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I am referred to as a "conservative." Isn't that an epithet?
Depends on the context and the intent. Otherwise, being called either a conservative or a liberal is not something to be particularly bothered by. If it does bother you, just tell the person that they are mistaken.
I think cancel culture is an outgrowth of
1: today's electronic instant communication makes everything (good & Bad) easier, and
2: political oppo research. When TV and interwebz are flooded with negative ads by people seeking to be our leaders, "we" adopt their practices, of appealing to "our" basest instincts.
Please Cancel Me! I Cancel Myself!
GWU Prof Outs Herself, and Says She Should Be Canceled
Yes, confederate everything should be canceled. You lost the damn war, get over it. Aren't they the ones always telling black people to get over slavery because it was soooooo long ago but continue to hold on to something that had a shorter lifespan that my emo years.
Someone on this this post brought up Jimmy Fallon, he's not cancelled. A lot of people came to his defense and most people know he's not a racist. While black face is inherently racist (JF was not intentionally malicious, nor was Robert Downey Jr. or even Justin Trudeau), I do believe that people should not look at the past with the same judgment as today's society. I think most people see by people's actions today and what they continue to stand by, and determine if past actions were racist. If you presented yourself in black face in the past and continue to have racist antics in the present, then yeah, you're likely a racist and I, and everyone else who is anti-racism should have every right to cease communication with you, and to not patronize your business, if you have one. There are consequences to our actions. We have freedom of speech but not freedom from consequences of that speech. If your speech is oppressive to others, then maybe you should keep it to yourself and take a good look in the mirror and try to figure out why you have so much hate in your heart.
Another poster brought up JK Rowling. I used to LOVE JK, I'm and avid Harry Potter fan and have read most things she wrote. While she's entitled to her opinion, her statements on the trans community are hurtful to that community. As an ally, I stand by them, if they tell me it hurt or that she invalidated them, I believe them. She could have apologized, or not said anything at all and let it die down but she continues to double down on it. No one is wishing for her or her family any ill will or death, people are just hitting her in her bank account. They aren't spending money with her.
I don't condone death threats but boycotting someone's business because that person is bigoted, is fine. Treat others how you want to be treated and maybe people would not be boycotting your business or people wouldn't be losing their jobs for being racist, homophobic or transphobic.
Conservatives love to call out cancel culture but they are the Kings and Queens of cancelling/boycotting things. Do you remember when the were going to boycott Starbucks because they changed their holiday cups and they didn't say Merry Christmas anymore?
Another poster mentioned that people are intolerant to Christians. I personally haven't seen that. I've seen most so called Christians call most muslim people terrorists, or make Jewish jokes, or be extremely racist. Now, of course, not all Christians are like that, most are not. Most actually follow the teachings of Christ and love thy neighbors, however plenty do, so why shouldn't they be called out for their bigoted behavior?
Again, everything requires context. I will ask someone to explain to me, why they feel that way about someone. Most cannot give me a coherent answer. I have friends from all walks of life, white friends, black friends, brown friends, POCs from all sorts of places; friends with varying religions and some like me, not religious at all, straight friends and friends from the LGBTQ+ community. I try to listen to how all of them feel. If a minority group tells me something is hurtful to them, I listen and I adjust the way I speak. It is not my job to question whether or not something is hurtful, it is my job to listen, learn and grow from it. It is also not their job to educate me. We should all seek resources to educate ourselves on what is hurtful to others.
Back to the topic at hand of cancel culture. Cancel culture has always existed in some form or another, it is just that with social media, the information moves faster.
We can agree to disagree on what toppings to put on a taco or if pineapples should go on a pizza but not on racism, sexism, xenophobia, homophobia and transphobia. Treat everyone with kindness and the world will be a better place.
Yes, confederate everything should be canceled. You lost the damn war, get over it. Aren't they the ones always telling black people to get over slavery because it was soooooo long ago but continue to hold on to something that had a shorter lifespan that my emo years.
Someone on this this post brought up Jimmy Fallon, he's not cancelled. A lot of people came to his defense and most people know he's not a racist. While black face is inherently racist (JF was not intentionally malicious, nor was Robert Downey Jr. or even Justin Trudeau), I do believe that people should not look at the past with the same judgment as today's society. I think most people see by people's actions today and what they continue to stand by, and determine if past actions were racist. If you presented yourself in black face in the past and continue to have racist antics in the present, then yeah, you're likely a racist and I, and everyone else who is anti-racism should have every right to cease communication with you, and to not patronize your business, if you have one. There are consequences to our actions. We have freedom of speech but not freedom from consequences of that speech. If your speech is oppressive to others, then maybe you should keep it to yourself and take a good look in the mirror and try to figure out why you have so much hate in your heart.
