is given a pass and can come up with the craziest excuses when he is asked to help. Wait till he gets married, I hope he finds himself a superwoman or girl that doesn't want to work.
Generally (mind that I am not talking about any extremes) and statistically, women are still pulling more weight around the house than men.
Here is a recent survey data: American Time Use Survey: Charts by Topic: Household activities
A study by sociologist Chloe E. Bird published in the Journal of Health and Social Behavior also found that women who do twice as much housework as their spouses have greater anxiety, depression, and worry.
However things are improving:
American men in dual-income families handle 30% of shopping and meal preparation, and do roughly 20% of household chores like laundry and cleaning. Although that may not entitle them to bragging rights, it's an improvement over the measly 2-5% men did back in 1970.
When you combine the amount of time spent working in and outside the home, all things are equal - women work more in the home and less outside it, while the opposite is true for men.
According to several studies, men with a higher education are more likely to pick up and pitch in. They most likely put women on equal footing and assume a balanced role in the household.
Still, around the house men generally do less. There is a range of explanations on the chore front – from cultural expectations about gender roles, to a greater emphasis on a man's career if he's the primary breadwinner, and some women's difficulty delegating work.
Often men's resistance to housework may start in childhood - they never experienced father helping the mother, they never were asked to do any household chores. So, while some men feign incompetence, some genuinely have never learned how to do housework.
Not to forget that many men are just afraid to pitch in, because their wives are never happy what they do and rather do every task themselves, than live with his less than perfect housekeeping skills.
Often men's resistance to housework may start in childhood - they never experienced father helping the mother, they never were asked to do any household chores. So, while some men feign incompetence, some genuinely have never learned how to do housework.
Not to forget that many men are just afraid to pitch in, because their wives are never happy what they do and rather do every task themselves, than live with his less than perfect housekeeping skills.
When we married I worked full time and so did he. I learned very quickly that even though I worked full time and brought in good money (same as him) he had no intention of doing work around the house. I asked, then asked, then asked more, then became very angry, I was exhausted all the time. We didn't fight over money, we fought over house cleaning. I should have told him that I won't be bringing home a paycheck anymore.
Finally we got someone to come in twice a month and we both pitch in. I still do more than him but I'm ok now, I don't keep record and both of us doing things around the house makes a big difference. He says that a housecleaner saved our marriage.
I don't have perfect housekeeping skills, never will, housework is a bore, tedious, time consuming and never goes away. I don't expect him to either. We keep it under control which is actually pretty clean and the cleaning lady does the heavy stuff.
This epitomizes the thought process of some women.
That's funny, how much you just generalized. I know plenty of men who split child duties with the wife. I help my wife clean and we clean the house together (we have no kids). So why make such sweeping generalizations? I guess choose your partner wisely.
Actually, there are studies to back her statements up.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