Another poster brought up JK Rowling. I used to LOVE JK, I'm and avid Harry Potter fan and have read most things she wrote. While she's entitled to her opinion, her statements on the trans community are hurtful to that community. As an ally, I stand by them, if they tell me it hurt or that she invalidated them, I believe them. She could have apologized, or not said anything at all and let it die down but she continues to double down on it. No one is wishing for her or her family any ill will or death, people are just hitting her in her bank account. They aren't spending money with her.
I don't condone death threats but boycotting someone's business because that person is bigoted, is fine. Treat others how you want to be treated and maybe people would not be boycotting your business or people wouldn't be losing their jobs for being racist, homophobic or transphobic.
Conservatives love to call out cancel culture but they are the Kings and Queens of cancelling/boycotting things. Do you remember when the were going to boycott Starbucks because they changed their holiday cups and they didn't say Merry Christmas anymore?
Another poster mentioned that people are intolerant to Christians. I personally haven't seen that. I've seen most so called Christians call most muslim people terrorists, or make Jewish jokes, or be extremely racist. Now, of course, not all Christians are like that, most are not. Most actually follow the teachings of Christ and love thy neighbors, however plenty do, so why shouldn't they be called out for their bigoted behavior?
Again, everything requires context. I will ask someone to explain to me, why they feel that way about someone. Most cannot give me a coherent answer. I have friends from all walks of life, white friends, black friends, brown friends, POCs from all sorts of places; friends with varying religions and some like me, not religious at all, straight friends and friends from the LGBTQ+ community. I try to listen to how all of them feel. If a minority group tells me something is hurtful to them, I listen and I adjust the way I speak. It is not my job to question whether or not something is hurtful, it is my job to listen, learn and grow from it. It is also not their job to educate me. We should all seek resources to educate ourselves on what is hurtful to others.
Back to the topic at hand of cancel culture. Cancel culture has always existed in some form or another, it is just that with social media, the information moves faster.
We can agree to disagree on what toppings to put on a taco or if pineapples should go on a pizza but not on racism, sexism, xenophobia, homophobia and transphobia. Treat everyone with kindness and the world will be a better place.
Agree!
Actually what you said here about JK Rowling reminds me of something. In my capacity as volunteer for the adult alt-lifestyle club where (pre Covid) I was involved, I was part of a committee to investigate and weigh in on reports of consent violation. What we found, was that a HUGE, very significant factor was how someone responded when asked about the allegation.
If at all possible, we want to foster growth and understanding. We're actually forgiving of a person's humanity and possible errors in judgment or action. But they have to demonstrate that they are willing to hear, from another person, that they did something hurtful (even, perhaps especially, if they didn't mean to) and express that it's not something they want to continue doing or defend, and show that they can change their behavior.
If all they do is deny, defend, accuse the accuser, double down, and show more concern for their own standing than for another human being they may have done harm to, then odds are they will repeat the behavior and sooner or later, they'll end up banned. "Cancelled," if you will. But we have an obligation to provide a safe environment for everyone, as much as possible. What we're not going to do, is reach out to people who know them, to try and tarnish their name publicly, doxx them or "out" them at their workplace or to their families, or...anything else.
So while I defend my right to PERSONALLY decide that I don't want to spend money at Hobby Lobby or Chick Fil A, or to avoid talking to people, even my own relatives, whose views clash with my values (those arguments are pointless anyhow)...I can exercise my own agency in my own life as I please. What I do not do, is throw down these "If you are still friends with this person, then unfriend me now!" kinds of things, or threaten anyone or doxx them or go digging into the distant past to find things to criticize that I wasn't around to see or hear when it happened... Yeah, I do think that there's such a thing as going too far. And carrying a vendetta against someone past a certain point, falls into that "taking poison and hoping your enemy will die" or "letting them live rent free in your head" situation... Nah.
But as you say, JK could have saved herself all this controversy easily. She decided to double down with it, instead. Her choice. Some folks will agree and maybe like her even more, many will drop her and no longer support her career, which is their right.
Explain what you believe to be cancel culture besides being a buzzword.
If it was 1986 and the group called the American Family Association (google them) called for a boycott of a TV show for too much sex or showing homosexuality, was that "cancel culture?"
How is what folks have been doing for the longest time any different than what is being done today in 2020? New name but same actions.
Rather than comparing it to heresy laws, compare it to American traditions. This is just a new name for an American tradition starting with the boycott of British goods prior to the Revolution.
Its easy to boycott when you don't have to give something up. But whether the boycotts of the 1700's or the Montgomery bus boycott, it took stamina to stick with it and there was a personal cost involved.
Rather than comparing it to heresy laws, compare it to American traditions. This is just a new name for an American tradition starting with the boycott of British goods prior to the Revolution.
Its easy to boycott when you don't have to give something up. But whether the boycotts of the 1700's or the Montgomery bus boycott, it took stamina to stick with it and there was a personal cost involved.
That's my point exactly. Cancel culture is just another name for good old fashioned boycotting. Everyone from the left and the right have called for various boycotts. What's the problem?
That's my point exactly. Cancel culture is just another name for good old fashioned boycotting. Everyone from the left and the right have called for various boycotts. What's the problem?
I thought "cancel culture" also included getting individuals fired from their job for expressing "non PC" views (such as posting on Facebook that "all lives matter," or not buying into critical race theory, etc). That is quite different than boycotting a company.
I thought "cancel culture" also included getting individuals fired from their job for expressing "non PC" views (such as posting on Facebook that "all lives matter," or not buying into critical race theory, etc). That is quite different than boycotting a company.
No one can get anyone fired from their job. Employers have full discretion over their staffs. Just because someone says that someone should get fired doesn't mean that they will.
On a side note, if an employer has employees AND CUSTOMERS of all races and ethnicities, I'm sure you can see how potentially problematic it would be if the employer knows that a certain employee is an avowed racist or holds views that would cause the business to lose customers (and thus revenue).
Don't be naïve. Even back in the day, all boycotts came with someone losing their job. There was no social media and people kept quiet.
If you were Jewish, would you frequent a business whose employees showed swastikas on their vehicles or social media? Even if that person was on their own personal social media accounts, imagine how upsetting it would be if such a person came to your home to service your cable as an employee of Time Warner Cable?
How would you expect Time Warner Cable to respond when customers don't want employee John Doe to come into their homes?
No one can get anyone fired from their job. Employers have full discretion over their staffs. Just because someone says that someone should get fired doesn't mean that they will.
On a side note, if an employer has employees AND CUSTOMERS of all races and ethnicities, I'm sure you can see how potentially problematic it would be if the employer knows that a certain employee is an avowed racist or holds views that would cause the business to lose customers (and thus revenue).
Don't be naïve. Even back in the day, all boycotts came with someone losing their job. There was no social media and people kept quiet.
If you were Jewish, would you frequent a business whose employees showed swastikas on their vehicles or social media? Even if that person was on their own personal social media accounts, imagine how upsetting it would be if such a person came to your home to service your cable as an employee of Time Warner Cable?
How would you expect Time Warner Cable to respond when customers don't want employee John Doe to come into their homes?
YES.
Some things that drive me bananas... False equivalence between "censorship" or "violation of someone's right to Free Speech" ~and~ the loss of their job, consequences in relationships, or being blocked or banned, even, from a website or social media platform (either blocked by other users or banned entirely.)
NONE of those examples are a violation of anyone's right to free speech. Our freedom of speech means that you cannot become an enemy of the state for writing an article criticizing or satirizing the government or President or a celebrity. You cannot go to prison for your words, short of the whole "yelling fire in a crowded theater" level incitement of panic or hazard, inciting a situation where real harm is the direct and clear result, or making actual threats against someone else. THAT is your freedom of speech.
It does not guarantee you will continue to enjoy any relationship with any other person or organization no matter what you say. It does not guarantee that there will be NO consequences for your words. It does not guarantee you a platform from which to shout them. It does not force anyone to listen. And it sure as hell does not mean that everyone in the world MUST respect you, or your beliefs, no matter how repulsive or ignorant they are, no matter how you act or treat anyone else.
When it comes to jobs, I signed paperwork in my employment contract (as did my son when he got his first jobs at Taco Bell, and Walmart--so from a high paid expert job in analytics, to the most base of minimum wage part time positions)...that stated that I could be terminated if my words or actions risked making the company look bad. Even on my own time. So I know my company's values, and if I were videoed in public making racist remarks for instance...I would absolutely expect to be fired for that.
The reason this is so alarming, I think, to people who just love to get out there and tick off others, is that EVERYONE now has a video camera, and if you are behaving badly, you could be a viral sensation on the internet by the end of the day. It used to be that a-holes could be a-holes and the worst that could happen is gossip around town. Those times are long gone.
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